Weight Loss Drugs

[Treeshark]

What was that measured on? I'd be interested to see a large sample size of Dexa scans from GLP-1 users....

Initial data actually did not show much muscle or bone density difference with GLP-1 use from what I’ve read. However, I was at an orthopedic conference this spring and there was some concerning trends starting to show.

 

[Hams42]

What was that measured on? I'd be interested to see a large sample size of Dexa scans from GLP-1 users....

A not accurate scale. I take it with a grain of salt. I definitely feel weaker than when I was 280 lbs but still have the majority of my muscle at 205 lbs.

 

[Hams42]

Initial data actually did not show much muscle or bone density difference with GLP-1 use from what I’ve read. However, I was at an orthopedic conference this spring and there was some concerning trends starting to show.

I assume just a lack of vitamins and minerals from lower food intake?

I may be a outlier but I have still roughly tracked my food intake over the course of time I've been on the drug. I also waited for quite a while before upping my dosage to the next step. This caused me to loose weight slower but I think it was better that way.

 

[The_Jim]

Lifting is a MUST even though I lift 3 days a week I still lost about 15 lbs of lean mass.

Do you think it was directly from the glp-1 or simply from not eating enough to maintain the muscle? You can lift all you want but if you can’t eat enough calories your body won’t maintain muscle.

 

[TOGIE]

These GLP-1's are the best evidence that "normal" dieting (ie eating less) works. It's been a thermodynamics problem all along, just no one wanted to admit it. The reason GLP-1's work and "normal" dieting doesn't is the former is effortless.

This is true. Broadly speaking the physics don't differ between people.

Though, there are people like myself who can't really gain weight even if we try. lucky problem i know. I don't have any special willpower other folks lack, and really, if we're honest, I probably have less willpower than most people.

The thing people often overlook is that my inability to gain weight is no different than other people's inability to lose it. The physics are the same, if I ate more, I would gain weight, my body is not special in that regard, whereas if others ate less, they would lose weight, their body's are similarly not special in that regard. But the hormonal balances in our bodies that tell us to eat more or less after given inputs are inherently different and we largely have little control over how that dice roll lands in our genetics. Neither one of us can fight those signals any better than the other. My body tells me to stop eating so I stop when another dudes body screams at him to keep eating. To do the opposite is fighting hormonal signals telling our brains to tell our bodies to do what it thinks our bodies should be doing, overpowering that is not easy. My body forces me in one direction and theirs another.

I just hope more people realize that many folks inability to lose weight is not a result of their lack of willpower.

I'm largely agnostic on the drugs. Proper use of medicine is life changing and I want people to leverage everything they can to live fulfilling lives.

But I do fear that because history shows us in the world of bodily health that easy buttons often come with consequences, we may be getting a little loosey goosey with the access to these things. I hope not. But it is certainly the open ended question nobody can definitely say here with the GLP-1s.

 

[Hams42]

Do you think it was directly from the glp-1 or simply from not eating enough to maintain the muscle? You can lift all you want but if you can’t eat enough calories your body won’t maintain muscle.

I think it was from just losing weight. You can't strictly just loose fat you are bound to loose muscle as well. You can do your best to offset it by lifting and keeping a high protien intake but you can't stop it completely.

 

[sclancy27]

The thing people often overlook is that my inability to gain weight is no different than other people's inability to lose it. The physics are the same, if I ate more, I would gain weight, my body is not special in that regard, whereas if others ate less, they would lose weight, their body's are similarly not special in that regard. But the hormonal balances in our bodies that tell us to eat more or less after given inputs are inherently different and we largely have little control over how that dice roll lands in our genetics. Neither one of us can fight those signals any better than the other. My body tells me to stop eating so I stop when another dudes body screams at him to keep eating. To do the opposite is fighting hormonal signals telling our brains to tell our bodies to do what it thinks our bodies should be doing, overpowering that is not easy. My body forces me in one direction and theirs another.

This is largely BS. If this was the case we would have had generations of society with the inability to lose weight. Phenotype = Genotype and genes don't change that degree over the equivalent of a human generation.

Two things were largely at play; 1). Food became much easier to procure and "food scientists" produced food that we can eat more of without feeling full. 2). The vast majority of society rapidly transitioned from labor-focused jobs to sitting in a chair for work. Reason #2 probably had a greater effect than reason #1.

There are people who have true hormonal issues but they are the vast minority.

 

[Treeshark]

I assume just a lack of vitamins and minerals from lower food intake?

That is my assumption, but I haven't seen evidence supporting it. That explanation does makes sense intuitively.

 

[TOGIE]

This is largely BS. If this was the case we would have had generations of society with the inability to lose weight. Phenotype = Genotype and genes don't change that degree over the equivalent of a human generation.

Two things were largely at play; 1). Food became much easier to procure and "food scientists" produced food that we can eat more of without feeling full. 2). The vast majority of society rapidly transitioned from labor-focused jobs to sitting in a chair for work. Reason #2 probably had a greater effect than reason #1.

There are people who have true hormonal issues but they are the vast minority.

the genes were always there. a changing society and a changing food supply acted as combo multipliers on the effects those genes can have.

autistic kids were just as autistic in 1700 as they are now. people just didn't know what their deal was so they were just weird kids. put those same kids in a modern screen fueled time stressed society and all of the sudden you have a very novel and acute problem that never existed before, even if the spectrum disorder is technically identical.

 

[sclancy27]

I assume just a lack of vitamins and minerals from lower food intake?

That is my assumption, but I haven't seen evidence supporting it. That explanation does makes sense intuitively.

Look at studies of natural bodybuilders, they lose lean mass too, especially as the cumulative weight loss gets larger. Lean mass loss is symptom of significant weight loss. You can minimize it by weight training HARD, but it is still going to happen.

The reason I was interested in DEXA results is that puts "lean mass" into actually categories; bone, muscle, water, etc. Without that context "lean mass" is a pretty worthless term.

 

[Hams42]

The reason I was interested in DEXA results is that puts "lean mass" into actually categories; bone, muscle, water, etc. Without that context "lean mass" is a pretty worthless term.

From things I have seen even the DEXA's can be wildly inaccurate.

 

[sclancy27]

From things I have seen even the DEXA's can be wildly inaccurate.

DEXA is the gold standard for body comp.

 

[Hams42]

DEXA is the gold standard for body comp.

I know im just saying that there have been some wild readings that body builders have gotten specificly on their body fat percentage. Marking them lower then they truly are.
They can be the gold standard and still have issues.

 

[sclancy27]

I know im just saying that there have been some wild readings that body builders have gotten specificly on their body fat percentage. Marking them lower then they truly are.
They can be the gold standard and still have issues.

You are talking about 1-2% error for people who actually know how to use the machine. It's also used for tracking osteopenia/osteoporosis in a clinical setting.

I can't speak for people running it that don't know what they are doing.

 

[Benfromalbuquerque]

I believe the main longterm side effects are going to be muscular and skeletal, both of which have a direct impact on longevity.

I’ve heard that too, potential muscoskeletal long term impacts. Completely unsupported by any science so far because long term impacts take long term analysis.
Guy who told me about this potential long term stuff (bone density is what he said) also said diet and exercise are the way to go for him. He’s a fatty and can start any time he wants.

Short term empirical evidence shows that fatties have reduced the workload on their enlarged hearts by losing 50+ pounds. I work with a former a fatty who no longer lives with Type 2 because his sugar has once again regulated.

American life expectancy has retreated recently which seems contrary to also having the highest quality hospitals in the world. But hospitals fix people and stop life threatening stuff at that moment.

People won’t Jane Fonda their way to a sustained healthy weight. We never did. I know this other former skinny who lost 250lbs after bariatric surgery. Freakin guy was lighter than me for like a year, we couldn’t believe it! He’s gone back up to 370. That man would do well to try out a six month peptide regimen.
Maybe long term bone fragility and small muscles will be a new medical issue to fix. But the fact remains that those 70 year old patients of healthy weight didn’t check out at 30 from heart failure. They didn’t lose their toes to diabetes either. They lived long enough to see their kids become adults and they show strangers pictures of their grandchildren.

That, my friend, is a real good deal. Fat Americans were dying early and the weight was straining the health system. I agree with the sentiment of @Bonasababy. Let’s see what happens and I like what I’ve seen so far.

 

[Bonasababy]

This is true. Broadly speaking the physics don't differ between people.

Though, there are people like myself who can't really gain weight even if we try. lucky problem i know. I don't have any special willpower other folks lack, and really, if we're honest, I probably have less willpower than most people.

The thing people often overlook is that my inability to gain weight is no different than other people's inability to lose it. The physics are the same, if I ate more, I would gain weight, my body is not special in that regard, whereas if others ate less, they would lose weight, their body's are similarly not special in that regard. But the hormonal balances in our bodies that tell us to eat more or less after given inputs are inherently different and we largely have little control over how that dice roll lands in our genetics. Neither one of us can fight those signals any better than the other. My body tells me to stop eating so I stop when another dudes body screams at him to keep eating. To do the opposite is fighting hormonal signals telling our brains to tell our bodies to do what it thinks our bodies should be doing, overpowering that is not easy. My body forces me in one direction and theirs another.

I just hope more people realize that many folks inability to lose weight is not a result of their lack of willpower.

I'm largely agnostic on the drugs. Proper use of medicine is life changing and I want people to leverage everything they can to live fulfilling lives.

But I do fear that because history shows us in the world of bodily health that easy buttons often come with consequences, we may be getting a little loosey goosey with the access to these things. I hope not. But it is certainly the open ended question nobody can definitely say here with the GLP-1s.

Metabolisms vary dramatically between people. And they change over time for some as well.

People considering a GLP1 would do well to work with a weight loss specialist and take their advice.

 

[merbes]

Yep,that’s pretty much it. Ozempic works while you’re on it, but if you stop the appetite control goes away and the weight often comes back. Longterm results really come down to diet, exercise, and lifestyle changes or staying on the drug under doctor’s guidance

that the same thing ive heard

 

[DFS]

Hunting season is 37 days away.

 

[brymoore]

Hunting season is 37 days away.

Bear is still open in Idaho.