GSP Training

[WV Hunter]

Ok bird doggers, I need some help or advice. I have a GSP pup that is almost 15 weeks. He is doing good with basic commands (sit and stay). He will only go into his kennel if I use a treat to get him in there. I probably could use more time training this. He still pee's on the floor 1 or 2 times a day although I take him out all the time. Not sure where the extra pee is coming from but I'd like to choke him for doing it. I bring him to work with me everyday so he gets plenty of socializing time. I try to walk him at least a mile or so everyday and plan to take him on my jogs when he gets better on the leash. Any tips to keep from either dragging him or keep him from trying to drag me? The dragging part could be a major problem once he gets bigger.

Any way, I 'd really like to train him for birds. I've read a few books and watched a few videos but I'm not really sure at what ages I should be doing things. One book I read seemed to say the pup should just do his own thing and to take him out in the field the first year to develop his drive. There aren't much places to go around close for birds. I have access to a couple 100 acres, mostly hills covered in woods. Should I buy some quail and plant them and see what happens? I bought a few quail feathers and we play in the yard. He wants to eat them when he catches them so I have to be careful.

I guess my question is for the experienced dog trainers and hunters on here, what should I be doing and what should I expect from him? I know, a pretty broad question but I've never had a dog I planned to hunt with.

 

[putm2sleep]

Obedience ! You tell him where, when to go and for how long. Use your walks to get to training spot - when on the walk, use a short lead, keep the end of the colar in front of his nose. If he wants to drag. use a choker, keep him at heel ie by your side off your knee. OR - a nicer way might be to let him carry the dummy so he knows he is going to train, and you mean bidness. Work walking and obedience - basic stuff. He needs to get this down like sit and stay, should do whatever you tell him, when you command. Get to where you do not need a leash.
Get a whistle. Saves the voice.
Keep commands simple - do not confuse - 15 weeks. KISS! keep it simple sam.
The peeing is him getting bad attention maybe. Kick his ass for that. Is it a male>?
Might have been your fault though - was he sitting by the door and you missed seeing him?
Training for upland or field trials? or a good hunting pup?
Live birds are always good. And acess to acres is too!

Excpect different things from different breeds. GSP guys should be of some insight here. I thought someone else got a new GSP on here and seemed to be quite the trainer?!

Good luck WV! Have fun!

 

[Topgun 30-06]

"The peeing is him getting bad attention maybe. Kick his ass for that. Is it a male>?"

***Don't know what you mean by that response, but you don't beat a dog, especially a 15 week old pup, to train them to do or not do anything!!! The commands NO or STOP when done properly immediately when something happens and not after the fact, then immediately taking him out to do his thing and rewarding him with lots of praise (maybe a treat once in a while, but not on a regular basis to get them to do something) is how to train him. I use the words GO , HERE, and STOP, rather than NO so there is no confusion using two short words that sound alike. A dog is also never too old to learn knew things as my 10 year old DD was 8 years old before I started using a whistle and several hand commands. Before that it was all verbal and I wish I had used the whistle when he was young because it's much easier. One blow of the whistle is now his command to stop whatever he's doing and come to me. Several toots on it is for him to look back and go where I point as I say OVER. Hercules (Herc) didn't grow his long wiry facial hair like most DDs and looks just like a straight GSP. I just got back from ND a couple weeks ago and my buddy and I got 23 of our 24 birds that we could legally possess in less than five full days of hunting on heavily hunted public land. Guys with flushing dogs weren't having near the success that we had. If you've never hunted behind a good pointer, you're in for a real treat when your pup matures. One final thing is to let him be a pup, don't force things on him too fast, and don't spend too much time at any one timebecasue his attention span is only so long and it's better to go in short training periods to keep his interest.

 

[smarandr]

I not ashamed to admit that training a dog required more time and patience than I could give to the pup; as much as a I wanted to to it myself, I just couldn't. So, I sent her away when she was about 8 months old for three months to get all learned up on being a bird dog and it's some of the best money I've ever spent--wouldn't hesitate to do it again.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Keep doing the treats for kenneling. I am still doing it at 6 months for my GWP, although he will usually go in on command. I have found it best to use lots of treats for any command training. Right now, Henry has been taught to

1) Come
2) Sit (which means keep your butt parked until released)
3) Kennel
4) Out (of the kitchen)

The housebreaking is probably you. Take him out everytime he:

1) wakes up
2) gets done playing
3) drinks
4) eats

Based on a normal puppy, this may be about every 15 minutes sometimes. My pup housebroke very easily.

Use a pinch collar and a long lead (6 foot or so). Pop him with the leash if he puts ANY tension on it at all. I despise a dog that lunges against the leash and won't tolerate it. They should lead so easily that my 7 year old daughter can walk him without issue.

Play fetch with him so that it is fun. If he won't fetch, put the ball away. Start out in a very confined area where he can't play grab ass and run in circles. Praise him immensely when he brings the ball or bumper to you, pet him, scratch his ears, and let him hold it. Then, take it and throw it again. The light went on about a month ago for Henry, now he is a psychotic retrieving machine. Prior to that he was the complete opposite.

When you take him out hunting this year, which you should, let it be fun. Use a check cord if you feel the need. Let him run, explore, eat deer shit, chase tweety birds, and so on. Do not expect anything of him. He will flush lots of birds. Don't get in the habit of shooting birds that he flushes, or you'll have a 300 yard flusher on your hands.

My pup, Henry, has finally started pointing birds in the last month. He is still flushing some, but I can see the pieces of the puzzle starting to come together. I have been hunting him every week since early October, 2x a week when I can.

At this age, you should try and expose your dog to as many different things as you can. It will pay off down the road. Plant some quail if you need to, but wild birds are better because he can't catch them.

I have been using Chuck Johnson's book, Training the Versatile Dog.

Good luck.

 

[WV Hunter]

Obedience ! You tell him where, when to go and for how long. Use your walks to get to training spot - when on the walk, use a short lead, keep the end of the colar in front of his nose. If he wants to drag. use a choker, keep him at heel ie by your side off your knee. OR - a nicer way might be to let him carry the dummy so he knows he is going to train, and you mean bidness. Work walking and obedience - basic stuff. He needs to get this down like sit and stay, should do whatever you tell him, when you command. Get to where you do not need a leash.
Get a whistle. Saves the voice.
Keep commands simple - do not confuse - 15 weeks. KISS! keep it simple sam.
The peeing is him getting bad attention maybe. Kick his ass for that. Is it a male>?
Might have been your fault though - was he sitting by the door and you missed seeing him?
Training for upland or field trials? or a good hunting pup?
Live birds are always good. And acess to acres is too!

Excpect different things from different breeds. GSP guys should be of some insight here. I thought someone else got a new GSP on here and seemed to be quite the trainer?!

Good luck WV! Have fun!

It's a male. And I have to admit I have smacked him on the ass a time or two for pee'n in the house. I've literally took him outside and the little wuss shakes cause it's cold or doesn't want to get wet so he comes back to the door and cries. I let him in and he pee's. I could choke him

 

[WV Hunter]

"The peeing is him getting bad attention maybe. Kick his ass for that. Is it a male>?"

***Don't know what you mean by that response, but you don't beat a dog, especially a 15 week old pup, to train them to do or not do anything!!! The commands NO or STOP when done properly immediately when something happens and not after the fact, then immediately taking him out to do his thing and rewarding him with lots of praise (maybe a treat once in a while, but not on a regular basis to get them to do something) is how to train him. I use the words GO , HERE, and STOP, rather than NO so there is no confusion using two short words that sound alike. A dog is also never too old to learn knew things as my 10 year old DD was 8 years old before I started using a whistle and several hand commands. Before that it was all verbal and I wish I had used the whistle when he was young because it's much easier. One blow of the whistle is now his command to stop whatever he's doing and come to me. Several toots on it is for him to look back and go where I point as I say OVER. Hercules (Herc) didn't grow his long wiry facial hair like most DDs and looks just like a straight GSP. I just got back from ND a couple weeks ago and my buddy and I got 23 of our 24 birds that we could legally possess in less than five full days of hunting on heavily hunted public land. Guys with flushing dogs weren't having near the success that we had. If you've never hunted behind a good pointer, you're in for a real treat when your pup matures. One final thing is to let him be a pup, don't force things on him too fast, and don't spend too much time at any one timebecasue his attention span is only so long and it's better to go in short training periods to keep his interest.

Good looking dog. And it sounds like I don't have to be in a big hurry so I probably shouldn't worry to much about progress for awhile.

The only time I've hunted behind dogs were for rabbits (beagles) and bear (curs).

I hope he his some drive so I can hunt with him.

 

[putm2sleep]

Yep, thought someone had started a up - it was JLS.
Great photo.

Good luck WV, and good hunting fellas!

 

[WV Hunter]

I not ashamed to admit that training a dog required more time and patience than I could give to the pup; as much as a I wanted to to it myself, I just couldn't. So, I sent her away when she was about 8 months old for three months to get all learned up on being a bird dog and it's some of the best money I've ever spent--wouldn't hesitate to do it again.

I certainly can understand this and if good trainers were remotely close I would consider this. There is a chapter of the NAVDHA a couple of hours away and I've had thoughts of joining them. Just another thing that would take up my time a couple of days a month though.

 

[putm2sleep]

Start a chapter where you are at. You can do it!

 

[WV Hunter]

Keep doing the treats for kenneling. I am still doing it at 6 months for my GWP, although he will usually go in on command. I have found it best to use lots of treats for any command training. Right now, Henry has been taught to

1) Come
2) Sit (which means keep your butt parked until released)
3) Kennel
4) Out (of the kitchen)

The housebreaking is probably you. Take him out everytime he:

1) wakes up
2) gets done playing
3) drinks
4) eats

Based on a normal puppy, this may be about every 15 minutes sometimes. My pup housebroke very easily.

Use a pinch collar and a long lead (6 foot or so). Pop him with the leash if he puts ANY tension on it at all. I despise a dog that lunges against the leash and won't tolerate it. They should lead so easily that my 7 year old daughter can walk him without issue.

Play fetch with him so that it is fun. If he won't fetch, put the ball away. Start out in a very confined area where he can't play grab ass and run in circles. Praise him immensely when he brings the ball or bumper to you, pet him, scratch his ears, and let him hold it. Then, take it and throw it again. The light went on about a month ago for Henry, now he is a psychotic retrieving machine. Prior to that he was the complete opposite.

When you take him out hunting this year, which you should, let it be fun. Use a check cord if you feel the need. Let him run, explore, eat deer shit, chase tweety birds, and so on. Do not expect anything of him. He will flush lots of birds. Don't get in the habit of shooting birds that he flushes, or you'll have a 300 yard flusher on your hands.

My pup, Henry, has finally started pointing birds in the last month. He is still flushing some, but I can see the pieces of the puzzle starting to come together. I have been hunting him every week since early October, 2x a week when I can.

At this age, you should try and expose your dog to as many different things as you can. It will pay off down the road. Plant some quail if you need to, but wild birds are better because he can't catch them.

I have been using Chuck Johnson's book, Training the Versatile Dog.

Good luck.

Thanks for posting. Great looking dog.

I feel like I take him out every 30 minutes. Here at the office just yesterday I took him out, he pee'd good, came back in and he played for 5 minutes and proceeded to take a leak right in front of me. I took him back out and he pee'd a few more drops.

He will come when I yell or whistle for him. He will sit on command and 90% of the time will stay until I lower my hand like I have a treat for him. He has been pretty rough when it is our dinner time and has to be pulled down off of us or he wants to stand with his paws on the table. He goes crazy when food is out. Sometimes I wonder if I am feeding him enough. He gets about 1 1/4 cup twice a day. He is very skinny and woofs the food down until he pretty much chokes on it.

As far as the leash goes, sometimes I give it a big jerk, he slows his pace and I give him a praise and then he immediately goes back to full tension. Some days he does good and I only have to do it a couple of times, other days it's a constant battle. Walking him can be frustrating.

He plays fetch pretty good. He always brings it right back but doesn't necessarily give it up easy. He likes to play tug with the bumper and clamps down on balls.

Here is a recent shot of the culprit:

 

[Deleted member 20812]

I can sum all of this up pretty easily for you.

He's a puppy

Be consistent and be patient. Remember, the drive and persistence you are cussing right now you will be praising him for in the field.

I've found winter to be a very difficult time to house break dogs. Would you want to pee outside, or inside where it's warm?

 

[WV Hunter]

I can sum all of this up pretty easily for you.

He's a puppy

Be consistent and be patient. Remember, the drive and persistence you are cussing right now you will be praising him for in the field.

I've found winter to be a very difficult time to house break dogs. Would you want to pee outside, or inside where it's warm?

I love to pee outside - No WV jokes

I appreciate my kids much more with a puppy in the house. They've been a pleasure to raise compared to him hahaha

 

[fowladdict]

Keep doing the treats for kenneling.

I was going to say the opposite. Stop with the treats for kenneling. From the time I brought my GWP pup home he slept in the kennel no matter how loud he cried. I never once used a treat to get him in his kennel. I want his kennel to be a place that he feels comfortable and secure, not a place he goes to please me or earn a reward. I only used treats while teaching him the basic commands. At 20 months old he still sleeps in his kennel and goes right into it as soon as I say kennel. Sometimes when he is in the house he runs into the laundry room and plops down in the kennel on his own terms. He also learned that the kennel in the back of the truck means he is going somewhere (likely hunting) and is overly anxious to get into the kennel. AND most importantly...a punishment NEVER included a trip to his kennel.

As far as peeing in the house goes, I was lucky that he only peed a couple of times before he learned peeing outside was where its at. Treats did the trick on that one for me and eventually he didn't need the reward for peeing and pooping outside anymore. I would suggest you keep rewarding him when he pees outside and hopefully eventually he will quit peeing in the house before you have to replace the carpet.

Good luck!

 

[WV Hunter]

I was going to say the opposite. Stop with the treats for kenneling. From the time I brought my GWP pup home he slept in the kennel no matter how loud he cried. I never once used a treat to get him in his kennel. I want his kennel to be a place that he feels comfortable and secure, not a place he goes to please me or earn a reward. I only used treats while teaching him the basic commands. At 20 months old he still sleeps in his kennel and goes right into it as soon as I say kennel. Sometimes when he is in the house he runs into the laundry room and plops down in the kennel on his own terms. He also learned that the kennel in the back of the truck means he is going somewhere (likely hunting) and is overly anxious to get into the kennel. AND most importantly...a punishment NEVER included a trip to his kennel.

As far as peeing in the house goes, I was lucky that he only peed a couple of times before he learned peeing outside was where its at. Treats did the trick on that one for me and eventually he didn't need the reward for peeing and pooping outside anymore. I would suggest you keep rewarding him when he pees outside and hopefully eventually he will quit peeing in the house before you have to replace the carpet.

Good luck!

I never let him out of the kennel for crying and in the last few nights he has quit crying and just lays down. I put him in there every night. He has no problem going into the kennel to come to work with me, although I do have to lift him up to get to the kennel in the truck and he has no where to go but in. So far I can't just say kennel I have to lead him there. Luckily he has always pooped outside.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

I think given the age, treats are appropriate. You can put him in front of his kennel and use a pinch on his neck and leg to move him into the kennel as you give a command. Then give him a treat afterwards. As the pup gets older, make the treats random.

Henry has slept in his kennel from day 1. I slept on the floor (kind of) with a squirt bottle for about a week until he quit whining and howling at 2 AM. Now, he'll go in on his own at night when he's tired.

 

[fowladdict]

I think given the age, treats are appropriate. You can put him in front of his kennel and use a pinch on his neck and leg to move him into the kennel as you give a command. Then give him a treat afterwards. As the pup gets older, make the treats random.

Henry has slept in his kennel from day 1. I slept on the floor (kind of) with a squirt bottle for about a week until he quit whining and howling at 2 AM. Now, he'll go in on his own at night when he's tired.

I think every pup is different and we all find what works best for us. Heck the wife and I are "training" all four of our kids differently. One command might work for one kid, but doesn't always work for the other kid.

Good looking dog BTW JLS, after being around nothing but labs most of my life and discovering chukar hunting a few years ago, I got a GWP and couldn't be happier. Probably will get another lab someday after my 13-yo lab ends up in duck hunting heaven.

 

[birddog32]

Obedience and birds, birds, birds. Back in the day I used a Wag-Ag bird launcher and hundreds of barn pigeons. Luckily the Mennonite kids were willing to catch and sell me them for $1 a piece. Decide if you want him steady to wing, or steady to wing and shot and stay the course. The whoa or stop or whatever word you want to use is probably the most important command you can teach. Make a training table so the dog is level with you makes it easier. I progressed to making dog stand on a 500 gal plastic barrel laid sideways. With that command you can stop him on birds, stop him from running into a road, etc. Take him to an obedience class. By the end of the class your pup will be in a line of dogs, will be told to sit and stay or down and stay and you'll be able to walk out of sight, return, and find him doing just what you told him. Good luck, love the versatile breeds. They mature so fast.

 

[pointingdogsrule]

Lots of great responses. On the urinating after he comes back in: 1. he is a puppy. 2. Kennel him after coming back in..... they usually will not urinate in the kennel where they are staying. 3.My GSP's love to go outside so I ask then "gotta pee" and it's a race to the door. Once outside with the dogs I will say "go pee".... especially if it's raining. Once they do their business they are both patted on the head and praised.

Looks like your training is progressing very well. Enforce those commands everyday and they will learn very quickly. One of my most important commands, besides "come" is the "whoa" command. If the dog is on point and then creeping towards the bird you will want to "whoa" the dog. (stop the creeping as young dogs will do). Use you leash or a "whoa rope" as seen below, to get him to "whoa". In two days you will have him steady using this technique. (or the 55 gallon drum as stated above)

I agree, get some birds so he is familiar with the birds. A bird wing on the end of a fishing pole works great. Play with the wing and get his attention. Eventually he will start to point and then you can start to "whoa" him on the wing. Great starting technique and it's fun for the pup. (and you don't have to buy lots of birds). Only do this once per day for a short time so that he doesn't tire of the game.

Last, I have no problem with treats if they increase the learning process.

god luck to all
the dog

 

[stillkickin]

I have used this book for over 25 years and 4 dogs with great results:

http://www.amazon.com/The-training-care-versatile-hunting/dp/0966565614

Good luck!