Guide School Operator Pleads Guilty To Poaching

[JoseCuervo]

no.
only thing that proves is a deal was made....in other words, "you admit guilt to this lesser crime and we promise just to put the head in..... or go to court, we will charge you with so much shit and go balls deep on you."

plea deals are bullshit!

Why would an innocent man admit to anything?

Do you think our Constitution is bullchit and allows innocent people to be forced to plead guilty?

 

[Tom]

Guiding is when a guy or woman takes a hunter out to hunt.

Outfitting is setting up the hunt, not actually taking the hunters out.

That's the basic difference, without giving any web page or anything.

Outfitters employ guides. MT is a whole different place than Texas though, so maybe they have a different definition, eh?

 

[JB]

Why would an innocent man admit to anything?

to avoid possible incarceration, hefty fines etc.

dont you claim to be some sort of shade tree bootleg lawyer or something
? or worked in a law office making/fetching coffee ........what, you dont think innocent people get screwed?

remember the Duke case? what do you think would of happened to those kids hadnt they had the deep pockets to fight it ?
they would be in jail right now.

 

[Nemont]

MT is a whole different place than Texas though

Thank god for that fact.

http://mt.gov/dli/bsd/license/bsd_boards/out_board/licenses/out/lic_summary.asp

He was acting as both a guide and an outfitter. The guy knowingly broke the law. One would think that there would be reciprocity with Maryland and would lose his hunting privileges there as well.

I don't know why people are defending this guy and I am also unaware of rogue game wardens out to screw law abiding citizens over. I have had a lot of contact with wardens and FWP employees and while there are some zealots the vast majority are really dedicated hard working people.

Also I don't think that he can use the Larry Craig excuse for why he pleaded guilty to a charge but he was innocent. They have years worth of evidence against him it was not a fly by night investigation. They interviewed his "friends" as well as his guides and they all confirmed that he was outfitting and knowingly breaking the law. In Montana Outfitters have to file a plan with the state regarding every acre they are going to hunt on. He was hunting on public lands without a permit, on BMA lands where outfitting is not permitted and on private lands without permission.

I don't know how the guy can defend any of his actions as been reasonable or even justified. That is why he plead guilty, because he knew he was guilty.

Nemont

 

[elk_hunter]

Bottom line, the majority of us ethical hunters have a problem with this. It does nothing for ethical hunters all over the world and it sure is frustrating dealing with these bastards that think they are above the law and don't give a damn about anyone but themselves. Selfish sons of...

 

[JoseCuervo]

to avoid possible incarceration, hefty fines etc.

Why would there be possible incarceration and hefty fines if they did not commit the crime? Hate to break the news to you, but even if there is a "overzealous" prosecutor, the system uses Judges and Juries to determine guilt and innocence. And the Judge has to agree to the plea.

No Judge would allow an innocent person to plead guilty to avoid "possible incarceration, hefty fines etc".....

You can keep being paranoid of the "system", but the system is designed to work. If you remember, on Page One I even cut and pasted the offers to guide in Montana the guy had on the Internet. I am not sure how you can offer hunting in Montana and then claim you are innocent, but decide to plead guilty just to avoid fines and possible incarceration....

Why would you even attempt to feel sorry for a poacher?

 

[Tom]

Jose, I could sue you for breaking my leg yesterday, its a free country. It would cost you to defend yourself, even though my leg is not broke in our legal system.

Sometimes people plead guilty just to get on with life and support attorney's and judges vacations and cars, etc. I've heard of that, they believe they are innocent, but defending themselves is too costly, compared to being guilty. A legal fact has little to do with the real facts in a lot of situations, including that one.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Jose, I could sue you for breaking my leg yesterday, its a free country. It would cost you to defend yourself, even though my leg is not broke in our legal system.

Great example Tom. You just proved my point. I KNOW I did not break your leg, so, I am more than willing to NOT settle with you, to not "plead guilty", and I am willing to allow you to proceed in Court and spend YOUR money on YOUR wild goose chase, and, I am more than willing to seek compensation for my expenses defending your nonsense. I would love to meet the attorney that agrees to carry your case forward...

Sometimes people plead guilty just to get on with life and support attorney's and judges vacations and cars, etc. I've heard of that, they believe they are innocent, but defending themselves is too costly, compared to being guilty. A legal fact has little to do with the real facts in a lot of situations, including that one.

How can defending your "innocence" be too costly? How much does it "cost" to be a "Felon" the rest of your life? That would be outrageously expensive in terms of living a life with "Felon" next to your name.

And, again, how do you convince a Judge to accept your plea despite knowing you are innocent?

I don't believe your BS that innocent people plead guilty to crimes because they can't be bothered with the effort to mount a credible defense. Please cite me some cases where that has happened, or you, like Dubya, will be known as "All Hat and No Cattle".....

 

[Calif. Hunter]

It is up to you what you are willing to spend or can spend. Public Defenders are not always willing to spend a great deal of time and effort either if the outcome is in doubt.

An example - a guy in California, hunting bear with a handgun. Game Warden comes up to him and cites him for having a loaded handgun in his vehicle. It was in his camper that he was camping in - the vehicle was not being driven. The door of the camper was open and the warden could see the handgun. (It is legal to have a loaded firearm in your temporary residence/campsite in California and this was state land, not National Forest. It is also legal to hunt bear with a handgun.) The guy worked for Walmart and lived a couple hundred miles from where he was hunting and could not afford time off to keep going to court and fighting the DA, who was anti-gun and anti-hunting. The Public Defender was not a hunter, either, and had too many other cases - overworked, in other words.

The guy ended up pleading guilty to a lesser misdemeanor charge that allowed him to get his firearm back, keep his firearms rights and still hunt. Would I have done that? NO WAY. But I don't work at Walmart and I have attorney friends....

 

[TLC]

Nemont, thanks for that site. easy to understand. and what I thought it was, but wanted to be sure.

 

[Roadkil2L8]

Boyd Joseph Austin will never change. From illegal poaching, guiding and outfitting this guy has no regard for others. The whole world has wronged him and he always plays the victim. Now he thinks he is a dog breeder and selling puppies from a puppy mill line that has bad hips. His dog Baxley's Ginger has a rating of Moderate - Unilateral Right. This one grade above severe displaysia with active arthritis in the right hip. Her pups with carry the same displastic trait.

http://nebula.wsimg.com/b4213f816c8...ccessKeyId=B8A9A888CD5252365C36&disposition=0

https://www.google.com/search?q=doa...ox-red-labrador-retriever-puppies%2F;1024;972
https://www.google.com/search?q=doa...labrador-pointing-retriever-kennel%2F;150;225
https://www.google.com/search?q=doa...fox-red-labrador-retriever-puppies%2F;225;300
https://www.google.com/search?q=doa...i=2&ved=0CDwQ9QEwAw&biw=1366&bih=633#imgdii=_
https://www.google.com/search?q=doa....google.com%2F109622362604349018452;2048;1536

 

[Roadkil2L8]

Maybe we should start a discussion on how to pick the right waterfowl and upland hunting partner. For me all around it's a Lab from the correct lines! Health, performance and intelligence should be your main criteria for picking a dog for hunting, always.

 

[noharleyyet]

....those were the days.

 

[Roadkil2L8]

Are you familiar with the illegal guiding service Joe Austin was operating in Montana or would you like to talk dogs? My website is OVRCNY.COM if want to check out my Labs.


http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/tags.php?tag=fox+red+kennels

 

[noharleyyet]

Pump the brakes, my comment had naught to do with you, but since you asked, are you peddling wares using a six year old thread to toe the door?

Good looking pups by the way.

 

[Roadkil2L8]

Thanks, I put a lot of hard work into breeding and training. I primarily run hunt tests, but last week competed in my first Open Qualifier with my dog Gunner, A Shadow of Hawkeye's Garrison, SH WCX. He needs one more Master Pass to title out and is 2.6 yoa. I have a younger sibling to him that is running 150 yard field trial marks land/water/land at 6 months old, Owasco Valley's Delta Shadow Mayhem. She will complete her Junior Title this summer by 9 months old and start work on her Senior Passes. Next year Delta will run some Derbies.

 

[noharleyyet]

Nice looking website, sounds like a pro set up...best of luck.

 

[kenton]

The guides from that guide school, are they trained like their president does things? Man, CO, has a problem there, is that school any good for anything?

I know this is an old thread and I wasn't a member of Hunt Talk at the time but I have to take issue with this. I do understand its a legitimate question but I was a student at Coags at the time and I was involved in the packing out of that poached elk. I was interviewed by the wildlife officer a few weeks afterward and I consider this to be a low point on my hunting "career" but I saw nothing while at the school that wasn't top notch. I certainly not defending poaching and I don't support the school or anything like that. I saw some very good hardworking guides and some awful guides come out of there but I hope us good guides don't have our reputations tarnished. Anyway, I know this wasn't anything personal but I felt like I had to say my piece.

 

[Roadkil2L8]

I'm not that failiar with what happened in Colorado and there several good guides that honestly make there living in the hunting business legally. However, it only takes a few bad guides that have questionable practices or guide illegally to give the profession a bad name. For instance, the incident in Montana with DOA Outfitters. Joe Austin was running an illegal Guiding and Outfitting service from a Bed and Brekfast witouth either license. The resulting investigation landed him 17 charges and was based on long term investgation that is over 300 pages long. To this day, Joe Austin will say he is innocent of all charges. So, why did he plea guilty? Because of the excellent undercover work that was done by the Montana Game Wardens and the solid evidence they had compiled, Joe had no choice. He had to plea guilty. Great work done by my fellow brothers in law enforcement!!!

http://www.doaoutfitters.com/lodge/fox-red-labrador-retriever-puppies/#sthash.53wpgTVb.dpbs

 

[Roadkil2L8]

A little history as to why the the 'Fox Red" lab is not a rare color at all. It is also not indicative of the quality of a dog. When looking for that new member of your family and hunting partner, you need to look at the pedigree. Just because a breeder gives you a pedigree, doesn't mean that this is a quality breeding. As a buyer, you need to ask for certifications that have genetically checked the parents for recessive traits; such as, bad hips, elbows, eyes or CERF and recessive factors like CNM and EIC. There are 2 acceptable forms of hip certifications: The Orthopedic Foundation for Animals and Penn-Hip. If a breeder will not or cannot show you these types of certifications, you should look elsewhere for a puppy. If a breeder tries to substitute a so called ' Vets Certification', I can guarantee you they have something to hide. Reputable breeders make available all certifications readily available to a potential customer or go one step further and link a customer straight to the websites containing the information. Enjoy the history of the fox yellow lab or known as the original color and never chose a puppy based on color alone:

http://penara.com/foxred.html