Bill allowing crossbows during MT archery

[Deleted member 28227]

Truly disabled or elderly I would not object to at all, but others, No Thanks!

x2... and I think it's misleading to try and compare MT elk hunting to OH or MI whitetails, those hunts are so different and the addition of the weapon has totally different end goals. I would be interested to know if WY has any data on the effects.

 

[joelweb]

This is a foot in the door as a first step to opening it up.

 

[BrentD]

x2... and I think it's misleading to try and compare MT elk hunting to OH or MI whitetails, those hunts are so different and the addition of the weapon has totally different end goals. I would be interested to know if WY has any data on the effects.

Just to be clear, I would be against them for "normal" hunters in ANY archery season ANYWHERE.

 

[tjones]

Here in the Bitterroot we have an archery whitetail unit that is open for 4 1/2 months cross guns would have an impact.

 

[dcopas78]

x2... and I think it's misleading to try and compare MT elk hunting to OH or MI whitetails, those hunts are so different and the addition of the weapon has totally different end goals. I would be interested to know if WY has any data on the effects.

I agree. It's like comparing apples and oranges. Primary driver for bag limits here is insurance companies and grain farmers. Primary means of executing those bag numbers is more options for method of take. I'd be interested in that info for Wyoming as well, if it is available.

 

[300stw]

the internet is full of 90-120 yard harvests now days with compounds, does a cross bow shoot farther than that, with having 5 shoulder surgeries, i have 3 compounds hanging on the wall,

i figured my archery days are over, dont know i even have the "want" to try a crossbow,,, it seems technology has allready put us on a slippery slope

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Like I said depends, if the point of an archery unit is to allow people to hunt safely, ie suburban areas, than go for it.

 

[JM77]

As WapitiBob said, crossbows have been legal during our special archery season in Wyoming for four decades. The traditional month long archery season is still in effect and I know of no changes due to increased harvest, in fact just the opposite. In most areas that have type 9 archery tags, which generally increased tags numbers in the areas, the type 9 tags get a month long season and all other tags get a two week special archery season. Also, for elk, our archery season is during the peak of the rut.

Last fall I was sent a photo of the G&F Director's son with a fine bull elk and a Ravin crossbow was in the picture. If you believe in Montana that including crossbows in your archery season will have negative impacts, I would say based on Wyoming, and I have been hunting here over 40 years, that would not happen.

 

[Nameless Range]

Here’s an interesting article on crossbow efficacy from meateater that came out last week. http://themeateater.com/hunt/archery/crossbows-surge-in-whitetail-country

If it is for the elderly and disabled only, then I have no problem with it. It’s true that some slopes are slippery, but I’ll leave the crampons at home for this one.

I‘ll admit it is somewhat of a whataboutism unrelated to this bill, but it is a little baffling to me that such an opposition to giving old or disabled folks crossbows brings, while every year the technology of compound bows progresses in such a way that it probably shouldn’t even be called archery anymore. I feel like if the resource and seasons are the real concern, that is where the focus should lie, no matter how inconvenient and unpopular such a focus would be.

I hunt with a compound bow, and if I met some old-timer in the hills with a crossbow I would be happy to cross his/her path. Same goes for someone unable to pull a vertical archery setup for reasons related to disability.

 

[BrentD]

... every year the technology of compound bows progresses in such a way that it probably shouldn’t even be called archery anymore.

c

We passed that point LONG, LONG ago.

 

[VAspeedgoat]

I agree that comparing eastern whitetail to Western elk is not a fair comparison. However, they have been legal in VA for a while now and there is virtually no effect on the real issue: numbers of hunters. Does it make it easier on a working stiff like me who doesn't have time to practice? Hell yes, that's why I got one. Hard to argue against that. But the issue here was hunter numbers and it hasn't done much to change that. There was an initial blip and then the numbers remain similar to before. Only the ratio of crossbows to compounds change.

The western guys worried about rut hunts with crossbows may very well have an issue. But, as far as the end of hunting as we know it, it just doesn't happen.

 

[brnsvllyjohn]

300stw

My effective range is far less than the guys I hunt with who shoot compounds. I can shoot to about 50 yards. They can all shoot to around 75. Those short fat bolts drop like a rock after about 50. My hunting buddies were all opposed to me getting a crossbow until they started shooting mine at targets. They are no longer worried about me shooting a gun in archery season. I had my disabled archers permit for 4 years before I even purchased a crossbow because the other hunters attitudes were so negative. They feel differently now. I have taken one buck in 4 seasons with my crossbow and a couple of other crossbow hunters I know haven't been successful yet even though they were usually successful with their compounds when they were younger and able bodied.

The one thing letting seniors or disabled people hunt with a crossbow will do is keep the family hunting together longer. It allows me to go on archery hunts with my son even if I am not very successful. That is a good thing for the sport. Keeping the next generation participating by letting the seniors participate.

 

[schmalts]

It has been a factor here in WI on deer. More hunters in the field during archery season because now practice is not much of a factor anymore. Taxidermists will tell you that the amount of bigger bucks has gone up during the archery season and it is a lot of crossbow shooters. DRN stats show the same. However i see more advantage of using a crossbow during WT deer than for elk because of the close range hunting and the drawing back to get the shot is more of a challenge on a WT deer at 10-20 yards than an elk at 20-60 yards. I used a crossbow on 2 deer since the law passed, going back and forth as my shoulders will allow. I hate the crossbow, and just 2 weeks ago spent 700.00 on a lighter poundage bow to try and stick with a bow if possible. I have not hunted elk with a bow for 4 years now because of fear of not being able to shoot enough poundage and shoot well enough because of my shoulders. I can pull back 50 pounds, with some pain but after 20 shots of practice i hurt for a couple days. Would I take advantage of a crossbow in MT for elk? Probably at least some years.

 

[Point Creep]

MT has bigger things to fret about. Why is the archery hunting so great in WY where everybody can use a crossbow?

 

[RobG]

My effective range is far less than the guys I hunt with who shoot compounds. I can shoot to about 50 yards. They can all shoot to around 75. Those short fat bolts drop like a rock after about 50.

If that is true then that’s probably part of the reason Wyoming still has lots of elk. However, all they have to do is apply some technology to change that. There is way more ability to store potential energy in a crossbow.

 

[RobG]

MT has bigger things to fret about.

Namely you cashing in by selling all your hunting spots!

 

[BucksnDucks]

Truly disabled or elderly I would not object to at all, but others, No Thanks!

This is my thought as well, unfortunately in Ca I've seen the abuse first hand. Guys fully capable of pulling a bowstring can apply for premium archery only tags then just get a doctor's note. California is so worried about offending someone or getting sued by the ADA (American's with disability Act?) Wardens can not question a hunter's disability or ask for proof.
The process here is seriously flawed, with lots of extra opportunity for archery only deer and turkey the benevolent idea is taken advantage of by many.
I've seen similar abuse with duck blinds set up for the "mobility impaired" meant for hunters that have a hard time getting around.

 

[Straight Arrow]

There is some question as to the legitimacy of the crossbow as an archery weapon, in that it employs the distinctly different cocked mechanical advantage, typically sights with an optical scope, and shoots a bolt rather than an arrow. If this unnecessary bill passes, would it then become a "bow only" season as opposed to an "archery only" season?

 

[tjones]

For years in Montana the disabled permit to hunt from a vehicle was abused. Abused so much FWP finally had to tighten up requirements. Disabled and crossbows would be no different unless there were very, very strict requirements, which would not happen.

I can see the line forming now for scoped, silently cocking, 400 FPS crossbows.

 

[PrairieHunter]

Ohio's deer quality has improved in the time frame since crossbow hunting has been allowed. The season has, I believe, been lengthened also.

So crossbows have not been a problem in Wyoming for quite some time now, and archery seasons have actually been lengthened since crossbows were legalized in Ohio and Nebraska.

Does anyone have any actual documentation of a state having to shorten a archery season due to crossbows?

I have yet to see an example of such, even though it comes up every time this is discussed and at this point most of the country allows crossbows during archery season, 26 states according one one link I saw.

The reality is things like crossbows will likely be allowed in most every state in 5-10 years. Same deal with muzzleloaders with 209 primers and smokeless powder. Times are a changing, and the manufacturers are good at changing laws.

But it is entertaining to watch how much crossbows bother some people. If you can't deal with technology it's going to be rough going as we are seeing it change how we hunt with every weapon. Crossbows and compounds good to 100 yards, 1,000 yard rifles, 500 yards muzzleloaders, rangefinders that go a mile, ballistic apps for phones, etc..

The days of traditional hunting are gone for all but a very select few who still have the skills to craft and use truly traditional hunting equipment. The rest of us are just candy asses using different levels of technology that suit our needs and finances.