Montana ridiculousness- Pref point debacle

[RobertD]

Not to be churlish but I'm definitely another person that's glad he hasn't bought any Magical Montana Points at any time. It just seems so costly and confusing to go on hunts that apparently continue to decrease in quality year over year. Good luck to all you DIYers aiming for tags this year, though.

 

[Shangobango]

Not to be churlish but I'm definitely another person that's glad he hasn't bought any Magical Montana Points at any time. It just seems so costly and confusing to go on hunts that apparently continue to decrease in quality year over year. Good luck to all you DIYers aiming for tags this year, though.

I can see how folks would say no thank you.

I sure loved that country I hunted season before last and there was a lot of it I never got to put my boots on. Add in the fact that I have so much invested in bonus points for elk, elk b, pronghorn and pronghorn b it is hard to just say adios.

 

[RobertD]

I can see how folks would say no thank you.

I sure loved that country I hunted season before last and there was a lot of it I never got to put my boots on. Add in the fact that I have so much invested in bonus points for elk, elk b, pronghorn and pronghorn b it is hard to just say adios.

I can believe that. I've been to parts of Montana that are as beautiful as anywhere I've been. And I've only seen a very limited amount of the state. And there are times when I feel tempted by pronghorn in Montana myself.

Still comes back to a limited budget for me and feeling like too many better options exist, but I can see how you could get invested and want to keep at it.

 

[8andcounting]

Except you can still buy a point in the fall if you don't draw and then buy a point again you apply the following year so you'll go into one year with zero points, then the next year with 2 points and maybe draw. Every other year seems pretty possible.

Wrong. You can’t do that if you apply . Not anymore .

 

[Irishman]

It won't always be like this, with the 0pp being so high. It is a huge risk in my eyes to not get a point if you want to have some idea of when you will hunt. The days of being able to hunt a state every year are gone, so having to apply in multiple states and plan, to the best of your ability, when you will draw is what you need.

With that said I like the idea of 25% going to people without points, let's everyone have a shot, a lot of people the extra $300 for buying PP would be a deal breaker, this allows them a chance at a tag atleast.

By not getting a point and not drawing you put yourself 2 years behind the person who bought a point knowing they wouldn't draw. I plan on being able to hunt MT ever 3rd year going forward. So have to work in WY and CO points to cover those other years and probably try in ID and go OTC CO as a final resort. However, I see CO OTC going away within 5-8 years.

 

[Irishman]

If you only want to hunt Montana every 3rd year then your plan probably works. However, if you want to hunt more frequently than that then it looks like buying preference points gives you good odds of drawing every 2nd year, and not buying them will give you good odds every year. If I was a non resident, I think I'd take my chances with zero points. Funny, not that long ago, they couldn't sell the quota, and the hunting opportunities certainly didn't get better since then.

 

[WIbiggame]

not buying them will give you good odds every year.

I would bet that this year 0pp is not much better than having them. Just my opinion. For planning purposes I will buy points

 

[seeth07]

I would bet that this year 0pp is not much better than having them. Just my opinion. For planning purposes I will buy points

Yes, this has been talked about so much on every site with stuff like "You have better odds Applying with zero points than getting 1 point".

How many people do you think will listen to this? I'm guessing boatloads

 

[ccc23454]

Yes, this has been talked about so much on every site with stuff like "You have better odds Applying with zero points than getting 1 point".

How many people do you think will listen to this? I'm guessing boatloads

Problem is this will get to point where its 2 pools: zero point guys with no time or wait invested just simple random odds application in the pile or three point pool that outfitters will have a significant role in making favorable to them. There will be no 1 or 2 point tag drawing and 3 will become lower odds as this process evolves. This system design was basically lets find all the worse things about every other western's states app processes combine them and use that as our model, just waiting for additional fee increases!

 

[Shangobango]

Problem is this will get go point where its 2 pools: zero point guys with no time or wait invested just simple random odds application in the pile or three point pool that outfitters will have a significant role in making favorable to them. There will be no 1 or 2 point tag drawing and 3 will become lower odds as this process evolves. This system design was basically lets find all the worse things about every other western's states app processes combine them and use that as our model, just waiting for additional fee increases!

^^^ Yup. Just a matter of time until 1 and 2 points has no chance to draw. Will be a hoot seeing what they do when 3 is no longer 100%. I give it 2 app periods after this current one before we get to see.

It is worth it to me to have the added certainty of buying the points right now. Once I use my elk bonus points I am going to have a hard time continuing to put in for the combos unless something changes for the better. With the odds of pulling the tag I want that may be a ways off...

 

[seeth07]

just waiting for additional fee increases!

but they did that too by doubling the point fee

 

[Trial153]

What a shit show. I am neck deep in it. Planned on maybe drawing a archery permit next year, now i have no idea

 

[El Jason]

Just think, all the outfitters and clients who were too dumb to navigate the previous point system are now going to be navigating this shit show. Good thing they gave them a freebie point.

 

[WIbiggame]

Just think, all the outfitters and clients who were two dumb to navigate the previous point system are now going to be navigating this shit show. Good thing they gave them a freebie point.

It will be "to confusing" for the outfitters to have any stability, and their clients won't know what to do when just throwing $$ at it won't fix it. So MTFWP will just say you know what all outfitted clients just get a tag like they did in 2021.

 

[WIbiggame]

Just got off the phone with FWP.

Always reassuring when you ask a question and the specialist laughs and says I am really sorry I know this super confusing. Great job making it easier on everyone.

Sorry off the soap box, I was told if you bought a PP last year even if you didn't apply (just purchased in the summer) you will NEED to apply this year or lose your PP.

Also i asked about getting a returned license (not alternates list] and if you pull a returned tag you WIL LOSE you PP as well.

 

[BlakeA]

if you bought a PP last year even if you didn't apply (just purchased in the summer) you will NEED to apply this year or lose your PP.

...

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Also i asked about getting a returned license (not alternates list] and if you pull a returned tag you WIL LOSE you PP as well.

I don't recall, can you opt out of being eligible for a returned tag? Would really suck for a guy looking to hunt a permit to get PP burned without even getting a shot in the permit drawing.

 

[WIbiggame]

I don't recall, can you opt out of being eligible for a returned tag? Would really suck for a guy looking to hunt a permit to get PP burned without even getting a shot in the permit drawing.

I am 99.9% sure you can not opt out the only reason I say not 100% sure is because I wouldn't be surprised if there's a loophole someplace

 

[Shangobango]

Just got off the phone with FWP.

Always reassuring when you ask a question and the specialist laughs and says I am really sorry I know this super confusing. Great job making it easier on everyone.

Sorry off the soap box, I was told if you bought a PP last year even if you didn't apply (just purchased in the summer) you will NEED to apply this year or lose your PP.

Also i asked about getting a returned license (not alternates list] and if you pull a returned tag you WIL LOSE you PP as well.

That is what I figured.

Buy a PP the year before you want to go, buy a point when you apply the next year, then maybe you get drawn and maybe you don't with 2 PP's.

So when the odds with 1 PP got to 0%, can you just hold at one point indefinitely as long as you apply every year? You don't have to buy a preference point when you apply or during the points only period, right?

Same deal when 2 points goes to 0% odds.

At least there are other app deadlines that fall after the Montana combo results come out I suppose.

 

[Shangobango]

I am 99.9% sure you can not opt out the only reason I say not 100% sure is because I wouldn't be surprised if there's a loophole someplace

I thought you had to sign up to be put on the returned tag list.