Brittney freed for a major Russian arms dealer. I can sleep now

[Nick87]

I don't disagree at all. Personally I kinda hoped she's stay there, but only because it would be nice to have a reminder that the US isn't all that bad, and maybe we shouldn't bash it all the time... but that's using her as a pawn for a larger purpose, which isn't any more fair (fairer?) to her than her decade long sentence for weed.

I just think that not knowing any better sure opens a lot of doors...like I said I could care less what happens to her

 

[Duck-Slayer]

victor bout AKA merchant of death sold and traded arms that were used to kill Americans, was traded for a basketball player that refused to stand for the National Anthem !!!! HMmmm

This!
Matt

 

[BucksnDucks]

1.
Would you kiss your wife?
Have sex with your GF (if not married yet) at a beach resort?
Have the wherewithal to know your pack of big red gum is illegal?

2.
There is at least some doubt that both either Griner or Whelan did anything, given the Russian system and their positions it's possible both were set up and/or coerced to confess. So in fact they might be totally innocent.

3.
Probably most important fact here... these are all considered by the US government as wrongful detentions/hostages/political prisoners', there are thousands of US citizens who are in foreign jails for legitimate crimes that we don't try to bring back.

1. Just like Brittany, I would if I believed I was so arrogant and such a big deal I would not be caught/prosecuted.
2.Okay, so now the hash oil was planted? Did that also include her "prescription"
3. not sure what you mean by "these all"? Just Brittany and Whelan or all the ones we don't try to bring back?
Bring them all back I agree. The fact I see most important is this athlete was so ignorant, arrogant, are just naive that she traveled with hash to Russia. Or maybe it was a set up... doubtful but possible.

 

[gouch]

I've been around awhile and seen quite a few prisoner exchanges. This is the first one where I have seen Americans complaining about an American being released though. The fact that she is a black lesbian with strong opinions on racial inequality in America wouldn't have anything to do with it. Would It? Usually these exchanges are for spies, who of course aren't really spies, just tourists wrongfully detained for political reasons. In this case it would seem to be just two prisoners of no real value to the governments involved other than short term political image type stuff. The Russians must feel that Whalen has some real value to the US. It is suspected that he was arrested in order to exchange him for a Russian spy who we just ended up giving back to Russia for free, so I imagine they plan on keeping him until we have someone of value to them to trade for. He probably is a spy. I am closely related to someone who worked for many years for the CIA, and I know that most spies don't seem like people who could possibly be spies.

 

[Duck-Slayer]

So imo which doesn’t mean much, anti-Americans should be left outside America ……. And criminals should be left in jail till there term is up….
Matt

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

1. Just like Brittany, I would if I believed I was so arrogant and such a big deal I would not be caught/prosecuted.
2.Okay, so now the hash oil was planted? Did that also include her "prescription"
3. not sure what you mean by "these all"? Just Brittany and Whelan or all the ones we don't try to bring back?
Bring them all back I agree. The fact I see most important is this athlete was so ignorant, arrogant, are just naive that she traveled with hash to Russia. Or maybe it was a set up... doubtful but possible.

My apologies I was using specifics and generalities interchangeably and that was confusing.

Generally I think there are folks that have been held by other countries for political reasons https://www.reuters.com/world/who-are-americans-held-captive-abroad-2022-07-28/

Each case is different and nuanced.

Russia's justice system is very different than our own, and I think it's office the Russian government put it's finger on the justice system in order to create a political hostage.

Whelan maybe the same, maybe a spy, maybe an independent spy as @Beignet alluded to in his post.

But the general idea is that their situation isn't really about what crimes they did or did not commit.

 

[Zach]

Dunno, man. As a kid one of the neighbors duped me into trading him a cool Ozzie Smith card for some piece of crap card he had. I'm still pretty sore about that.

Wasn't a Gary Templeton card was it....

 

[FI460]

But the general idea is that their situation isn't really about what crimes they did or did not commit.

As well:

Watch out for the Russian trap behind Brittney Griner's release

The US basketball star imprisoned in Russia was released in a prisoner swap for notorious arms dealer Viktor Bout

qz.com

Folks are acting like it was binary between Whelan and Griner. More likely it was designed by Russia for Americans to do exactly what we're doing here.

 

[Bullbrl]

yup.

If she was a 5' 10", blond haired, and married to country singer this would be a different conversation.

Someone married to a country star would stand up for the National Anthem

 

[Bullbrl]

I don't completely agree. The price that was going to be paid was way beyond the crime. My humble opinion was that Russia gambled that a target of value could be traded for their target of value. Them Ruskies ain't dumb.

Yep, and what message does that send for any American overseas?

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

This is the first one where I have seen Americans complaining about an American being released though.

IMHO it has more to do about which administration is doing the negotiations rather than the person... cause you know politics...

Bowe Bergdahl
Otto Frederick Warmbier
Trevor Reed

 

[BackofBeyond]

Someone married to a country star would stand up for the National Anthem

a song symbolizing a country who guarantees all citizens, as in the actual first right in the bill of rights, freedom of speech.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Someone married to a country star would stand up for the National Anthem

Meghan Lindsey

 

[Brad W]

As well:

Watch out for the Russian trap behind Brittney Griner's release

The US basketball star imprisoned in Russia was released in a prisoner swap for notorious arms dealer Viktor Bout

qz.com

Folks are acting like it was binary between Whelan and Griner. More likely it was designed by Russia for Americans to do exactly what we're doing here.

This about sums it up. They are pawns. What she did or didn’t do has little relevance to her arrest. Just like the two Canadians arrested in China shortly after Meng Wenzhou was picked up in Canada. They were hostages used to bargain for her release. I am going with @gouch and @wllm on this one. It’s all politics on a big stage and she was perfectly divisive. Propaganda win for Putin for sure but if you believe in realpolitik you should realize why it makes sense for Biden too. The situation with Whelan is murky and none of us have the facts.

 

[gouch]

a song symbolizing a country who guarantees all citizens, as in the actual first right in the bill of rights, freedom of speech.

When the Founding Fathers were crafting Amendments to the constitution and included freedom of speech. Not standing for the national anthem in protest of Un-equal treatment of one group over another was exactly the type of free speech they wanted to protect. Not only did they feel it was a right but a responsibility to voice objection to inequality, as they did when they felt that they were treated as less than equal to the people living in England.

 

[morley.tyler]

When the Founding Fathers were crafting Amendments to the constitution and included freedom of speech. Not standing for the national anthem in protest of Un-equal treatment of one group over another was exactly the type of free speech they wanted to protect. Not only did they feel it was a right but a responsibility to voice objection to inequality, as they did when they felt that they were treated as less than equal to the people living in England.

 

[Big Fin]

I'm done with meetings and done with topics such as this. Hope everyone got it off their chest.

Locked.