Ethics question

[VikingsGuy]

Ethics aside, if you are calling elk in season don't forget your blaze orange. Guys have been known to shoot blind into woods with rustling and game sounds.

 

[Deleted member 28227]

It is banned in Yellowstone National Park, likely elsewhere also.

I know for a fact it's legal in other parks.

 

[jtm307]

Eeesh. I don't know...potentially ruining someone's hunt in an OTC unit would be bad enough, but ruining someone's hunt who has waited 20+ years to draw that tag?

I'd rather be in the woods with as few elk hunters to disrupt as possible than be concerned about fewer hunters with expectations inflated by Eastman's. Grouse hunters are far more disruptive for elk hunters and no one questions the ethics of targeting grouse with a shotgun and an amped up canine in September.

 

[azelkhntr]

Why don't you find a hunting partner, who does have a tag, and try and call in bulls for them? You are going to want someone to return the favor for you someday....

Yeah find an elk camp to join. I'm sure someone would love to have a dedicated caller in camp. I know I would and you'll get to experience an elk hunt. Hell I'd buy all your beer and feed ya too! I wouldn't go into the woods and just call during the rut tho. That's gonna make you as popular as Covid-19. Also you can be charged for the felony Federal Crime of interfering with a lawful hunt and that's really going to hurt. If you survive that is.

 

[LuketheDog]

There was a bull elk at the zoo Pueblo when we lived there, I'd take my daughter and chirp at him a bit and he'd come right up to the fence 3-4' away and rake the wire and the dirt, she thought it was awesome. He was extremely vocal and I learned a lot from him. I did most of my elk calling practice while in the car though, when my wife wasn't with me...

 

[Ben Long]

It varies by state, but there are units that are closed to all hunting in the rut. I see no reason why not to bugle there. It is illegal to use animal calls in Glacier and Yellowstone national parks, where I have experience. That said, I have spent a lot of September days in both parks and learned a ton about elk behavior i never would have seen on hunted ground, even without a call. I would be reluctant to bugle where there are other hunters pursuing elk, only because I would not want to mess up some other fellow's good time. It would be legal, but I just don't like that kind of needless conflict.

 

[Danders134]

Eeesh. I don't know...potentially ruining someone's hunt in an OTC unit would be bad enough, but ruining someone's hunt who has waited 20+ years to draw that tag?

It's a tricky question. Personally, I try to stay out of the woods during hunting seasons if I'm not actively hunting. I like the idea of going to National Parks or anywhere hunting is not allowed.

Another option would be to go out with someone who is actively hunting. That way you can pick up other tips and help with other logistics (packing, gutting, etc).

Definitely!! My son drew a once in a lifetime permit and had as many people calling with video cameras as actual bowhunters. Wonder how they would have felt if they were finally holding the tag.

 

[jtm307]

My son drew a once in a lifetime permit and had as many people calling with video cameras as actual bowhunters.

Interesting. I had no idea there would ever be that many non-hunting elk callers in an area.

 

[azelkhntr]

Interesting. I had no idea there would ever be that many non-hunting elk callers in an area.

Lots of antis are out there doing that crap and worse. I've seen it first hand. If they aren't hunting then they're interfering with a lawful hunt and you should call the sheriff ASAP and detain them. If its on Fed land its a fed felony and they need to be arrested and charged. Then you follow up with a civil suit for damages and loss. If it happens in the bc well; cie la vie.

 

[Danders134]

Interesting. I had no idea there would ever be that many non-hunting elk callers in an area.

Not necessarily non-hunters, you can still hunt cows and spikes at the same time. They still like to be able to say they called in a bull, whether they could shoot it or not. The spikes in this area are very easy to call in also, I had one within 30 yds for almost an hour as my son was sneaking in on a 6pt, even when I moved with the bull he never would leave. Could of shot him a dozen times.

 

[Gerald Martin]

As was mentioned before, joining up with someone who has a tag can be great.

However, if you are wanting to learn how to elk hunt this time without a tag can be invaluable for your future success. Go into the area you want to hunt in the future and learn where the elk are spending time when they rut. They are usually there for a reason and will be there next year.

You don’t have to call an elk within shooting range and spook him to interact and talk with him. Location bugles and listening to responses is a great way to get an idea of how many bulls there are and how they use the area.
Hunt some small game (if legal) or a bear at the same time.

One thing about not having a tag is it lets you be mobile and not tied to one area chasing after every chance to shoot an elk. Sometimes you can find a hotspot, sometimes you learn that you better chase every elk you see evidence of.

Knowledge of an area and how elk use it is the number one asset in killing a bull. The calling part is pretty easy actually.

 

[LuketheDog]

Lots of antis are out there doing that crap and worse. I've seen it first hand. If they aren't hunting then they're interfering with a lawful hunt and you should call the sheriff ASAP and detain them. If its on Fed land its a fed felony and they need to be arrested and charged. Then you follow up with a civil suit for damages and loss. If it happens in the bc well; cie la vie.

Call the game warden, it's a misdemeanor here in Colorado...
https://cpw.state.co.us/thingstodo/Pages/HunterHarassment.aspx

 

[azelkhntr]

Call the game warden, it's a misdemeanor here in Colorado...
https://cpw.state.co.us/thingstodo/Pages/HunterHarassment.aspx

Not if it happens on Federal Land.

 

[bluespruce]

I don't know. .. Calling in elk while not hunting runs a bit too close to wildlife harassment and potentially hunter harassment for my taste.

 

[Wildabeest]

Not if it happens on Federal Land.

Found out the hard way that laws change on Fed land. Was cruising from West Yellowstone to Bozeman and there’s a section that goes through the edge of YNP and the speed limit drops to 55. Park ranger tagged me going 70. Wrote me a ticket for 65 (he was a really nice guy). Turns out that ticket is a class 3 federal misdemeanor vs a traffic violation. So I now have a federal criminal record to add to my long list of accomplishments in life... . Federal law has no provisions for traffic violations, and the federal courts / attorneys don’t play the games the local courts do with negotiating tickets down to non-moving violations, forgiving if you go to safe driver school, prayer for judgment, etc. if they write you a ticket, you’re only real option is to pay it and hope your next employer doesn’t make a big deal about it when it comes up on your background check. Or better yet, don’t speed on federal land!

 

[2rocky]

Don't get caught calling the Tule Elk in Point Reyes National Seashore, or picking up sheds...That is true for any NPS park.

I would say it is more of a poor etiquette issue calling elk where you might interfere with someone's hunt. Potentially educating elk calling from the car/ road etc.

Want to practice locating bugles, do it after dark.

More than once I've had a cow call with me hunting deer, and coaxed a bull into camera range.

You can do it in a low impact manner to reinforce your self confidence that you can do it when it is a real critter answering. Then folks will start asking you to call for them...

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Also you can be charged for the felony Federal Crime of interfering with a lawful hunt and that's really going to hurt.

Not for simply elk calling you won't.

 

[Deleted member 20812]

Want to practice locating bugles, do it after dark.

This is great advice, and if there happens to be a full or near full moon, it can be a real hoot to watch elk in the night.

OP, don't get too hung up on calling. The worst sounding bugle I ever heard came from a six point bull. Your set up is far more important than calling quality.

Echoing @Gerald Martin, there is a lot of value in just listening to elk too.

 

[LuketheDog]

Not if it happens on Federal Land.

Weird, I don't see that in the statute...

33-6-115.5. Hunting, trapping, and fishing - intentional interference with lawful activities
(1) No person shall willfully prevent or interfere with the lawful participation of any individual in the activity of hunting, trapping, or fishing in accordance with this article.
(2) A person commits intentional interference with lawful hunting, trapping, and fishing activities if he:
(a) Acts with intent to alarm, distract, or frighten prey and causes prey to flee by:
(I) Use of any natural or artificial source of noise or light;
(II) Giving chase to prey on foot or by use of any vehicle;
(III) Throwing objects or making movements;
(b) Intentionally harasses any person lawfully participating in the activity of hunting, trapping, and fishing by use of threats or actions;
(c) Erects barriers with the intent to deny ingress to lawfully designated hunting, trapping, and fishing areas;
(d) Intentionally interjects himself into the line of fire;
(e) Engages in any other conduct with the intent to disrupt or prevent lawful hunting, trapping, and fishing activities.
(3) Any person who violates this section commits a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, shall be punished by a fine of not less than five hundred dollars nor more than one thousand dollars and an assessment of twenty license suspension points.
(4) Any person convicted of a violation of this section shall be liable for all damages incurred by the individual whose lawful activity was obstructed and for all court costs of prosecution.
(5) Nothing in this section shall limit the actions of law enforcement officers and personnel of the division of parks and wildlife in the performance of their official duties nor apply to landowners, tenants, or leaseholders exercising their legal rights to the enjoyment of land, including, but not limited to, farming, ranching, and restricting trespass, nor will anything in this section be construed to prohibit any incidental interference arising from the lawful use of land or water.

 

[madtom]

Found out the hard way that laws change on Fed land. Was cruising from West Yellowstone to Bozeman and there’s a section that goes through the edge of YNP and the speed limit drops to 55. Park ranger tagged me going 70. Wrote me a ticket for 65 (he was a really nice guy). Turns out that ticket is a class 3 federal misdemeanor vs a traffic violation. So I now have a federal criminal record to add to my long list of accomplishments in life... . Federal law has no provisions for traffic violations, and the federal courts / attorneys don’t play the games the local courts do with negotiating tickets down to non-moving violations, forgiving if you go to safe driver school, prayer for judgment, etc. if they write you a ticket, you’re only real option is to pay it and hope your next employer doesn’t make a big deal about it when it comes up on your background check. Or better yet, don’t speed on federal land!

So speeding in national park “federal land” is different than speeding on a highway through BLM or USFS “federal land?” Seems odd, but there’s plenty I don’t know about the world.