Yeti GOBOX Collection

Kids in school.. Oh MY!!!

ELKCHSR

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Joined
Nov 28, 2001
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Who would have ever guessed kids are finishing collage and still can't find their butt with both hands... LOL...and heres a study to prove it... :eek: :)

Study: Most College Students Lack Skills
By BEN FELLER, AP Education Writer

WASHINGTON - Nearing a diploma, most college students cannot handle many complex but common tasks, from understanding credit card offers to comparing the cost per ounce of food.

Those are the sobering findings of a study of literacy on college campuses, the first to target the skills of students as they approach the start of their careers.

More than 50 percent of students at four-year schools and more than 75 percent at two-year colleges lacked the skills to perform complex literacy tasks.

That means they could not interpret a table about exercise and blood pressure, understand the arguments of newspaper editorials, compare credit card offers with different interest rates and annual fees or summarize results of a survey about parental involvement in school.

The results cut across three types of literacy: analyzing news stories and other prose, understanding documents and having math skills needed for checkbooks or restaurant tips.

"It is kind of disturbing that a lot of folks are graduating with a degree and they're not going to be able to do those things," said Stephane Baldi, the study's director at the American Institutes for Research, a behavioral and social science research organization.

Most students at community colleges and four-year schools showed intermediate skills, meaning they could perform moderately challenging tasks. Examples include identifying a location on a map, calculating the cost of ordering office supplies or consulting a reference guide to figure out which foods contain a particular vitamin.

There was brighter news.

Overall, the average literacy of college students is significantly higher than that of adults across the nation. Study leaders said that was encouraging but not surprising, given that the spectrum of adults includes those with much less education.

Also, compared with all adults with similar levels of education, college students had superior skills in searching and using information from texts and documents.

"But do they do well enough for a highly educated population? For a knowledge-based economy? The answer is no," said Joni Finney, vice president of the National Center for Public Policy and Higher Education, an independent and nonpartisan group.

"This sends a message that we should be monitoring this as a nation, and we don't do it," Finney said. "States have no idea about the knowledge and skills of their college graduates."

The survey examined college and university students nearing the end of their degree programs. The students did the worst on matters involving math, according to the study.

Almost 20 percent of students pursuing four-year degrees had only basic quantitative skills. For example, the students could not estimate if their car had enough gas to get to the service station. About 30 percent of two-year students had only basic math skills.

Baldi and Finney said the survey should be used as a tool. They hope state leaders, educators and university trustees will examine the rigor of courses required of all students.

The survey showed a strong relationship between analytic coursework and literacy. Students in two-year and four-year schools scored higher when they took classes that challenged them to apply theories to practical problems or weigh competing arguments.

The college survey used the same test as the National Assessment of Adult Literacy, the government's examination of English literacy among adults. The results of that study were released in December, showing about one in 20 adults is not literate in English.

On campus, the tests were given in 2003 to a representative sample of 1,827 students at public and private schools. The Pew Charitable Trusts funded the survey.

It has a margin of sampling error of plus or minus 3 percentage points.
 
I entered the American school system at 5th grade. Before that I attended schools in Central America and Europe. Even at that young age I remember being amazed at how different American schools are from those in other countries. The key difference I found was that lessons elsewhere tend to be focused on real world examples. I remember doing, for example, lessons on volcanoes which included writing reports about volcanoes, doing math problems based on temperature of magma cooling, geography on where they are located, etc. Every discipline was covered with a real world basis. Here in America it’s just learning how to do this problem so you can get it right on the test.

Unfortunately what I am seeing is schools focusing ever more on testing. My children must take about a dozen evaluations per year. I actually hear teachers saying that they have to focus almost exclusively on getting the students able to pass those tests rather than teaching them skills and information.

Don't even get me started on Geography. Informal poll from my experience - 95% of Americans do not know the difference between Switzerland and Sweden. Most don't even realize they are 2 separate countries. :rolleyes:
 
LOL you guys...

I will state this opinion about kids and collage...

By and by, the largest percentage in this country, aren't ready for the halls of higher learning right out of high school...

If a few foundation blocks for the future need to be laid out so they can have a better footing in life, as a few on here have eluded to, then teach those in high school

I'm betting a majority would never see the inside of a collage school book if required to see a little life (more than a summer between high school and collage) before entering the hallowed gates of some institution or online.

I would also bet that when these same individuals went back, they would learn more in the same time frame, and have a far greater appreciation for what they are learning.

I have met a large volume of these individuals that because of their higher learning and indoctrinations, feel or think they are higher and mightier than any one who hasn’t or wasn’t able to attend.

And those who defend the stance of kids going straight into collage, are usually those very same self centered people who close their eyes to a lot of truths that abound on this board… :)
 
Cheese,

Could you at least learn how to spell the word that is the subject of your rant??? That is funnier than Hell to watch some un-educated resident of a SuperFund site claiming they know what is wrong with the educational system.

Just because you didn't go to "collage" and were able to land a part time job using a shovel doesn't mean every kid will be so fortunate.......
 
Jose,

Maybe Russ is using the word "collage" to get you to show off what a full of yourself blow hard you are? So who's the smart one, the part time Polish backhoe opperator, or the guy that went to collage at BSU?
 
The only Art classes I ever took were Ceramics and another one in Art Appreciation 101. We didn't study collages in either class.

And I was giving him props for being able to become a part-time Polish backhoe "opperator" without any edjumacation.
 
What a gutter slug!!! :rolleyes:

Is this the best you can do guner/sybil???

Not a word of reproach on the subject matter, only pick out silly little things that have no bearing on the topic at hand as usual?

LMAO, and you say I don’t have any understanding of what’s going on, lets see your cut and paste job from some one else that states the opposite is true.

The last time I pulled your posts apart because of grammar and spelling errors the list was quite long…

So, what is your point???
 
!!!LOL...!!! Naw Greenhorn...

I have a tendency to get under a few peoples skin... ;)

Does it bother me that they do...? Not really... Actually no, well, no more so than when you get picked on... :)

We all have our own points of view and opinions, so what!!... Do my opinions affect those whose opinions are set...?

I really doubt it, does it bother the hell out of them....

I am supposing it probably does... :)

Am I concerned about their feelings???

About as much as they are concerned with mine... ;)

But thanks for being concerned, it is sincerely appreciated, and those who know me know that this is true :)
 
Greeny... OHHHh daaaaaang !!!! ;)

On the whole School issue, I'm probably the worst to ask. I think on the job training and Common sense is the best Skewlin'. :p My typing sucks, I never got good grades, and I took schooling as soemthing I had to do and Quickly got out...... (Although I do know were Switzerland and Sweeden are) and I speak Swiss, not Sweedish too ;) ).

I've always hated schools, the school system, and People that went to school for long periods of time. "Ohhh looky at me, I have a 6 year Degree" So the Frigg what ? I don't and I can Buy a Mercedies CASH !!! (So what if I don't know how to spell it Punk !! :D ) It's a Friggin Waste of my time and I'd never go back. I've had MANY a people say, Moosie, go back and get you're engineering degree.. "FOR WHAT ?" to have a piece of paper and Make less money ? WTF ? Keep ou paper on your wall and in a few years come work for me........

Of the 10 Millionair friends that I can Name off the Top of my head non of them have a big Schooling Degree. They are in Sales, Realestate, Developement, or have started their Buisness (Tile work, Carpeting, Itc.) and are smart about it. Schooling is for people that have no Self motivation. Schooling is for people that need doors opened becasue they don't know how to open them for themselves. Schooling is just what you do when you don't know what to do.

Just my .02 worth.... but What do I know, I left School after the 9th grade. MAybe there is something to it after that ........ ;)
 
Oscar, What if you want to be a physician? There's a shitload of careers that just won't happen without an advanced education. There’s just as many more that you will not get a foot in the door without a minimum of a 4-yr degree. A lot of people base careers on what they want to do, not just how much money can be made. A lot of people like yourself are movers and shakers and it doesn't matter what education they have, they are going to be successful at something. Just so you know, that is not the norm.

I'm sure you are great parent because I've seen you with kids, but WTF??
"Schooling is for people that have no Self motivation. Schooling is for people that need doors opened becasue they don't know how to open them for themselves. Schooling is just what you do when you don't know what to do.
We have a difference of opinion here.

And Elkchsr, Just my opinion, but from what I see, I doubt you ever really get under anybody's skin. Just because you're get constantly heckled and ridiculed, you probably shouldn't assume that you've bothered anybody. Keep it up though, it's damn funny.
 
I could throw out %'s and Disclaimers saying "Not counting Doctors, Lawyers and scientists" and I'm sure a handful of other jobs. But in general look at the Average job .....and by Average I mean what you and I do. (Although I still don't know exactly what you do ;) ). I hear it all the time that "You need to go to College" or you'll flip burgers. I'm calling BS on that. I know more people in college that flip burgers. :)

You're right, I am a Great parent. I'm also teaching my kids how to think for themselves. I'm teaching my kids how Money works best when Working for you. the Value of Compounding interest and investing. I'm teaching my kids to be aggressive and to go after what they want. I'm teaching my kids "REAL LIFE" skills like how to talk on the phone, how to say please and thank you and how to open doors for people and how to get up out of a Seat if you're in a bus for a lady or elderly. I teach my kids not to pull out the "We have more toys then you" card because it hurts peoples feelings (Although I like to pull that card out when in an Internet 'tisk :p). I teach my kids how to Count back proper change from a dollar without using a Calculator. I'd put my 8 year old toe to toe with most Highschoolers on that.

What I don't teach my kids is problems like "If Jane leaves Ohio that is 923 miles towards Jack at 65 MPH and Jack heads toward Jane at 79 MPH what time will they meet". Because, if you ask my oldest this question he will tell you :

1. There is an Acceleration speed which isn't mentioned.
2. Jack is Speeding so he'll probably get a ticket and take more time.
3. How much gas does each have and do they have to stop ?
4. If Jane liked Jack as much as Jack liked Jane she would be driving faster.

All questions I would ask because its common sense and I won't take a problem for face value. thats why I don't like school :)

I also teach my kids Humor and notto take things too Serious. My kids also know that if you're laughing at your own joke, and No one else is, It's not funny. they jsut reminded me that this morning at Breakfast when I said something silly and started laughing by myself. Now that was funny !!!!

Anyways, I'm sticking to my Post.............. (Except for the doctor part becasue when I need someone to stick his finger in my Hiney I hope he knows more for what he's looking for then the average man with no edji-kation :) ).
 
Oscar, Nobody said you're automatically a McDonalds fry boy if you don't go to college. A good education is important. Like anything, you get out of it what you put into it. Some courses are going to be worthless, but the full monte.. working toward and completing a degree, is great achievement. Common sense is valuable, but some careers require quite a bit more than that. I'll go as far to say that what I quoted you on is total bullshit. I think you have a chip from your shoulder about it. ;) We'll just have to agree to disagree.
 
I'm pretty much on the same page as Greenhorn on this issue. For the career path I chose, I was dead in the water without a degree. I dont care how aggressive you are, without it, you have ZERO credibility and you cant even make the minimum qualifications to apply for a job. I'm not going to argue whether or not things should be that way...the fact is they are. To get where I want(ed) to go I had to get a college degree, there was no other option. Its ridiculous to call any education, in particular college, a waste of time. Thats just pure crap.

I also agree that money alone is not the answer to a rewarding career. I enjoy being able to work in the field 6-8 months a year, do a bit of office work, and spend a month or 2 not thinking about work, but concentrating 100% on hunting, fishing, etc.

Its all about priorities, goals, and what you want out of life and a career.

I have no complaints and the $6k I earned, then gave to the University Of Montana for my forestry degree was money well spent.

For the record, I wouldnt take a job peddling real-estate or working in autocad if my salary were doubled. I just dont have any interest in either and I'd be miserable in those fields.
 
Ha Buzz.. $6K!! At least the U of M is cheap. I took some video footage last week of a bison escaping a hunter that had a U of M degree. He's older than you so he probably got an even better deal.
 
Greenhorn, I saw the pics you sent...I also saw the U of M comment. At least we can DRAW TAGS though. Thats a great bull, by the way.

I tell you whats sad, I took one class at the U of M in 1999 and it cost more than my first 2 quarters of school in 1988.
 
Pretty much agree with Buzz on this one. Although aptitude and perseverance are key to success, a degree is most often the factor that provides the doorbreaker for opportunity.

...for us mere mortals, that is. ;)
 

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