Had M/G/S/B licenses 4 years in a row? That's BS for sure. 4 years in a row for a general deer or elk tag doesn't seem that weird to me. There are still several buddy's of mine stationed/retired in Cheyenne, it wouldn't be that weird to be able to get a tag and keep hunting with them year after year.
WY proposed regulation change Disabled Veterans!
- Thread starter Addicting
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Addicting
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I’ve had a license for 4 years in a row. I’ve gotten them off the public list or that general tag last year with helping Dave.
How many were tags off the list? What about all the tags, every year, that go unused?
These types of transactions are not the ones abusing the system.
The guys who work at the NP who funnel and take MGS tags for themselves and their buddies is the abuse.
cgasner1
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So why not just ax msg from the program and give it to a alt that the state drew for next in line
Pucky Freak
Well-known member
What does that mean? Link? If language is removed, why does it matter if they still get all their tags?
IIRC, the rest of the unit sees tag cuts, but the One Shot hunt maintains their hold on these tags that go to the highest bidder? At least that's how I recall it from a few years back when there was some drama about it.
Addicting
Well-known member
The regulations specifically had a listed definition of the one shot hunt club.
They removed the definition but kept all the regulations for 160 antelope tags.
@brocksw I hope NAPF puts in for these tags.
(A) Wyoming Sstatutes provide for up to one hundred sixty (160)
licenses to be available for up to two (2) antelope hunt events each year. These licenses shall be
issued above quotas established for the hunt area(s) and shall be allocated to residents and
nonresidents, taking into consideration resource management requirements as designated by the
Wildlife Division Department. These licenses are exempt from the provisions in this Chapter
Commission regulations limiting the number of big game licenses an individual may obtain in
one (1) calendar year. Applications shall be reviewed by the Department and brought before the
Commission for final approval and selection. The Commission may designate an organization to
receive antelope hunt event licenses for up to three (3) consecutive hunting seasons before
requiring the organization to reapply. Applications for any future antelope hunt event licenses
shall be accepted as advertised by the Department
JM77
Well-known member
Do you think this was the intent of donating tags? While all the gaming is going on to benefit those who know the system, how many vets that really need to participate, which was the original intent of all this, are going without?
Addicting
Well-known member
Yes, using tags that sit on the list or a general tag a friend donates is what the intent was.
The rest are only going without because of the gate keepers and snail mail. In this thread @thomas89 witness how hard it is to get the NP to even return calls.
What I learned is you have to send all of your stuff months in advance to allow processing. That was not the intent. Not when folks that are local can go down and have it done in an hour. That is how the Cheyenne folks are getting high demand tags every year.
A tag can get donated in the middle of season. Is the intent to let these tags just go to waste? Or should a guy who started in June grab them and try and make a go out it.
Out of those type 1 tags, 2 antelope were killed, that is not hurting Wyoming.
Addicting
Well-known member
If you really want to fix this allow submission by email. Make the high demand tags a lotto.
Don’t force guys to start their own NP to get thru the process in a timely manner.
Don’t let it be the Cheyenne tag grab club.
Don’t force guys to start their own NP to get thru the process in a timely manner.
Don’t let it be the Cheyenne tag grab club.
BuzzH
Well-known member
I remember something quite different when the veterans hunts were approved.
The way it was sold was that it would help get vets out in the field and possibly into a new hobby. It seemed to me that at the time the focus was really on getting new veteran hunters involved. I never heard it being advertised as a way for the same vet to get to hunt year after year after year.
I think the regulations are now needed, thanks to the various groups and hunters that are clearly taking advantage of the generosity of Wyoming. I believe that 2 full priced tags per veteran hunter every 5 years is more than adequate and more than fair. If a veteran wants to hunt more often, there are other states, or they can enter the Wyoming draw with all other NR hunters.
Where I would be willing to work on this issue is the allocation of the better LQ tags. Those absolutely need to be made available via drawing for any vet that is interested. My thought there is to have a week or so period where the tags are advertised and have NP's or hunters themselves apply then issue via a drawing.
Also, as to the leftover tags that aren't used. I would say have those vets that have been participating or have participated in the past, try to encourage other vets to use those. Also, the tags are not "wasted", the WYGF is still getting funding from them, and every year lots of tags go unused and unhunted for a variety of reasons.
Not every tag needs to be attached to a dead animal for there to be value.
I'm going to be supporting the 44 regulations as well.
Addicting
Well-known member
That is exactly what I’ve been doing. Each year is a different invite.
Do you know how many have shown interest in doing it on their own? Zero
I didn’t see any complaints the first year I organized it to get Cushman an elk. G&F biologist and HT helped get tags transferred.
Next year was the HT Vet elk camp. 2 more different Vets same scenario.
Next year 1 Vet, I made contact / friends with a large rancher. They facilitated it.
Over the next few years same scenario a few more times.
This last year was Dave, while not a Vet we figured out some point sharing.
That was the intent the way you laid it out. These vets won’t do it on their own. They were intimidated by the process and shown it’s possible.
This year it’s a Vet from AZ I’m coordinating with. He wants to try and shoot an antelope.
Should he spend the next 5 years on a HwH waitlist or should I take him? I initially was thinking about at HT Vet camp which everyone was interested in. You even spoke up about tags and help. I decided it would be too much and went back to focusing on one.
The system does need reform. Stopping this, because there are folks in Cheyenne self serving high demand tags is not the answer.
Especially, with the way it’s written the Cheyenne folks are just going to keep on doing the same shady stuff 2 out of 5 years. In the interm their buddies will get the tags.
IDiot
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I'd like to see just a draw/randomized list for these tags. Qualified vets submit their rating letter and a fee if needed and wait to see if they draw or get called. No nonprofit gatekeepers, simple, fair, hard to cheat the system. Limits on numbers of tags someone can receive or wait times before reapplying would also be a good thing to spread out the opportunities.
In theory if they were all decent tags I'd think this could work. Every year the first tags donated are some of the worst antelope units in the state. Last minute you'll get general deer/elk tags donated. Would be very tough to plan if I'm hunting antelope in NE Wyoming or elk outside Cody. I've never seen a M/S/G tag make it to the list. My guess is that people that donate the high end tags contact these nonprofits, and the nonprofits already have their buds on speed dial.
There isn't a lack of opportunity, there's a lack of assistance to get these tags. From my experience, these NP's are all about getting a vet a tag if it somehow benefits them raising more money/tags. The program also works if a vet calls the NP and says, "hey I want to go hunt deer, can you snag me a general tag?". The problem is that you're asking these NP's to just do the transfer from the goodness of their hearts, which has apparently gotten lost somewhere along the way.
BuzzH
Well-known member
As to the not so great tags, IMO, that is where these non profits need to start stepping up. There isn't a single pronghorn unit in the NE part of the state that doesn't either have outfitters or landowners that would participate. The NP's have the data to know what tags they routinely get and also should have been making contact with outfitters and landowners all along. This program did not just start last year.
While I get that there will always be logistical problems, doing some better work on the front end would solve a lot of them and get more veterans out in the field. The idea wasn't to just hit the easy button and high grade the tags you want. This is NO different than a regular Joe hunter drawing these tags and having to do the work before hand.
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To go along with this, I wish states would stop just focusing on disabled vets and add in disabled LEO/FF as well.
JM77
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If they meet the requirements in Wyoming they are included.
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TheDudeAbides
Well-known member
If a Wyoming resident wants to be a part of the tag donation program and donates the tag to an individual, then there shouldn't be a limit on it how many years in a row.
Nor should there be a waiting period.
It's there tag and they can donate it how they see fit.
If the tag is donated to a general pool, left over, or by other means available, you can do whatever you want to do with. First come, waiting period, or draw.
As a non veteran, I do support 100% veterans being able to hunt 5 days early - whether they are "physically fit" or not.
I can hunt on the season opener with those who do not meet the criteria to hunt 5 days early.
Fraud is still fraud, have oversight and prosecute those that are breaking the rules.
Rather than punishing those that are not.
Addicting
Well-known member
Wyoming Veterans Fear Changing Disability Hunting Regs Could Freeze Them Out
Wyoming groups that host hunts for disabled veterans fear a proposal to change Game and Fish regulations on what counts as a disability could freeze out…
cowboystatedaily.com
appaloosa
Well-known member
This is a guy who is taking advantage of a 5 day season extension as a "100% disabled military veteran". This is exactly the abuse the Department is trying to avoid by modifying the requirements. The changes won't affect those with qualifying physical disabilities who would benefit from the advantage of a 5 days season extension.
This bull was killed on a general unit in Wyoming days before the season opened. As were all the bucks he so proudly displays behind him during the comentary.
This bull was killed on a general unit in Wyoming days before the season opened. As were all the bucks he so proudly displays behind him during the comentary.
