RIP Charlie Kirk

[gouch]

I wonder, what would we think about all 3 of those people if their life were to exist today and pass in a similar fashion?

Would people focus on JFKs adultery? Or some of alleged treatment MLK had toward women? I never really have - kind of accepted that we are all imperfect and have certainly wronged people along the way.

I guess i wasnt around then to see what people were saying when those icons moved on. But i doubt it was hyperbole about out of context statements to attack a dead mans chracter - cause you dont or didnt agree with his opinions or values.

I all three cases there were plenty of people celebrating their deaths. The only difference now is the internet. In the case of MLK even the US government spent plenty of taxpayers dollars on a character assassination policy.

 

[Keep'er Movin]

Was this a gang related shooting?

What are you even talking about? How does this relate to mental illness which is what I was talking about? The fact that senseless killings happen all the time because of a belief system tells me it's probably not always mental illness which is what everyone always wants to blame a murder on.

 

[SAJ-99]

Wasn't going to comment on here but I brought up armed guards or teachers in schools several years ago (not on Hunttalk) and I got a lot of pushback from people saying they were afraid of the defensive shooter missing and hitting a student by mistake. They could not understand how ANY attempt to stop the shooter with a gun could be "safe". In those situations safe is already out the window and measures have to be taken to stop it. Seemed like they would rather have the kids hide and hope instead of taking action against the threat. Even just a couple rounds fired back might distract the shooter enough to not target more kids. Many multiples of bad guys have been stopped by a good guy with a gun. You just very rarely hear about it. Nobody wants to accept that it really happens. I would rather have the guy next to me pull his weapon to stop an attack than wait for the police (also carrying a gun) to show up at the scene. It's just too easy a subject to be made political and argued about instead of actually doing something that makes sense and would have an impact. Small areas of the country may be able to implement something but I see no way that the country as a whole could ever do it.

What if there is no attack, just a rumor spreading in our electronic communication ethos? It seems we are at the point where finding the truth is like trying to fish the cooked carrots out of a stew.

Navy Mid was shot while attacking guard mistaken for assailant, official says

The violence occurred amid false rumors that a midshipman who had been dimissed from the academy was stalking the campus.

www.baltimoresun.com

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/09/11/us/naval-academy-annapolis.html

 

[birdseye]

again, an extremely sad situation but the fact is, in the 60's virtually every American (and most of the world) was very familiar with JFK, RFK and MLK because of the obvious. In 2025 very few of us were cognizant of Charlie Kirk. Not all of us are attuned to a, well, what was he, an influencer? Maybe he's this generations JFK, RFK, MLK??? Bad deal but there's a considerable Gulf between Mr. Kirk and the aforementioned

 

[Nick87]

What are you even talking about?

You compared the assisnation to gang violence, so? I think a mentally healthy person woukd have either not attended one of Kirks events or changed the channel when one of his videos came up. Thats what a rationale mentally stable person does. But according to you instead of doing that and planning out a murder and taking another man's life because you don't like things he says (literally that's it the guy hasn't done anything to anyone except expressed ideas and engaged in conversation) that's still a mentally healthy person who just doesn't know how to deal with a situation. The same situation that could be dealt with with literally a swipe on your screen and problem solved. WOW.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

again, an extremely sad situation but the fact is, in the 60's virtually every American (and most of the world) was very familiar with JFK, RFK and MLK because of the obvious. In 2025 very few of us were cognizant of Charlie Kirk. Not all of us are attuned to a, well, what was he, an influencer? Maybe he's this generations JFK, RFK, MLK??? Bad deal but there's a considerable Gulf between Mr. Kirk and the aforementioned

I dont think you could find a human being 30 and under that doesn't know who Charlie Kirk is. He was not an influencer. Why dont you do a little research on the man.

 

[Hunting Wife]

I just saw this posting and I believe it is well written and spot on. I also believe our country is being deliberately divided by outside influences that want our country to implode. Social media is the ideal mechanism to manipulate those who are vulnerable. We can discuss what that means but reality is there are a lot of people who are lost souls. They are easily moved psychologically by the "programming" they receive. This is not a partisan issue, it's a society issue and if we do not work together to defeat this process, our society, our country and our freedom is doomed.

View attachment 385654

See, to me this is yet another example of the same fear mongering, black and white, all or nothing, “I’m right and everyone else is wrong” messaging used by both ends of the political spectrum that is pitting Americans against each other. Portraying the other as “evil”, “depraved”, “wicked”, etc. Continuing to focus on division and differences between people, and on concepts of victors imposing their will over the defeated. The fact that we can no longer even detect this type of messaging is terrifying.

We’ve gotten to a place where we condemn and call for retribution, sometimes violent retribution, when the “other tribe” says something we feel threatened by. We throw out accusations about the others being mentally fragile, mentally ill, inhuman, unfeeling, immoral, [insert accusation here]. But then we turn right around to cheer on, celebrate, make excuses for, and idolize the members of “our tribe” doing the exact same things. It’s really interesting to watch.

We are a fascinating, frustrating, terrifying species to observe.

 

[Keep'er Movin]

You compared the assisnation to gang violence, so? I think a mentally healthy person woukd have either not attended one of Kirks events or changed the channel when one of his videos came up. Thats what a rationale mentally stable person does. But according to you instead of doing that and planning out a murder and taking another man's life because you don't like things he says (literally that's it the guy hasn't done anything to anyone except expressed ideas and engaged in conversation) that's still a mentally healthy person who just doesn't know how to deal with a situation. The same situation that could be dealt with with literally a swipe on your screen and problem solved. WOW.

I didn't...I compared it to murder over a belief system which shows me that people are willing to kill over something that the average person wouldn't consider. Regulating emotions is a skill. Being a teacher for as long as I have, this murder doesn't surprise me at all. There are many kids who can't regulate their emotions. They haven't learned how to and until they do, this will be a common occurrence.

 

[Keep'er Movin]

I dont think you could find a human being 30 and under that doesn't know who Charlie Kirk is. He was not an influencer. Why dont you do a little research on the man.

An influencer is someone who tries to influence behavior. He was definitely an influencer.

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

An influencer is someone who tries to influence behavior. He was definitely an influencer.

Livvy Dunne is an influencer. Charlie Kirk was much more than an influencer.

 

[birdseye]

Livvy Dunne is an influencer. Charlie Kirk was much more than an influencer.

Do you even know of the Kennedy's and MLK ?

 

[Hilljackoutlaw]

Do you even know of the Kennedy's and MLK ?

Im moving on. Cause thats an ignorant question.

 

[Nick87]

I didn't...I compared it to murder over a belief system which shows me that people are willing to kill over something that the average person wouldn't consider. Regulating emotions is a skill. Being a teacher for as long as I have, this murder doesn't surprise me at all. There are many kids who can't regulate their emotions. They haven't learned how to and until they do, this will be a common occurrence.

Nevermind.

 

[cgasner1]

See, to me this is yet another example of the same fear mongering, black and white, all or nothing, “I’m right and everyone else is wrong” messaging used by both ends of the political spectrum that is pitting Americans against each other. Portraying the other as “evil”, “depraved”, “wicked”, etc. Continuing to focus on division and differences between people, and on concepts of victors imposing their will over the defeated. The fact that we can no longer even detect this type of messaging is terrifying.

We’ve gotten to a place where we condemn and call for retribution, sometimes violent retribution, when the “other tribe” says something we feel threatened by. We throw out accusations about the others being mentally fragile, mentally ill, inhuman, unfeeling, immoral, [insert accusation here]. But then we turn right around to cheer on, celebrate, make excuses for, and idolize the members of “our tribe” doing the exact same things. It’s really interesting to watch.

We are a fascinating, frustrating, terrifying species to observe.

I wonder how much of this has just been amplified by social media. The average idiot can get a message out now that reaches farther than most politicians could in the 90’s. What makes it worse is it’s instantly available. Throw in said idiot can get the “facts” from a made up story

 

[cgasner1]

20 years ago you may have been able to scour the internet and find a video of the incident. How many people saw this and didn’t want to within the first 5 min of it happening due to social media? I saw one clip from a far off distance where he just kinda fell over was all it looked like. I had and have zero interest in seeing anything else that one video I knew he wasn’t making it to the hospital. Now how many teenagers not only saw that video but 15 min later saw 5-6 more with different angles that are way way more graphic

 

[Gerald Martin]

See, to me this is yet another example of the same fear mongering, black and white, all or nothing, “I’m right and everyone else is wrong” messaging used by both ends of the political spectrum that is pitting Americans against each other. Portraying the other as “evil”, “depraved”, “wicked”, etc. Continuing to focus on division and differences between people, and on concepts of victors imposing their will over the defeated. The fact that we can no longer even detect this type of messaging is terrifying.

We’ve gotten to a place where we condemn and call for retribution, sometimes violent retribution, when the “other tribe” says something we feel threatened by. We throw out accusations about the others being mentally fragile, mentally ill, inhuman, unfeeling, immoral, [insert accusation here]. But then we turn right around to cheer on, celebrate, make excuses for, and idolize the members of “our tribe” doing the exact same things. It’s really interesting to watch.

We are a fascinating, frustrating, terrifying species to observe.

Well said. I think as humans we all want validation from our fellow humans of the things we believe in. That affirmation of our beliefs provides a sense of security, identity and control in a world that is difficult and dangerous to exist in as an individual.
Truth as an objective anchor is something everyone wants to be tethered to as a mooring point to relate to life. That’s a universal thing regardless of how it’s codified within a culture or society. It should be something that unifies us in our humanity even as we debate and argue in our search to understand truth.


The search for connection to truth is complex because truth stands alone and is not encapsulated completely by any individual, society, political system or religion. It becomes even more complex because humans have learned to leverage “truth” to their own advantage over other humans. It remains complex as human understanding of truth are often oppositional to each other.

When the struggle to be right is more important than the understanding of truth and application of that truth in our individual lives, humility and restraint are the first things we abandon and conflict and violence often follow.

We are all wrong in our understanding of truth to some degree. We are also all hardwired as humans to be correct in our understanding of truth to some degree.

The people that demonstrate an example of how to debate ideas and articulate their understanding of truth are valuable assets to any society. We may not agree with their conclusions, but the fact that they challenge ours and that challenge inspires us to either gain more understanding of what makes our understanding more solid or influences us to abandon an understanding of truth because our understanding is inaccurate is a benefit to us personally and to society as a whole.


It is difficult for most of us to present our understanding of truth and have the restraint to let it stand on its own without needing to have the person we’re presenting it to accept it and implement it.




As a Christian who has an imperfect yet robust paradigm of certain truths and order for human society, I am continually amazed at the restraint that Jesus himself showed in his time of ministry when he was on this earth. Many of his most radical truth claims were in stark opposition to the status quo of the societal, religious, and political norms of the day, yet he presented the acceptance of truth as an act of individual free will and responsibility.

“ If any man hear my voice….”
“Let him that has ears to hear”
“I stand at the door and knock, if any man opens the door, I will come in….”


Those words were spoken alongside some of the most profound and provocative statements his audience had ever heard.

I am inspired by the willingness of Charlie Kirk to engage, debate and present his views.


I am also uncomfortable with the synchronization of many of the views I agree most with to political organization and power structure that tends towards forcing application of their understanding of truth as a societal requirement rather than an individual choice.

I guess it’s par for the course that no human example is without flaws in understanding and presentation.

Perhaps rather than being a source of disappointment and discouragement it should be a source of hope that each of us can also be an example that inspires others in spite of our shortcomings.

 

[Irrelevant]

I don't know who said it a few pages back, but it was something along the lines of, "Based on the comments in this thread, I wouldn't share a campfire with some of you."

*gets onto soapbox, clears throat*

What a GD SNOWFLAKE comment.

Now I'm making the assumption, despite the adage about asses, that your comment was not actually about a campfire but a metaphor that allows you to put down other people that you disagree with and not be called out on it. I'm calling you out. Recognize that you (the all and any of you, you, and including myself) are not smarter, more rational, or more morally just than people simply because they have opposing political views. This thread represents all the good that's left in America. We're on page 15 of mostly reasonable, rational dialogue that hasn't devolved into personal attacks or broad-brush accusations. That doesn't mean that everyone's going to agree. That is a good thing. And if you can't see the value in differing opinions, then I enter that as evidence into the "part of the problem" argument.

And if I made an ass of myself and you were actually being literal about a campfire, then well, no shit Sherlock. I wouldn't willingly share a campfire with most people. The campfire threshold is actually a pretty high bar. But it has nothing to do with their politics or if they believe CK was the second coming of Jesus for conservative ideology. I would happily share a campfire with both @Nick87 and @Stocker despite the fact that I know damn good and well we share almost no political opinions, but they are sharp guys with great self-depricating humor. I know I'd laugh my ass off. Not sure if they'd share the same sentiment.

 

[Nick87]

@Nick87 and @Stocker despite the fact that I know damn good and well we share almost no political opinions, but they are sharp guys with great self-depricating humor. I know I'd laugh my ass off. Not sure if they'd share the same sentiment.

I do share the same sentiment, I enjoy the differing of opinions as well, at least most of them. Plenty of great folks here who I would share the campfire with with not that much to agree on as far as that stuff goes, yourself included amigo.

 

[jryoung]

We are a fascinating, frustrating, terrifying species to observe.

Disturbingly, and painfully accurate.

 

[Cogreeny]

I do share the same sentiment, I enjoy the differing of opinions as well, at least most of them. Plenty of great folks here who I would share the campfire with with not that much to agree on as far as that stuff goes, yourself included amigo.

Theres one dude here I guarantee I’d be as far away from his fire as possible. Ontario something or other is his handle