Washington Hunter
Well-known member
I would've voted for it too, Matt! That's less tax I would have to pay. hump
Gas prices?
- Thread starter cjcj
- Start date
Hangar18
New member
Matt - IMO the minute our leadership starts following the "mood" of the country, which would be the same as concerning itself with popularity polls and basing leadership decisions directly on anticipated positive response in said polls, our country is doomed. This approach, "mood following", requires solutions that would necessarily invoke a positive emotional response. "Mood" is an emotion. No decision ever should be made based on emotion. I'm not in a position to argue which decisions are good and bad based on fact finding / due diligence.
Further, I think these days the masses (the majority, not all) are no longer capable of seeing the big picture or patient enough to wait for positive long-term solutions that require some short-term sacrifice. A perfect example of this is the unbelievably negative response to Bill Maher's book "When You Ride Alone, You Ride With Bin Laden." It is a play on an old WWII slogan that refered to Hitler. Compound Maher's message with Bush refusing to ask Americans to sacrifice anything. That would be hugely unpopular, but it would be the right thing to do.
Further, I think these days the masses (the majority, not all) are no longer capable of seeing the big picture or patient enough to wait for positive long-term solutions that require some short-term sacrifice. A perfect example of this is the unbelievably negative response to Bill Maher's book "When You Ride Alone, You Ride With Bin Laden." It is a play on an old WWII slogan that refered to Hitler. Compound Maher's message with Bush refusing to ask Americans to sacrifice anything. That would be hugely unpopular, but it would be the right thing to do.
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Matty,
I already knew you voted to raise the ciggerette tax. Your type is easy to predict.
I did not vote for the ciggerette tax. First off, I don't smoke and never have. I think cigerettes are one of the most vile products that man has ever invented. (How many PHD's have earned $60,000 + in this industry over the years?) I could care less whether a smoker blows a lung or comes down with cancer. It's their body, they can do with it what they want. They know the risks by now. I just don't want my tax contribution to go towards their healthcare. Don't like second hand smoke? Simple, stay away from smokers. They are pretty much treated like leppers today anyway. So why did I vote no?
Because the proceeds of this tax are going into the general fund. Like a crack whore addicted to more and more crack, todays government is addicted to more and more tax revenue, and they don't really care where it comes from. I like a glass of wine with dinner, should we tax the piss out of that next so we can raise more dollars for the general fund? Didn't our politicians try to raise the beer tax recently? A few years ago, the libs in Washington State wanted to tax lattes. What a joke. Now if the tax collected from smokers went specifically towards programs to help people quit smoking and to pay for their increased burden on the public health system, well then maybe I would have supported it. But it didn't, it just went for quick fix for the tax whores.
I already knew you voted to raise the ciggerette tax. Your type is easy to predict.
I did not vote for the ciggerette tax. First off, I don't smoke and never have. I think cigerettes are one of the most vile products that man has ever invented. (How many PHD's have earned $60,000 + in this industry over the years?) I could care less whether a smoker blows a lung or comes down with cancer. It's their body, they can do with it what they want. They know the risks by now. I just don't want my tax contribution to go towards their healthcare. Don't like second hand smoke? Simple, stay away from smokers. They are pretty much treated like leppers today anyway. So why did I vote no?
Because the proceeds of this tax are going into the general fund. Like a crack whore addicted to more and more crack, todays government is addicted to more and more tax revenue, and they don't really care where it comes from. I like a glass of wine with dinner, should we tax the piss out of that next so we can raise more dollars for the general fund? Didn't our politicians try to raise the beer tax recently? A few years ago, the libs in Washington State wanted to tax lattes. What a joke. Now if the tax collected from smokers went specifically towards programs to help people quit smoking and to pay for their increased burden on the public health system, well then maybe I would have supported it. But it didn't, it just went for quick fix for the tax whores.
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
BHR, so what do you think about a gas tax? Washington state's gas tax may be going up 15 cents a gallon (it's currently at 28 cents.) Seems more fair than a cigarette tax as most everybody will have to pay (in proportion to how much gas they consume.) Also, supposedly the money generated by the gas tax would be used for roads and other transportation projects. Sounds fair to me.
cjcj
New member
I agree with B.H.R.....and i will go one step further...NO FREAKING NEW TAXES ! PERIOD ! hump
These political assholes can`t balance their debt to income ratio [tuff shit]. take a hard look at the taxes we now pay [its bullshit]...some places even have Federal/State/and even city income taxes W.T.F. haven`t we had enough?... and ALL taxes SHOULD be DEDUCTIBLE but THEY are not. :MAD
Arizona is the fastest growing state in the country and our governor says were broke...look at California [ nearly bankrupt]... You guys who vote for ANY new tax are nuts [I.M.O.] |oo
These political assholes can`t balance their debt to income ratio [tuff shit]. take a hard look at the taxes we now pay [its bullshit]...some places even have Federal/State/and even city income taxes W.T.F. haven`t we had enough?... and ALL taxes SHOULD be DEDUCTIBLE but THEY are not. :MAD
Arizona is the fastest growing state in the country and our governor says were broke...look at California [ nearly bankrupt]... You guys who vote for ANY new tax are nuts [I.M.O.] |oo
BigHornRam
Well-known member
W. H.,
I believe we pay about .50 a gallon here in MT both in state and federal gas tax. I'm ok with that as long as the revenues are not pissed away on stupid stuff (ok I'm a realist, some of it can get pissed away on stupid stuff, just not too much). If they wanted to raise the taxes more, I would only be in favor of it if it went specifically towards alternative energy research. And every dime for that better be spent wisely.
I believe we pay about .50 a gallon here in MT both in state and federal gas tax. I'm ok with that as long as the revenues are not pissed away on stupid stuff (ok I'm a realist, some of it can get pissed away on stupid stuff, just not too much). If they wanted to raise the taxes more, I would only be in favor of it if it went specifically towards alternative energy research. And every dime for that better be spent wisely.
Calif. Hunter
Active member
Carl Reiner, the actor/producer, managed to get a cigarette tax initiative passed here a couple of years ago. The money was supposed to go to stop smoking campaigns, aid for smokers quitting, health costs and, of course, for "education." So far, it has raised billions and funded about 3 TV commercials....and a new state bureaucracy headed by Carl Reiner's buddies, who make a fortune via their yearly salary to be on the board. Practically nothing has been spent for the original purposes.
cjcj
New member
He should go back to his "original" name ...MEATHEAD.
BHR- Personally, I usually vote against all new taxes, mill levy's, sales tax etc. The reason I voted for a cigarette tax had nothing to do with the governments spending of the money. It was a personal issue with me. It was actually something my mom and a couple of other people said. They were talking and said "if the price goes up anymore than this I'll either have to slow down on the amount I smoke or I'll quit." Personally, I was hoping they would quit when the price went up, as it is, my mom has slowed down tremendously because the price is too high. I guess, in this case, I was looking at it on a purely emotional level (my mom not smoking as much). Maybe she will live a little longer because of this tax. I can only hope.
BHR- How great of a job do you feel your President is doing? Do you like the Agricultural amnesty program? Do you like the bigger government that is being formed? How 'bout that trade deficit? How 'bout the value of the dollar? etc. etc. etc. |oo |oo 
WH's OutdoorsChick
New member
OH GAWD |oo |oo |oo |oo
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Matty,
Right now I think the President is doing an ok job, not great just ok. It's a tough job pleasing an ever increasing spoiled population that expects the President to agree with them on every issue or they throw a fit.
Ag Amnesty Program? Need more information before I form an opinion.
Big Government? Don't like it. Kerry would have been much worse but I hate picking between the lesser of two evils. But I'm a realist on this issue...it goes back to the spoiled population comment...what's best for ME.
Trade deficit? Bad. Would be better to provide resources from US soil, instead of purchasing them from other countries. (oil, timber, minerals, ect.). How to fix this? See next comment.
Value of the dollar? A lowering dollar means that purchasing items from other countries ($60 a barrel oil, Canadian hunts) becomes more and more expensive for Americans to buy. To me this is good thing. We will then focus on purchasing goods and services here in America creating jobs for Americans.
How about you Matty. What are your comments to these issues?
Right now I think the President is doing an ok job, not great just ok. It's a tough job pleasing an ever increasing spoiled population that expects the President to agree with them on every issue or they throw a fit.
Ag Amnesty Program? Need more information before I form an opinion.
Big Government? Don't like it. Kerry would have been much worse but I hate picking between the lesser of two evils. But I'm a realist on this issue...it goes back to the spoiled population comment...what's best for ME.
Trade deficit? Bad. Would be better to provide resources from US soil, instead of purchasing them from other countries. (oil, timber, minerals, ect.). How to fix this? See next comment.
Value of the dollar? A lowering dollar means that purchasing items from other countries ($60 a barrel oil, Canadian hunts) becomes more and more expensive for Americans to buy. To me this is good thing. We will then focus on purchasing goods and services here in America creating jobs for Americans.
How about you Matty. What are your comments to these issues?
MarvB
Well-known member
BHR- Your right, Montanans pays about $0.475/gal in State & Fed tax on gasoline . California is the third highest (at 51) in the nation just under Hawaii and Nevada (54 and 52). The average (I think these were 2002 statistics mind you) for the U.S was $0.42 or about 20% of the fuel price.
Georgia is second from the bottom at $0.306.
Anyone care to guess what state pays the least?
Georgia is second from the bottom at $0.306.
Anyone care to guess what state pays the least?
Washington Hunter
Well-known member
Marv, I would guess Alaska?
BuzzH
Well-known member
Marv...Texas?
BuzzH
Well-known member
Heres a link to gas taxes by state:
http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/statistics/gas_taxes_by_state_2002.html
A little out-of-date but AK was the lowest, Wyoming second lowest...probably why gas is still under $2 a gallon for me.
The sad fact is though, I'd rather pay $3 a gallon and have my mule deer country left intact instead of riddled with roads and well pads... |oo
http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/statistics/gas_taxes_by_state_2002.html
A little out-of-date but AK was the lowest, Wyoming second lowest...probably why gas is still under $2 a gallon for me.
The sad fact is though, I'd rather pay $3 a gallon and have my mule deer country left intact instead of riddled with roads and well pads... |oo
MarvB
Well-known member
Yup...guess its always cheaper to drink draught then out of the can...AK was indeed the lowest at $0.264/gal. My initial guess would have been Texas as well, kind of thought that EVERYTHING in the far NW reaches would have been more expensive.
Couple of other things I found interesting about my own state (of Kalifornica) that I didn't know prior was that it ranks 4th in both crude oil reserves and crude oil production: Other (fast facts)
Population: 35,655,404 (2004) ranked 1st
Per Capita Income: $33,749 (2003) ranked 10th
Total Energy Consumption: 7.9 quadrillion Btu (2001), ranked 2nd
Per Capita Energy Consumption: 227 million Btu (2001), ranked 49th
Total Petroleum Consumption: 75.6 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
Gasoline Consumption: 40.5 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 1st
Distillate Fuel Consumption: 11.2 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
Liquefied Petroleum Gas Consumption: 1.3 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 9th
Jet Fuel Consumption: 11.2 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
The state that had the highest energy consumption per person was Alaska followed by Wyoming. Learn something new every day....
Couple of other things I found interesting about my own state (of Kalifornica) that I didn't know prior was that it ranks 4th in both crude oil reserves and crude oil production: Other (fast facts)
Population: 35,655,404 (2004) ranked 1st
Per Capita Income: $33,749 (2003) ranked 10th
Total Energy Consumption: 7.9 quadrillion Btu (2001), ranked 2nd
Per Capita Energy Consumption: 227 million Btu (2001), ranked 49th
Total Petroleum Consumption: 75.6 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
Gasoline Consumption: 40.5 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 1st
Distillate Fuel Consumption: 11.2 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
Liquefied Petroleum Gas Consumption: 1.3 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 9th
Jet Fuel Consumption: 11.2 million gallons per day (2001), ranked 2nd
The state that had the highest energy consumption per person was Alaska followed by Wyoming. Learn something new every day....
BigHornRam
Well-known member
Marv,
If you throw home heating in as part of "energy consumption", it's easy to see why Wyoming and Alaska would be leaders in this catagory. Also that they are remote large states that require long distance to get to anywhere would also be a factor. But having cheap gas is definately a factor as well.
Matt the Mouth,
Let's hear your koolaid. You may not like Bush but you would have to admit that he's a better man than this country deserves right now, and a better man than who the democrats put forward.
If you throw home heating in as part of "energy consumption", it's easy to see why Wyoming and Alaska would be leaders in this catagory. Also that they are remote large states that require long distance to get to anywhere would also be a factor. But having cheap gas is definately a factor as well.
Matt the Mouth,
Let's hear your koolaid. You may not like Bush but you would have to admit that he's a better man than this country deserves right now, and a better man than who the democrats put forward.
