Let’s Get Businesslike With Federal Lands

[TX Trophy Hunter]

This thread got me to thinking a little bit. Who among us balks at paying for our federal duck stamp. I'd venture to say none. If there were a Federal Lands Access Pass requirement for access to ANY federal wildlands, that could be an incredible source of funds. Some 325,000 million visit National Parks each year. Let's just say there are another 75 million who don't visit NPs but do use refuges, national forests and BLM lands. That's 400,000,000. Sell a $20 pass that lasts for three years. Let's say 25% are under the age of 12, so no pass required. 300,000,000 x 20 is 600,000,000 or 200,000,000 per year. Is that enough to make a positive difference? Would anyone balk over $7 per year to access our national treasures?

I don’t know how the specific numbers would work out but I feel like people would need to pay more to get more days per year, and more to visit multiple Forests, BLM districts, etc. The person making a 1 week trip once per year should pay less than the person that scouts, fishes, and shed hunts every weekend. And the person who is well off enough to travel to multiple places can pay more than the person living in X western town who just wants to hike their local trails.

 

[TOGIE]

The scary part is even if you use a more reasonable figure like the 1 1/2 trillion I have heard somewhere, you could give everyone in the country better than four grand. I am thinking most people would take the money.

flipping that thinking around - it's just so sad to think about how little extra money out of the taxpayers pockets it would take to fund a top tier management regime for federal public lands the likes of which the world has never seen.

 

[TX Trophy Hunter]

living in X western town

Or eastern town, sorry I keep neglecting you Forests in Virginia, Florida, Vermont, etc.

 

[dranrab]

I don’t know how the specific numbers would work out but I feel like people would need to pay more to get more days per year, and more to visit multiple Forests, BLM districts, etc. The person making a 1 week trip once per year should pay less than the person that scouts, fishes, and shed hunts every weekend. And the person who is well off enough to travel to multiple places can pay more than the person living in X western town who just wants to hike their local trails.

Somebody smarter than me can figure it out, but there's a relatively pain-free way of bringing money into the system. I venture out west every year. I treasure those public lands. Save for making voluntary donations to the Crested Butte Mountain Bike Association, it doesn't cost me anything to enjoy the Gunnison National Forest. As a KISS kind of person, I am not sure I'd support a tiered system. As it stands now, do we get more money out of duck hunters who hunt more days per year? Just thinking out loud.

 

[NDGuy]

will make it harder for those not born with a silver spoon in hand to participate.

The ladder is being pulled up in all aspects of life every day

 

[BuzzH]

This thread got me to thinking a little bit. Who among us balks at paying for our federal duck stamp. I'd venture to say none. If there were a Federal Lands Access Pass requirement for access to ANY federal wildlands, that could be an incredible source of funds. Some 325,000 million visit National Parks each year. Let's just say there are another 75 million who don't visit NPs but do use refuges, national forests and BLM lands. That's 400,000,000. Sell a $20 pass that lasts for three years. Let's say 25% are under the age of 12, so no pass required. 300,000,000 x 20 is 600,000,000 or 200,000,000 per year. Is that enough to make a positive difference? Would anyone balk over $7 per year to access our national treasures?

Good, go take it to Congress and get it done.

Talk is cheap.

 

[TX Trophy Hunter]

Good, go take it to Congress and get it done.

Talk is cheap.

What’s the process for doing that?

 

[hank4elk]

Fraud Waste & Abuse.
92% of the fraud in Medicaid is from vendors.

Lets contract out the country.
You get a contract and stiff the customer.
The business plan.

 

[BuzzH]

What’s the process for doing that?

More than gum flapping on a hunting board.

You have to find a bill sponsor, more likely several in both the house and senate. Know a lot of people in the press, organize NGO's to rally around it and sell it to the public.

As an example, we carried multiple bills to Congress to get seasonal employees that work for land management agencies health coverage. Took 8 years of traveling to D.C. talking to Congress for a group of 10-20 people to push that through.

It would take a lot of work and $$$ from some dedicated people to make that happen.

Everyone has a good idea, until the work starts.

 

[Straight Arrow]

What’s the process for doing that?

That you ask that question is concerning.
From above: "Texas has more congressmen than NM, CO, WY, MT, ID, UT, AZ & NV combined."
Their contact info is easily accessed. Communicate with them to get one or more to sponsor a bill.

 

[TX Trophy Hunter]

You have to find a bill sponsor,

How did you go about that? Start a petition?

 

[TX Trophy Hunter]

That you ask that question is concerning.
From above: "Texas has more congressmen than NM, CO, WY, MT, ID, UT, AZ & NV combined."
Their contact info is easily accessed. Communicate with them to get one or more to sponsor a bill.

I’m being a little sarcastic. If I call a congressman they will not give a shit. If I get everyone on this forum and reach out to other stakeholders and get thousands of people to sign a petition that might carry some weight. So spreading ideas on a forum might be cheap but could be the initial steps toward change. Talk is no cheaper than cutting and pasting sob stories of people who lost their jobs last week.

 

[Straight Arrow]

What’s the process for doing that?

A couple hundred posts, but 'don't know you, so have to take your rhetoric at face value.
Sarcasm can be humorous or even make your point. In this case it seemed neither.
Thanks for clarifying. 'Sorry I wasted my time.

 

[Bonasababy]

I hate the fact that as a child growing up on the boundary of a national forest I could always go explore thousands of acres without having to pay for access, and that any family could do the same without having money be a barrier to entry, and that’s going to change. The start up costs for becoming an outfitter, grazing permit holder and everything else under my example will make it harder for those not born with a silver spoon in hand to participate.

Well Doug Burgum's in charge now. As Governor he badly wanted to dramatically increase using BLM lands for drilling, exploration and more.

He was also the impetus for a movement that is going to crash and burn IMO--trying to allow for greatly increased ethanol production from dozens of ethanol plants across the midwest more carbon neutral by pumping CO2 from them across long underground pipelines into underground storage areas.

For those not familiar, more ethanol = a need for even more corn production. More corn production continues a dramatic loss of grasslands and wetlands where many hunters and conservationists observe and hunt critters. More corn also require more fertilizer use and more use of herbicides and insecticides--so...more pollution, even fewer pollinators, and more.

Guess where the extra extraction is going to come from now, and where he plans to store carbon to try and offset that?

Some info

https://northdakotamonitor.com/2024/12/12/north-dakota-approves-co2-storage-for-summit-pipeline/

So how to move the carbon across private land to where it will be stored on public? Here;s some info on that

https://iowacapitaldispatch.com/2025/01/09/landowners-appeal-summit-carbon-storage-decision/

Under a process called amalgamation, if 60% of the landowners in a proposed storage area agree to the plan, the state can force the other 40% to comply.

 

[rjthehunter]

More than gum flapping on a hunting board.

You have to find a bill sponsor, more likely several in both the house and senate. Know a lot of people in the press, organize NGO's to rally around it and sell it to the public.

As an example, we carried multiple bills to Congress to get seasonal employees that work for land management agencies health coverage. Took 8 years of traveling to D.C. talking to Congress for a group of 10-20 people to push that through.

It would take a lot of work and $$$ from some dedicated people to make that happen.

Everyone has a good idea, until the work starts.

It's almost like organizations, or federal workers should work towards making these things happen. I wouldn't expect an individual person on a hunting forum to bear all the costs and commitments associated with it.

$600 million is a big number, and it could go a long ways in managing lands. But there's too many people who'd rather see it all be spent on DEIA training.

 

[El Jason]

But there's too many people who'd rather see it all be spent on DEIA training.

Which is now gone and no longer relevant

Next?

 

[rjthehunter]

Which is now gone and no longer relevant

Next?

Next? Well, the federal gov workers should have more time now that they aren't in training to push some of the above mentioned objectives.

 

[BuzzH]

Next? Well, the federal gov workers should have more time now that they aren't in training to push some of the above mentioned objectives.

Those are just awesome ideas, too bad you didn't put any thought into it.

It's against the law for federal employees to push legislation on government time while doing their normal jobs.

The only exception is Union Representatives can lobby Congress, which I've done for about a dozen years now.

That's the trouble, people like you are so uninformed...and at the same time so lazy, you won't do anything for yourself. Its always someone's else's job to do the heavy lifting for you.

You have the same exact ability as I do to push for a user fee for public lands, and more ability than anyone trying to do it in their official capacity as a .gov employee.

I suggest you get after it.

 

[dranrab]

More than gum flapping on a hunting board.

You have to find a bill sponsor, more likely several in both the house and senate. Know a lot of people in the press, organize NGO's to rally around it and sell it to the public.

As an example, we carried multiple bills to Congress to get seasonal employees that work for land management agencies health coverage. Took 8 years of traveling to D.C. talking to Congress for a group of 10-20 people to push that through.

It would take a lot of work and $$$ from some dedicated people to make that happen.

Everyone has a good idea, until the work starts.

I have a hunch my Congress people won't be much help. One is an empty suit, another is a career politician who is unavailable to his constituents. The other is more interested in funny zingers than getting any work done.

 

[dranrab]

Those are just awesome ideas, too bad you didn't put any thought into it.

It's against the law for federal employees to push legislation on government time while doing their normal jobs.

The only exception is Union Representatives can lobby Congress, which I've done for about a dozen years now.

That's the trouble, people like you are so uninformed...and at the same time so lazy, you won't do anything for yourself. Its always someone's else's job to do the heavy lifting for you.

You have the same exact ability as I do to push for a user fee for public lands, and more ability than anyone trying to do it in their official capacity as a .gov employee.

I suggest you get after it.

I dunno, there are plenty of government employees pushing their agenda on social media on company time. You just have to be clever about it.