Home purchase

[Ballistic]

Big difference between the 2 populations groups and their approach to life...BIG

No there isn't.

 

[Nick87]

What are taxes in the midwest?

1960's ranch on 1.75 acres $7500. Go 30 to 60 min east and a 1800 square ft house in town is gonna be 6 to 10k depending on age.

 

[SFC B]

You're just wrong.

The problem isn't people moving to desirable places to live, the problem is that wages haven't kept up with the price of cars, insurance, housing, etc.

I use this example all the time. My parents bought their first house in 1970 in Missoula, $9,900 in the University Area. Dad was bringing in about 12K a year gross. So, theoretically he could have purchased a house on about what he received in net pay. They bought their second house in 1978, the house they still live in. Pretty desirable part of Missoula for 32K. The house was a considerable upgrade from their first house, but Dad was making about 25K a year by then, so maybe 1.5-2 years gross pay to buy that house.

Flash forward to today, their house is now worth 600K+. How many jobs do you think in Missoula Montana pay 300K+ a year to make an equal comparison? I don't know for sure, but I bet not many, and sure as shit isn't any working in a lumber mill like my Dad did his whole life that are making that.

The trouble isn't people moving, the trouble is wages not keeping pace with prices of anything. As I already said, largely due to crap economic policy started in the 1980's and continuing today that grossly favor the top 2%. And that's just a fact.

Housing at the current levels wouldn't be a problem if middle class workers were knocking down 250K a year.

So, when I hear crap like you're posting about "sacrificing" and "working harder" all that tells me is how far out of touch you are with reality as well as those working their asses off to provide just the basics for themselves and their families. You know, food on the table, insurance, a jalopy to drive to work, rent, clothing, etc. Oh, and to ice the cake, most likely the place they work doesn't have a pension but a 401K with a match, which is great if you make enough to take advantage of it.

The playing field is nowhere close to what it was 10-20-30 years ago, you're still living in the past thinking nothing has changed. The coffee is burnt, time to wake up and smell it.

Exactly HOW do you think the prices in desirable places skyrocket? Why do you think those increases so incredibly outpace many other places? Why do you think the according increases in taxes accompany that? Everything you are describing are PRECISELY the effects of migration of those with huge windfall level amounts of wealth coming to those places. I live in the present but I also came from dirt poor, not having food for every meal, not getting Christmas presents and living 6 people in a 700 sf hovel in the Ghetto and have done the things I preach. Life is all about choices, a LOT of them hard. You are constrained by a view of extremes here in the IMW. Working harder in those areas is not a winning scenario. So move. I have, a LOT, to benefit my family. Pick jobs with retirement and health care benefits (military, government jobs) that may pay LESS but benefit more but may not be pleasant of what you "want" to do....I did. These things haven't ceased to exist, people make choices looking short term and for "quality of life" in the present. I am not saying it is easier than previously....but there are things like an interest rate now that is still HALF or LESS than when I was a kid (80s...between 10.25 and 16.64 FFS). "Reality" at present also means people believing a LOT of things are "necessary" just because they have become common place and refusing to do without those.

 

[Forkyfinder]

1960's ranch on 1.75 acres $7500. Go 30 to 60 min east and a 1800 square ft house in town is gonna be 6 to 10k depending on age.

 

[SFC B]

1960's ranch on 1.75 acres $7500. Go 30 to 60 min east and a 1800 square ft house in town is gonna be 6 to 10k depending on age.

For reference .....In IN my new house on 1.5, log, with pond.....+-$1600 a year.....I pay not quite double that right now only because it is a "second home".

 

[SFC B]

No there isn't.

You don't think there is a HUGE cultural and political difference between folks native to the IMW vs Coastal immigrants? I would say, having watched it for 16 years, there is a very big difference.

 

[SFC B]

Quite a leap to assume the geographic location someone is moving from is all you need to know to determine their quality as a person. I'm out.

This entire topic is based on general trends. In that aspect, I am very comfortable in my views based on direct experience.

 

[Nick87]

Dead serious.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Dead serious.

Thats like 80k in buying power (400k vs 480k with 20% down) and we havent got to insurance.

 

[Nick87]

Thats like 80k in buying power (400k vs 480k with 20% down) and we havent got to insurance.

Yes.

 

[BuzzH]

You've not seen this kind of housing inflation everywhere. There are still many areas of the country where you can by a starter / fixer upper home for somewhere pretty close to a years wages.
For income levels to keep up compared to housing prices in some of the HCOL areas, you'd have to be paying normal blue collar skilled workers $150 per hour. Raise wages up to those levels and see what that does to the economy overnight.

The cost of the housing is so high because of the desirable dirt they are sitting on and the demand to live in those locales. What were once many affordable western towns are now high demand places where lots of people want to live.

Great, cool there's cheaper houses, right alonf with lower average wages in other parts of the country. There is of course the issue of finding reasonable employment in those places.

Also fair to note, GM, Ford, Toyota, Walmart, grocery stores, insurance agencies, etc. don't particulary give 2 shits what your wage is or where you live. Those guys dont charge 10k less for their vehicles to help their fellow man who lives in an area with more affordable housing. Walmart, Safeway, etc don't charge a person based on their income.

So while you want to simply say, move to a place with lower housing prices, and I don't totally disagree with you, in many cases that cheaper housing may be as or even more out of reach for a variety of reasons.

I do appreciate the thought and it may work for some. I talk to a lot of people across the US and the common theme I hear is wages arent keeping up with the price of most consumer goods.

 

[BuzzH]

Exactly HOW do you think the prices in desirable places skyrocket? Why do you think those increases so incredibly outpace many other places? Why do you think the according increases in taxes accompany that? Everything you are describing are PRECISELY the effects of migration of those with huge windfall level amounts of wealth coming to those places. I live in the present but I also came from dirt poor, not having food for every meal, not getting Christmas presents and living 6 people in a 700 sf hovel in the Ghetto and have done the things I preach. Life is all about choices, a LOT of them hard. You are constrained by a view of extremes here in the IMW. Working harder in those areas is not a winning scenario. So move. I have, a LOT, to benefit my family. Pick jobs with retirement and health care benefits (military, government jobs) that may pay LESS but benefit more but may not be pleasant of what you "want" to do....I did. These things haven't ceased to exist, people make choices looking short term and for "quality of life" in the present. I am not saying it is easier than previously....but there are things like an interest rate now that is still HALF or LESS than when I was a kid (80s...between 10.25 and 16.64 FFS). "Reality" at present also means people believing a LOT of things are "necessary" just because they have become common place and refusing to do without those.

Already told you, crap economic policies...seen it my entire life. Lived it too.

 

[Nick87]

you'd have to be paying normal blue collar skilled workers $150 per hour. Raise wages up to those levels and see what that does to the economy overnight.

Are you talking gross on the check or what the employer pays out total package?

 

[mevertsen]

Great, cool there's cheaper houses, right alonf with lower average wages in other parts of the country. There is of course the issue of finding reasonable employment in those places.

Also fair to note, GM, Ford, Toyota, Walmart, grocery stores, insurance agencies, etc. don't particulary give 2 shits what your wage is or where you live. Those guys dont charge 10k less for their vehicles to help their fellow man who lives in an area with more affordable housing. Walmart, Safeway, etc don't charge a person based on their income.

So while you want to simply say, move to a place with lower housing prices, and I don't totally disagree with you, in many cases that cheaper housing may be as or even more out of reach for a variety of reasons.

I do appreciate the thought and it may work for some. I talk to a lot of people across the US and the common theme I hear is wages arent keeping up with the price of most consumer goods.

Exactly.

We gross 65k a year, and have to pay for all insurance out of that.

Prior to my retirement, my total compensation, and only having to pay 20 percent of my families insurance premium, was 165k.

Stuff got real expensive, real quick.

 

[Dave N]

1960's ranch on 1.75 acres $7500. Go 30 to 60 min east and a 1800 square ft house in town is gonna be 6 to 10k depending on age.

1930s 2 story with detached garage and 54X68 steel building on .91 acres. $3928, up $419 from last year.
Insurance just got raised from $1824 to $2183.

 

[BigHornRam]

Thats like 80k in buying power (400k vs 480k with 20% down) and we havent got to insurance.

Buying power/property valuation. One good reason why people are willing to spend more on a house in a low tax Western state than a fiscally out of control state like Illinois. I would never buy a property in Illinois, New York, ect. It's not going to get better, only worse.

 

[Nick87]

1930s 2 story with detached garage and 54X68 steel building on .91 acres. $3928, up $419 from last year.
Insurance just got raised from $1824 to $2183.

Seems about right for how much further south and west you are.

 

[Big Sky Guy]

I talk to a lot of people across the US and the common theme I hear is wages arent keeping up with the price of most consumer goods.

You must not be talking to any CEO’s.

 

[Dave N]

Seems about right for how much further south and west you are.

Yeah, you be getting pretty close to the BIG city!

 

[BuzzH]

Buying power/property valuation. One good reason why people are willing to spend more on a house in a low tax Western state than a fiscally out of control state like Illinois. I would never buy a property in Illinois, New York, ect. It's not going to get better, only worse.

Wait until the natural resources dry up in Wyoming, Montana, etc. Taxes won't be low for long.