Time for a new rifle?

[308WinGuy]

In the market for a new rifle. Deer, elk and potentially moose/bison if I ever draw a tag. Western hunting with ranges out to 500 yards. I'm a bid dude and can tolerate recoil well but don't want to get too crazy. Think I have settled on a bergara ridge wilderness in 300 prc. Any deep thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks for any input.

300 win mag, I bought a rifle a few years back in .308 Norma Mag, just try and find ammo for it now sigh..

 

[Wind Gypsy]

300 PRC is a fine choice as is 300 wm. A 300 PRC is basically a 2021 version of the WM, get rid of the unnecessary belt, steeper shoulders, longer neck, more freebore for heavier projectiles. The case capacity between the two is almost identical. I almost went PRC on a recent barrel but having WM dies and components was enough to sway me that way.

PRC's are not going anywhere so long term ammo would not be a concern to me. I recommend anyone who's planning on reloading PRC google the "clicker" issues that show up on cases after 2 or 3 firings. It's likely a factory chamber will not address those concerns where as you could have a custom done with a little more breathing space around the web area in the chamber.

 

[std7mag]

Personally, i'd go with 7mm.
If you can get same velocity from a 7mm, bullet weight being equal, the 7mm will shoot flatter, faster, with less wind drift, and carry more energy at distance.

Yeah, you can get heavier bullets in 30 caliber, but not needed for hunting in North America.

 

[SFC B]

I'm going 6.5 300 as soon as the shop gets one in!

I have one in my shop. If you are interested drop me a PM and I can get details for you.

 

[Mustangs Rule]

Not a Magnum but if you reload a 280 AI might be just the ticket.

If you don't reload a 300 Win Mag.

Over and over, on sites like this, the caliber that is winning the hearts on minds of hunters is the 280AI. I have one in a 5 3/4 pound Kimber with a 24 inch barrel. It is either equal to or so close to the 7 mag that it makes no functional differnce at all. And it is so efficient that it does this on way way less powder. Magnums always were powder hogs.

So, with so much less powder it kicks so much less. It is easy to shoot even in such a light rifle. The stock design is excellent and the recoil pad is thick.

I have had and sold two 338's. I had and sold one 300 win mag. I will sell my 35 Whelen after X mas.

Loaded with both 140 grain and 150 grain TTSX Barnes, at or near 7m Mag velocities, plus 160 Lapua's for closer duty, the 280AI makes my all my other 7mm calibers look either anemic ( 7x57 and 280 or bloated the 7 mm Mag) I have sold them all too.

I also sold one of my two 30-06's I had.

I will not sell my Sako Finnlight in .308. It has a match grade barrel, is really tight and gets amazing velocity with 150 grain Barnes TTSX. It is however that half pound heavier in the gun, and a bit more with heavy Sako rings/bases.

I cannot forget I am carrying it. After awhile it bites my neck/shoulder

I totally forget I am carrying my Kimber Hunter in 280AI. With it's very thin 24" match grade barrel, the first two shots either are, or are close to a figure "8". The third shot heats up the barrel and my group opens to about 7/8".

 

[Jason73]

Over and over, on sites like this, the caliber that is winning the hearts on minds of hunters is the 280AI. I have one in a 5 3/4 pound Kimber with a 24 inch barrel. It is either equal to or so close to the 7 mag that it makes no functional differnce at all. And it is so efficient that it does this on way way less powder. Magnums always were powder hogs.

So, with so much less powder it kicks so much less. It is easy to shoot even in such a light rifle. The stock design is excellent and the recoil pad is thick.

I have had and sold two 338's. I had and sold one 300 win mag. I will sell my 35 Whelen after X mas.

Loaded with both 140 grain and 150 grain TTSX Barnes, at or near 7m Mag velocities, plus 160 Lapua's for closer duty, the 280AI makes my all my other 7mm calibers look either anemic ( 7x57 and 280 or bloated the 7 mm Mag) I have sold them all too.

I also sold one of my two 30-06's I had.

I will not sell my Sako Finnlight in .308. It has a match grade barrel, is really tight and gets amazing velocity with 150 grain Barnes TTSX. It is however that half pound heavier in the gun, and a bit more with heavy Sako rings/bases.

I cannot forget I am carrying it. After awhile it bites my neck/shoulder

I totally forget I am carrying my Kimber Hunter in 280AI. With it's very thin 24" match grade barrel, the first two shots either are, or are close to a figure "8". The third shot heats up the barrel and my group opens to about 7/8".

Hmmmm.......

 

[Mustangs Rule]

Here is an example of what the 280Ai is all about.

I looked up the loads for the Barnes 140 grain TTSX in both the 280AI and the 7mm mag. Both peaked just under 3200'/sec. 3196 and 3199 respectivly.

I took a load for each at exacly 3169'/sec. The 280AI needed 56.3 grains of R 17 to get here. The 7mm mag needed 68 grains of R-22 to get there.

To get that 7mm mag to 3199'/sec it took 77 grains of "Magnum powder". The 280AI did 3196'/sec with 62 grains of "Hunter" powder

How can anyone not admire that kind of efficiency!

 

[Jason73]

Here is an example of what the 280Ai is all about.

I looked up the loads for the Barnes 140 grain TTSX in both the 280AI and the 7mm mag. Both peaked just under 3200'/sec. 3196 and 3199 respectivly.

I took a load for each at exacly 3169'/sec. The 280AI needed 56.3 grains of R 17 to get here. The 7mm mag needed 68 grains of R-22 to get there.

To get that 7mm mag to 3199'/sec it took 77 grains of "Magnum powder". The 280AI did 3196'/sec with 62 grains of "Hunter" powder

How can anyone not admire that kind of efficiency!

Sounds very intriguing. What is the kinetic energy comparison at say 500-600 yards? 5 3/4 # rifle sounds good!!

 

[BenInMT]

I’m pretty sure several branches of our military are phasing out 300WM in favor of 300PRC so I do not think it will fade away. It is the one I prefer and I have my reasons, those reasons are trivial to most shooters and they are not worth arguing about on the internet.

If I wasn’t a reloader and I wanted to buy a new gun I would only buy the cartridge I could walk out of the store that day with 200 rounds minimum.

 

[Mustangs Rule]

Sounds very intriguing. What is the kinetic energy comparison at say 500-600 yards? 5 3/4 # rifle sounds good!!

Sighted to zero at 250 yards, at 500 yards it is 39 inches low, energy is 1,478, and velocity is 2184. The bullet I want is the long range TTSX 139 grain with a BC of .470. It will expand well at 1,600 feet per second. Not sure when I can ever get it, but I do have two boxes of the 140 grain with a BC of .420

It gives me the above trajectory at 450 yards.

Even going out to 600 yards the numbers are pretty good. Drop of about 52 inches, energy about 1280 and velocity just around 2000.

i cannot imagine a better deal for an all around rifle for deer, antelope and elk.

I have also loaded the 150 grain TTSX, but with shortages I did not have the ideal powder. I lost about 100 feet pe second with an alternative powder.

What is so cool is how light it is. The trigger was great out of the box. It cost under $800 new with shipping and transfer FFL fees. It has a trimmed down Model 70 action with CRF and the classic 3 position safery which is quiet and smooth

I put a 3-9 American made Burris on it and life was great. I am 73 and the Burris ballistic tech crosshairs are a bit thicker so my old eyes work great with them I can hunt with out glasses to get the crosshaird to focus. And the hash marks work just fine.

I took a deer last year, at just 150 yards in dim light morning light and passed on an elk at 450 cause getting the horses to it could have injured them. This season past was a bust. I was fully vaccinated but got the Delta varient just as seasons began.

I was pretty weak but had no damage to my lungs and my oxygen level never went below 90%. A young hunter I like got it who was not vaccinated and Covid turned his lungs to steel wool. He is 30 and his lungs are real damaged.

 

[Mustangs Rule]

Sighted to zero at 250 yards, at 500 yards it is 39 inches low, energy is 1,478, and velocity is 2184. The bullet I want is the long range TTSX 139 grain with a BC of .470. It will expand well at 1,600 feet per second. Not sure when I can ever get it, but I do have two boxes of the 140 grain with a BC of .420

It gives me the above trajectory at 450 yards.

Even going out to 600 yards the numbers are pretty good. Drop of about 52 inches, energy about 1280 and velocity just around 2000.

i cannot imagine a better deal for an all around rifle for deer, antelope and elk.

I have also loaded the 150 grain TTSX, but with shortages I did not have the ideal powder. I lost about 100 feet pe second with an alternative powder.

What is so cool is how light it is. The trigger was great out of the box. It cost under $800 new with shipping and transfer FFL fees. It has a trimmed down Model 70 action with CRF and the classic 3 position safery which is quiet and smooth

I put a 3-9 American made Burris on it and life was great. I am 73 and the Burris ballistic tech crosshairs are a bit thicker so my old eyes work great with them I can hunt with out glasses to get the crosshaird to focus. And the hash marks work just fine.

I took a deer last year, at just 150 yards in dim light morning light and passed on an elk at 450 cause getting the horses to it could have injured them. This season past was a bust. I was fully vaccinated but got the Delta varient just as seasons began.

I was pretty weak but had no damage to my lungs and my oxygen level never went below 90%. A young hunter I like got it who was not vaccinated and Covid turned his lungs to steel wool. He is 30 and his lungs are real damaged.

An error, at 500 yards it is 29 inches not 39 inches low

 

[std7mag]

Here is an example of what the 280Ai is all about.

I looked up the loads for the Barnes 140 grain TTSX in both the 280AI and the 7mm mag. Both peaked just under 3200'/sec. 3196 and 3199 respectivly.

I took a load for each at exacly 3169'/sec. The 280AI needed 56.3 grains of R 17 to get here. The 7mm mag needed 68 grains of R-22 to get there.

To get that 7mm mag to 3199'/sec it took 77 grains of "Magnum powder". The 280AI did 3196'/sec with 62 grains of "Hunter" powder

How can anyone not admire that kind of efficiency!

Your comparing apples to bicycles.
You need to compare RL17 with, well, RL17.
Not RL17 vs RL22.
To say it's more efficient with a faster burning powder is misleading.
It would take less Varget than RL17.
You want really efficient, use Red Dot.

Then, instead of a 140gr mono.
Lets shoot the 175gr ABLR.
And use the same powder.

 

[Mustangs Rule]

Your comparing apples to bicycles.
You need to compare RL17 with, well, RL17.
Not RL17 vs RL22.
To say it's more efficient with a faster burning powder is misleading.
It would take less Varget than RL17.
You want really efficient, use Red Dot.

Then, instead of a 140gr mono.
Lets shoot the 175gr ABLR.
And use the same powder.

Thank You

You seem to be a reloader with far more experience than I have. Plus I only use Barnes bullets and just chose a bullet that worked well for deer/elk.

 

[std7mag]

Thank You

You seem to be a reloader with far more experience than I have. Plus I only use Barnes bullets and just chose a bullet that worked well for deer/elk.

I don't know that i would say all that. Lol
I'm on the wait list for the new Weatherby Mark V Hunter in 280AI.
So i'll get to play with the cartridge then.
Should fit nicely between my 284 Win, 280 Rem and 7mm Rem Mag.

 

[antelopedundee]

The big 300s are great calibers but 2 things 1) if you don't reload consider a 300win or wby perhaps, just for long-term ammo available. 2) the big 300s are WAY over qualified for your up to 500 yard range. I think a 7rem, 300 win or even a 30-06 would be better choice especially if you don't reload. If you plan on shooting longer ranges eventually I understand but your gun your money and sometimes it's just fun to have big gun...lol.

I remember a comment about the 460 Wby mag which I think is in my old Hornady reloading book. A powerful rifle is fascinating to many.

 

[std7mag]

I remember a comment about the 460 Wby mag which I think is in my old Hornady reloading book. A powerful rifle is fascinating to many.

My shoulder hurts just thinking of that!

 

[antelopedundee]

My shoulder hurts just thinking of that!

Mine hurts when I'm at the range and see people shooting .338 Win mags. OUCH!

 

[std7mag]

Mine hurts when I'm at the range and see people shooting .338 Win mags. OUCH!

I shot a friends 50 BMG once, just to say i shot one.
My facination with them is over now. Lol

Though if i could find the guy that was trying to sell his 408 Cheytac locally again, i may make an offer on it!
But he was selling it at 1/3 of the going price.

 

[mtmuley]

I shot a friends 50 BMG once, just to say i shot one.
My facination with them is over now. Lol

Though if i could find the guy that was trying to sell his 408 Cheytac locally again, i may make an offer on it!
But he was selling it at 1/3 of the going price.

I've fired 50's before. Not a big deal. I've fired big Allen Magnums. Not a big deal. The right brake is essential. mtmuley

 

[std7mag]

I've fired 50's before. Not a big deal. I've fired big Allen Magnums. Not a big deal. The right brake is essential. mtmuley

That and a rifle that weighs 34lb.
I don't think the recoil is the factor with the 50.
It's more the concussion from the brake.