I can't believe they can't fill these positions!

[SAJ-99]

To both @SAJ-99 and @Hunting Wife Im simply saying that if someone was to go on a 4 year internship or apprenticeship that woukd also signal a level of interest and dedication meanwhile maybe making a small amd I mean small income certainly like a viable option. Only one missing out soukd be the university on there 200k.

Completely agree, but we can't live in a fantasy world we wish existed. If you cut the requirements and a warden shoots someone over a disagreement over a something stupid like shooting a duck before legal light, then that creates a potential liability for the agency. My brother looked at becoming a DNR officer in IL and learned they basically need to know all the rules a regular police officer or state trooper knows and all the game laws as well. It was a lot. Add to that the job isn't easy in any way. Simply put, the pay is too low.

I think hiring in almost any job of any type is a complete roll of the dice, even though I really only know my own experience. As I thought back to my hiring days in the corporate world, I really liked to hire ex-athletes who got their degree (a non-flexible requirement in a job like finance) while playing for the college team. In that case, I didn't care much about GPA. And any sport, didn't matter if it was golf or bowling or football. I joked that they were most easily able to handle me telling them that the report they did was crap and they had to redo it, LOL. Mostly I think they had drive and could mentally handle mutiple things at the same time. Maybe some day AI will figure out how to maximize hiring for any position.

 

[Nick87]

Completely agree, but we can't live in a fantasy world we wish existed.

What about that is a fantasy world? I'm not following?

 

[Sytes]

All that said, across the country there is a shortage of candidates in all kinds of jobs that pay a lot more than the Warden position. There is no way to make a qualified nurse, doctor, dentist, police officer, or game warden in 6 months.

Mentor and probation - ride along, "Field Training Officer" programs were very effective until upper management metrics became the norm...

 

[SAJ-99]

What about that is a fantasy world? I'm not following?

Probably didn't word that sentence very well. Basically assuming these new hires without a degree are equally as effective as those with a degree. I mean, it's a theory. But believing it and implementing it might increase risks in other ways. Proving it becomes hard. I guess my point was that change becomes its own obstacle as some point.

 

[Nick87]

Probably didn't word that sentence very well. Basically assuming these new hires without a degree are equally as effective as those with a degree. I mean, it's a theory. But believing it and implementing it might increase risks in other ways. Proving it becomes hard. I guess my point was that change becomes its own obstacle as

Yah I really do think somebody with 4 years on the job training that graduated some sort of law enforcement academy would not only be as effective they'd be more effective. I don't see the difficulty there. I'm not saying on day one of the program they're sent in with a pistol and badge to bust up a poaching ring.

 

[Bill Christy]

I reckon there's more to this story than meets the eye. As a retired NM LEA, I can attest to all the hidden pressures Game Officers are under. The positive aspects advertised sound wonderful, but the lack of pay and the relentless negative pressures' wear you down.

 

[Gellar]

Yah I really do think somebody with 4 years on the job training that graduated some sort of law enforcement academy would not only be as effective they'd be more effective. I don't see the difficulty there. I'm not saying on day one of the program they're sent in with a pistol and badge to bust up a poaching ring.

Sometimes the best person to investigate a criminal is a criminal themselves. This is obviously oversimplifying it. But keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

 

[SAJ-99]

Yah I really do think somebody with 4 years on the job training that graduated some sort of law enforcement academy would not only be as effective they'd be more effective. I don't see the difficulty there. I'm not saying on day one of the program they're sent in with a pistol and badge to bust up a poaching ring.

Agree. I read @Hunting Wife post and remind myself that the job poster knows what kind of candidate has worked best for them in the past. And then remember also that lawyers rule the world. If a lawyer sees a “ghost”, every attempt will be made to avoid it.

 

[Nick87]

Sometimes the best person to investigate a criminal is a criminal themselves. This is obviously oversimplifying it. But keep your friends close and your enemies closer.

My old man always said the same thing.

 

[FairWeather]

I work in public sector HR recruitment, and I gotta say writing a good job posting is hard. You can’t sugar coat the job, you need to lay out all of the aspects of the job, good and the bad. The biggest red flag I’m seeing is that there isn’t a salary range listed. Even if it’s upper crap, it should be listed. Like I said, best practice is to list all pertinent information, good & bad.

Frankly, though, the pay for this isn’t really all that bad, considering. In my job we’ve been perpetually hiring for the childcare center because that whole field’s pay is garbage. We get applicants with masters degrees and can’t offer them more than $20/hr. Most people quit within 2 months.

The major downside to this job that makes the pay feel too low is the 24/7 on call, no weekends or holidays, and no say in where you live. Seems like a viable job for single childless people, but that’s pretty much it.

 

[F250]

Wow !! Ok… Game Wardens in most states attend the same Police Training Academy as State, Municipal, and County LE Officers. My Academy class had a mix of all of those other Agencies. Most states have a Field Training Officer program for new recruits. I was an FTO. Our program had the recruit in training for an entire year. College degree wasn’t required when I was hired as a Warden. It is now. That’s a mistake. Lots of new recruits have a degree but absolutely no hunting or fishing experience. That’s a mistake too.

 

[TheTone]

Meanwhile we have another thread going about a baseball player signing a $700 million dollar contract to provide people entertainment. Our entire economy is messed up with regards to what we pay people providing a real service or producing tangible goods vs what we pay for people to entertain, make tech stuff and shuffle papers around

 

[Nick87]

Meanwhile we have another thread going about a baseball player signing a $700 million dollar contract to provide people entertainment. Our entire economy is messed up with regards to what we pay people providing a real service or producing tangible goods vs what we pay for people to entertain, make tech stuff and shuffle papers around

Totally agree.

 

[Gellar]

I work in public sector HR recruitment, and I gotta say writing a good job posting is hard. You can’t sugar coat the job, you need to lay out all of the aspects of the job, good and the bad. The biggest red flag I’m seeing is that there isn’t a salary range listed. Even if it’s upper crap, it should be listed. Like I said, best practice is to list all pertinent information, good & bad.

Frankly, though, the pay for this isn’t really all that bad, considering. In my job we’ve been perpetually hiring for the childcare center because that whole field’s pay is garbage. We get applicants with masters degrees and can’t offer them more than $20/hr. Most people quit within 2 months.

The major downside to this job that makes the pay feel too low is the 24/7 on call, no weekends or holidays, and no say in where you live. Seems like a viable job for single childless people, but that’s pretty much it.

There is a big big shortage in preschool and childcare workers too.

 

[FairWeather]

There is a big big shortage in preschool and childcare workers too.

I don’t blame people for not going into it when the pay isn’t there. Everyone seems to be aware of the huge value that these services provide to children and the parents, but yet try to get proper funding for those services and folks vote it down, or pressure their congressman to do so, every time.

I imagine the game warden pay issue is stemming from much the same shenanigans.

 

[Gellar]

I don’t blame people for not going into it when the pay isn’t there. Everyone seems to be aware of the huge value that these services provide to children and the parents, but yet try to get proper funding for those services and folks vote it down, or pressure their congressman to do so, every time.

I imagine the game warden pay issue is stemming from much the same shenanigans.

I know this story first hand. Long story short, but our county supervisors had an opportunity to give $32,000 of ARPA funds to childcare services in the county to leverage an additional $96k from the state to be used for child services. Our supervisors voted it down.

 

[midwesterncrosshair]

I’ve been reading the teacher comments. All o know is the shortage is real in the state of IL and will get worse. They made a law that enables people with class related experience to jobs get a teachers license. I got certified for being a shop teacher this summer to help with the shortage. I got offered a job and had to turn it down due to insurance going to cost me half of my $40,000 salary. Not bad insurance cost of if you don’t have a family.

https://www.sid5.com/uploads/Insurance/Rates%20as%20of%20Oct%201%202022.pdf

Oh well. I’m starting a plumbing apprenticeship in the beginning of 2024. Good insurance and no shortage of work.

 

[Dinkshooter]

Free housing is a trap no one should get into or consider a great benefit. There is hardly a way for you to save enough money to keep up with housing appreciation in most markets. In the end your over all possible wealth will take a huge hit by missing out on appreciation, even in a slow real estate area. Stipend-yes. Free housing-no.

 

[Sytes]

A stipend is basically a salary increase.
Maybe it's not taxable? Well, the employer does not deduct the taxes sooo... As an individual?

Agree though, real estate is the gift that definitely gives, if held on long enough... Or we instigate China to release another COVID deal?

 

[Gus Chiggins]

Meanwhile we have another thread going about a baseball player signing a $700 million dollar contract to provide people entertainment. Our entire economy is messed up with regards to what we pay people providing a real service or producing tangible goods vs what we pay for people to entertain, make tech stuff and shuffle papers around

We like to consume "stuff" more than we like to conserve (resources)