What we have here is a failure to find justification for war

[Hangar18]

Originally posted by ElkGunner:
So with both of these countries beholden to Iraq financially, why would either of them agree to any military action? They were both too busy gleening the profit of their treachery.

It is? Oh, you mean you didn't quote him, give him credit? Again, what does that have to do with GNP and economies?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Uhhh....read back up there...

But DanR said the French (and German) economies were 'beholden' to Iraq. And you have defined 'beholden' as "indebted"...or "owing something"....

 

[Hangar18]

This failure to find justification is the kind of crap that Kerry would cater to. He would have you believe that we needed France's agreement to invade Iraq when France was making millions selling weapons to Iraq in direct opposition to international sanctions. Germany, while not selling weapons, was certainly selling the machinery to manufacture weapons. So with both of these countries beholden to Iraq financially, why would either of them agree to any military action? They were both too busy gleening the profit of their treachery.

But DanR said the French (and German) economies were 'beholden' to Iraq.

Where did DanR mention their ECONOMIES were beholden?

 

[JoseCuervo]

Uhhh...maybe when he said this????

So with both of these countries beholden to Iraq financially

 

[Hangar18]

I won't assume he meant anything unless he said it. He didn't say it. Based on what he SAID, combined with the contents of the article I posted, I would say he is correct in stating France was beholden to Iraq financially since French politicians (who supposedly represent the COUNTRY, not the ECONOMY or GNP) received payments from Saddam "to gain support for lifting UN sanctions and influencing French policy"

 

[JoseCuervo]

So now it is the French politicians that own Total and Elf-Aquitaine? That is how you tie the "beholden"?

 

[Hangar18]

So now it is the French politicians that own Total and Elf-Aquitaine?

No.

The disclosure will embarrass President Jacques Chirac as it follows on from claims last week by the Iraq Survey Group that Saddam indirectly paid French politicians and individuals to gain support for lifting UN sanctions and influencing French policy. The ISG's claims were dismissed by Chirac as politically motivated.

 

[danr55]

Why not let Danr55 clear it up. What I said was that the economies of both France and Germany were beholden to Iraq, which they were. They both held markers from Saddam's government which was intended to be repaid in oil or in oil certificates. In exchange for these "monies", they were selling weapons, munitions and machinery to make munitions, arms and other equipment.

Regardless of the symantics EG, you're showing your butt to the world again arguing a point that is irrelivant. The intent of the statement was obvious and there is no implication that the GNP of either country was in jeapordy by the deal, but there is equal evidence to show that the deals were sizeable. Sizeable enough that they didn't want to lose them.

So quit being a ... wait a minute, are you a lawyer?