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Ithaca's answer

When I said <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Good to here,... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I meant it as a compliment. I hunt Turkeys because I get the tag in the package, same as I hunt mountain lions because the tag is in the package as well. If I had to buy the tag seperately I wouldn't spend the money. Does that clarify things? I never said that I was inconvienced by the tag, I just wouldn't buy it otherwise.

TROY, I have seen white turkeys in the flocks around here, but the local warden says that happens from time to time, and you still have to wait for a season to open and have a tag.

MARS, our quail around here (mostly) are from people buying them at the feed stores in the spring and releasing them around their place. Some have taken off and gone "wild", but a heavy winter will thin them out in short order.

I am more curious as we have had smaller flocks of forest grouse in the past (20+ years). I used to be able to find flock numbering up to 30 birds, but lately find smaller flocks of 2 - 8.

BUZZ, I don't see overgrazing were I'm at. We seldom see grazing at all around here. This isn't cattle or sheep country. I said <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Good to here,.... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> as a compliment to IThACA's accomplishments. I see them more as a BOON then a BOOM, but never the less their population sure has BOOMED.

In regard to pheassnts, chuckar, and california quail. We have few (not FEW) pheasants, and they are seen locally around the agricultural areas, and as a replacement of the forest grouse that were probably displaced by agriculture. Quail are another story, they seem to sell alot of chicks each year at the feed store.... Chuckar aren't around here at all. Turkeys on the other hand are everywhere. I find their track on the ridge tops in the deep snow country during the winter (BTW it's when I'm snowmobiling or ATV riding). <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> you are one sour, bitter SOB .... whiner <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> BUZZ, grow up.

ITHACA, for your information, the F&G shipped hundreds of birds (some times hundreds a winter) from the north to the Boise area throughout the late 80's & 90's. Where were you when the F&G traded 200 northern birds to California for 50 Rio's for southern Idaho back in 99?
I was one of the guys that stuffed birds into those turkey federation boxes for shipping them south.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Once again, you have no idea what you're talking about! I really do wish you had some credibility. It would make it more interesting to discuss things with you.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Likewise.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> One real big difference is that it's not done by restricting hunting opportunities somewhere else. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
And the panhandle was under an April 15th controlled hunt for turkeys while the rest of the state had different hunts.

How many of the 15,000 turkey hunters are those that get their tag through the sportsmans package like I do, and how many are true turkey hunters?
I will say that I'd bet there would be more turkey hunters if the tag price was lower.

BTW, the turkeys sit on the clothes line posts, and break the rose treleses when they try to sit on them. I can tell by your smart@$$ed comment, that you never had to deal with turkeys trying to live in your yard before.

To some of the old (80-90ish) people that I know around Harrison, the turkeys are a bigger problem to them then the idea of wolves are to cow farmers.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-18-2003 10:46: Message edited by: Ten Bears ]</font>
 
Ten, I was working on transplants right from 1982. We got them from wherever there was a surplus and put them into places they hadn't been transplanted yet, even if it was only five miles from another transplant. One of the ideas was to introduce different blood lines as much as possible. We also took turkeys from South Idaho and shipped them north. We got turkeys from any state we could, or any part of Idaho, and put them anywhere we thought they might flourish. I wouldn't say the northern turkeys helped out South Idaho any more than the south turkeys helped out N. Idaho. In fact, the first transplants in Idaho were from Council and went north.

Oh, I see! The turkeys weren't sitting on the clothes lines!

Well, I'm certainly sorry for all the trouble turkeys have caused by sitting places they shouldn't!
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My solution is to increase the limit and lower the tag fee, which is what I was addressing the F&G Commission about.

And before you get all excited, when the secretary takes notes at those meetings and posts them she doesn't always get everything exactly the way it's said. She condenses a five minute speech into a few lines.

Maybe you didn't see the Forest Grouse harvest lately. Weather and cycles seem to be the biggest factors. I really doubt the turkeys are having any effect, but maybe you can show us something to prove your claim from some other state. Good luck!

http://www2.state.id.us/fishgame/hunt/programsinfo/genharv/ugharv.htm

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-18-2003 11:08: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>
 
Ten, the quail population in Southern IL (ok mainly the family farm and surrounding areas) has been good for as long as I can remember. Grannies 52 acres held a minimum of three covies seems like forever, that is until about 7 (?) years ago. Just a couple of years after Turkeys were reintroduced.

Now granted, it could be coincidence that the numbes dropped (cyclic action, weather patterns etc). Farming doesn't seem to be a factor since most of the area has been farmed he same way for 20 years or more (those boys still let ground lay fallow).

Pheasants up here the same way, a couple of years after turkeys came , the pheasants declined, basically the same set-up as above except no fallow ground..

It just seems odd..
 
ITHACA, the last transplant into the panhandle came in about 1984. We have been shipping birds out every year since trapping started in the late 80's. This year there are still trapping operations moving birds out.

I see, you can complain that ATV's are effcting your bird hunting, but others can't speculate effects on their hunt. I see. please refer to yur own source for the same clarifications.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> My solution is to increase the limit and lower the tag fee, which is what I was addressing the F&G Commission about. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Funny that's just what we've been suggesting up here for the past couple of years. I'm sure you can have all the credit for it though. I mean you did speak to somebody about it.

Since forest grouse are such a minor concern to the big picture, I doubt anything has been done to study them lately, but I'll look. The last time I looked into forest grouse the studies were decades old.
 
Ten, I started recommending increasing the turkey limit about 1988. It was a real novel idea at the time, but I could see what was coming. The biologists at F&G were horrified at the idea of letting hunters shoot two spring gobblers, even though they couldn't even get ONE themselves! They acted like they thought every other hunter in Idaho would be able to get two!
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I would go as far as shooting the troublesome flocks and giving them to the senior centers, or food banks. I'm sure the F&G would really cringe at the thought of that.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Christ, you are one sour, bitter SOB. I've met very few hunters who would complain about being able to hunt turkeys each year...but I'm constantly amazed.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Now there’s the kettle calling back!!!
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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> BUZZ, grow up.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is extremely hard when some people have to many hates that take up their being!!!
To bad Buzz would open his views a little and see a little bigger picture than what he portrays on here. His own views will keep him locked into a very shallow existence and he will never get to see the picture as a whole come together...It is sad really!!!
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Apparently not, and I'm the narrow minded one remember.

Seems Elkchsr likes to fight more than he likes to pass along facts. Who would have thought that????
 
Buzz quote: I'm the narrow minded one remember
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Bravo BUZZ!!

Thats the first step in the healing process...admitting your faults!

I think you'll get that anger management problem of yours under control yet!
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Mule, have you checked yourself into the AA clinic yet?, that will be your first step to recovery. You really do need help, professional help, and I really feel sorry for alcoholics. I wish you the best on the road to recovery.

By the way, thanks for once again showing your intelligence, and twisting and contorting words and their meaning.

I realize you have a hard time with the english language.
 
Michael, yep, but I wont sit back and be attacked by mule or elkchsr. I'll give respect where its due.

And by the way I really do feel sorry for people with alcohol problems. I've been wrong for making fun of mule, alcoholism isnt funny.
 
Nobody said we couldn't disagree
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, we are just going to leave out the name calling and personal attacks.
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<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 02-19-2003 09:20: Message edited by: michaelr ]</font>
 
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>
Elkchser, Are you taking the "Challenge"? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I am drawing a blank on what "Challenge".
 
Buzz,

GOOD NEWS!!!

The AA meetings are in the same building as the ANGER Management classes.

We can carpool!
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Heck yes!!!
Ithaca could be the designated driver
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Muledeer4me could be the navigator
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Sounds like a load of monkeys
 
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