Montana Mule Deer Mismanagement

[rogerthat]

We need a different thread for this discussion. Let me start a poll for fun.

 

[8andcounting]

 

[Forkyfinder]

@rogerthat
1:37 - 29 bucks per 100 does post season in R7

Flying a great big private reserve seems to be the only way that would be possible...

 

[MTLabrador]

Correct, I question how they did. I do not question how i haven’t. They already told me they were hunting with some local guys that know the area. I don’t have one of those. Well; I have a Gasner that has said “the elk are within 45 min of his house” but that’s not the same “help” as the kind of help they had.

Now, if you or anyone that actually knew about Billings area elk wanted to go hunt with me and show me there are really elk within 45 min of my house- THAT would be the same as their situation.

Because It’s not like they boots-on-the-ground scout more than me, they don’t read more on the internet about habitat, population and distribution, pressure, agriculture, prior success or anything more than me. I can guarantee it!

It’s not what we know, it’s who we know. I’ve said that since I shot my first elk at 15 and it’ll never change.

Who’s to say your nonresident friends at chick fil a were paying for hunting access near Billings? There’s more general tag national forest hunting within a 3 hour drive of Billings than I could hunt in a lifetime, and I grew up here hunting it. I killed my best bull on a day hunt from Billings and got home at 3 in the morning.

There are elk a lot closer than that too, but obviously it’s going to be a lot harder to find them on public land where there isn’t much in the way of public land other than a few scattered state sections and small pieces of BLM, but plenty of people do it. I have a nice set of antlers in the garage from a place like that.

 

[Gerald Martin]

Who’s to say your nonresident friends at chick fil a were paying for hunting access near Billings? There’s more general tag national forest hunting within a 3 hour drive of Billings than I could hunt in a lifetime, and I grew up here hunting it. I killed my best bull on a day hunt from Billings and got home at 3 in the morning.

There are elk a lot closer than that too, but obviously it’s going to be a lot harder to find them on public land where there isn’t much in the way of public land other than a few scattered state sections and small pieces of BLM, but plenty of people do it. I have a nice set of antlers in the garage from a place like that.

Norris Rd is within 3 hours of the Billings Chik filet…..

 

[Forkyfinder]

Heres some uncomfortably true numbers to the never ending critique of properly prioritizing resident hunter opportunity. Less residents are hunting both deer and elk than when Obama was president. Mirroring the experience of many i know and my own - more and more NR hunters.

 

[bigsky2]

View attachment 417974View attachment 417975

Heres some uncomfortably true numbers to the never ending critique of properly prioritizing resident hunter opportunity. Less residents are hunting both deer and elk than when Obama was president. Mirroring the experience of many i know and my own - more and more NR hunters.

It probably also reflects how long-time residents view the quality of the deer hunting. I’m guessing that’s part of it anyways. It would be interesting to know the reasons for resident deer hunters declining while the states population has increased. Loss of access has probably contributed too.

 

[Elky Welky]

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Heres some uncomfortably true numbers to the never ending critique of properly prioritizing resident hunter opportunity. Less residents are hunting both deer and elk than when Obama was president. Mirroring the experience of many i know and my own - more and more NR hunters.

Gotta read this in conjunction with the loss of block and less overall public access as well. Total hunters are actually down by almost 10k. 155,221 in 2015 and 144,181 in 23.

Perceived crowding is way up though, and that comes with the land squeeze, and far more hunters spending more days in the field. The number of people I feel I meet--resident and NR--who somehow can take all of fall off, leave behind their families and jobs, combined with less space to do it, and here we are.

 

[DFS]

It probably also reflects how long-time residents view the quality of the deer hunting. I’m guessing that’s part of it anyways. It would be interesting to know the reasons for resident deer hunters declining while the states population has increased. Loss of access has probably contributed too.

From my perspective the nonresidents came in the locals quit and western Montana hunters filled in the gap of the local hunters. I’m sure that will be an unpopular take as usual but that is what I have seen in eastern Montana at least.

 

[mtmuley]

From my perspective the nonresidents came in the locals quit and western Montana hunters filled in the gap of the local hunters. I’m sure that will be an unpopular take as usual but that is what I have seen in eastern Montana at least.

You see a lot of Western Montana hunters out there? mtmuley

 

[DFS]

You see a lot of Western Montana hunters out there? mtmuley

Right up there with nonresidents.

 

[mtmuley]

Right up there with nonresidents.

Interesting. Been a long time since I'd waste the gas money to drive out there. Except this year. Bringing my son in law to see the Breaks. With a cow tag. I doubt any mule deer will be harmed. mtmuley

 

[bigsky2]

From my perspective the nonresidents came in the locals quit and western Montana hunters filled in the gap of the local hunters. I’m sure that will be an unpopular take as usual but that is what I have seen in eastern Montana at least.

Same thing I have seen. Growing up it was mostly locals, WI, MN, and ND plates. Now the Montana plates are almost all from western MT, with a lot more of the nonresident plates being from WA and others from all over the country mixed in.

 

[Forkyfinder]

It probably also reflects how long-time residents view the quality of the deer hunting. I’m guessing that’s part of it anyways. It would be interesting to know the reasons for resident deer hunters declining while the states population has increased. Loss of access has probably contributed too.

It sure doesnt match the narrative that MOGA and the NR treecarp types like to throw here that "increased resident pressure" is a real driver. It honestly matches the majority of the types of people that moved here, not all that interested in hunting.

Another key - their numbers start in 2015 - when they got authotized to resell those extra 5k "orphan" NR deer tags. If you started it before that, it looks worse.

 

[Forkyfinder]

From my perspective the nonresidents came in the locals quit and western Montana hunters filled in the gap of the local hunters. I’m sure that will be an unpopular take as usual but that is what I have seen in eastern Montana at least.

It also accounts for people who dont really bother hunting if they dont draw their preferred LE tag. Which isnt a small amount.

 

[Forkyfinder]

who somehow can take all of fall off, leave behind their families and jobs, combined with less space to do it, and here we are.

Youve seen mobile starlink, right?

If i didnt live here, id probably stay multiple weeks here working if i made a long trip. If i pulled a giga Wouldnt even be uncomfortable.

People dont need to have a "remote" job to work from out of the office for a week or two either. Been normal for 10 years or more in my field.

 

[brockel]

From my perspective the nonresidents came in the locals quit and western Montana hunters filled in the gap of the local hunters. I’m sure that will be an unpopular take as usual but that is what I have seen in eastern Montana at least.

Same for farther east of you. I know lots of 60+ year old hunters that don’t hunt anymore because of it

 

[brockel]

You see a lot of Western Montana hunters out there? mtmuley

Lots starting from middle of August for early archery antelope all the way till thanksgiving weekend.

 

[ShootsManyBullets]

View attachment 417974View attachment 417975

Heres some uncomfortably true numbers to the never ending critique of properly prioritizing resident hunter opportunity. Less residents are hunting both deer and elk than when Obama was president. Mirroring the experience of many i know and my own - more and more NR hunters.

Maybe it's b/c a lot of the new residents are non-hunters that migrated in from the COWs states (Cali, OR, WA)?

 

[mtmuley]

Same for farther east of you. I know lots of 60+ year old hunters that don’t hunt anymore because of it

Again. Interesting. I live in Western Montana. Everyone I know hunts. None of us come East. And how do you know if they are from the West anyway? mtmuley