Using your GPS to access public lands

[sbhooper]

IF the piece of land in question is actually surrounded by private land, I do not have issue with the lockout unless there is a road to it. If one section of public land is touching another section, to me it should illegal to block access. I don't care if it is exact on the spot corner to corner. If they are touching on a map, then they should be considered to be touching.

Oak, I am not trying to say that leases are the problem. I am just saying that the land-owners that hold those leases are blocking off access to land that is taxpayer owned and subsidized.

 

[Southwind]

Hunt maps has helped considerably in the conversation that in the past I believe a lot of land owner/leasee's could bluff a hunter out of access. I wonder in Wyoming specifically if there are any local groups or organizations that are fighting the access battle or are the owner/leasee's just to powerful and well funded?

 

[Washington Hunter]

It's true that a GPS isn't necessarily going to show you the EXACT property corner location. BUT, if it has never been surveyed and the actual property corner location is not monumented, then the landowner does not know where the corner is either. How can the landowner say you are trespassing because you don't know where the corner is, when he doesn't know where it is either? He can't. If the exact corner location is not known then a person should be able to cross from corner of public land to the adjacent corner of the other section of public land, regardless of if you cross in the right spot.

 

[Colberjs]

It's true that a GPS isn't necessarily going to show you the EXACT property corner location. BUT, if it has never been surveyed and the actual property corner location is not monumented, then the landowner does not know where the corner is either. How can the landowner say you are trespassing because you don't know where the corner is, when he doesn't know where it is either? He can't. If the exact corner location is not known then a person should be able to cross from corner of public land to the adjacent corner of the other section of public land, regardless of if you cross in the right spot.

This makes perfect sense!!

I think a certain number of land owners get their jollies being pricks and restricting access to land they know hunters have full rights to be on.

 

[Colberjs]

Wouldn't the burden of proof be on the landowner or law enforcement agency to prove you were trespassing? Innocent until proven guilty. You can't be guilty of trespassing if they can't prove it.

 

[WT_in_MT]

In MT, the question of legality revolves around whether or not crossing through the airspace above the private property constitutes trespass or not.

 

[Colberjs]

In MT, the question of legality revolves around whether or not crossing through the airspace above the private property constitutes trespass or not.

As I mentioned previously, that would mean every pilot to fly across the state is trespassing.

 

[Jorgy]

so I get that you can't corner cross in Wyoming, but could you fly into that inaccessible public land? if so, seems like you could have a lot of fun in court trying to get the legal definition of how far over land is acceptable to not be tresspassing. can't step, but what about jumping or a temp bridge of 2x4's

 

[WT_in_MT]

As I mentioned previously, that would mean every pilot to fly across the state is trespassing.

Actually, no. Research airspace ownership and you'll find it's, unfortunately, not as black-and-white as you'd like to think.

 

[Washington Hunter]

Wouldn't the burden of proof be on the landowner or law enforcement agency to prove you were trespassing? Innocent until proven guilty. You can't be guilty of trespassing if they can't prove it.

Yes, that's the way I look at it.

I'd ask the landowner to show me where exactly I set foot on his land. If he can't, then how was I trespassing?

 

[CabinFever]

This topic has been beat to death on here. I'm sure some courts would prosecute while others would not. I would love for corner crossing to be legal, but I understand why it isn't. If you can't be certain your not stepping on private property than there's a good chance your trespassing, and private property rights have to be respected. I wouldn't want a bunch of strangers hopping over the corner of my fence in my backyard, I'm pretty sure I'd consider that trespassing and it'd likely damage my fence. The fault IMO lies with the land agencies for selling off checker-boarded parcels without securing public access to the public land.

Bottom line private property rights have to be respected, but as soon as corner crossing passes I'll be hop-scotching my way to what used to be inaccessible public land.

 

[wyoming556]

Since this subject has been beat to death how about accessing public land through railroad tracks?

In many of the places I hunt there are railroad tracks next to the road and public land immediately behind the tracks. Most of the crossings are labeled as "private" and have no trespassing signs on them. I have seen hunters cross the tracks to hunt on many occasions. I don't know if it is possible to get permission from the railroad company or if it is just something that is not enforced and people just do it.

 

[Colberjs]

Jet packs FTW...

 

[Topgun 30-06]

What WH has posted on 11/7 is exactly why the Wyoming G&F will no longer cite people for corner jumping. The head honchoes in Cheyenne directed the field employees, who all have a Garmin GPS with map chips, not to investigate corner jumping complaints after they lost a case a few years ago in court when a guy pled not guilty to trespassing. However, as WB mentioned in his post, you need to be aware of whether the County Sheriff in the county you are hunting will cite you for it. It also goes a little further than that in that if you are issued a ticket for trespassing in a corner jumping situation and enter a not guilty plea instead of paying the ticket, it is then up to the County Prosecutor to handle the case. Some will handle the case, while others will not, and if the Sheriff knows that he will normally not have his personnel cite you because of the chance of a person taking it to court and the case being dropped. Therefore, in Wyoming it is best to approach the local Prosecutor and find out their position on corner jumping in their county BEFORE each hunting season. Since these persons may move on to other positions it is necessary to make sure they are still in charge BEFORE you hunt each year so you don't get nailed because it's up to the individual in charge as to how they want to handle corner jumping. Having hunted in Wyoming most years since 1994, I'm pretty well up to speed on this issue and how to handle it if you plan on hunting any area where you may want/need to corner jump to access a piece of public land.
As far as the RR issue, that is private property and if you cross the tracks without permission, which will probably not be given due to a lawsuit possibility in case of an accident, it would be the same as going directly across any other piece of private property without permission. People get away with it because there are no RR personnel handling that type of issue with the miles of tracks they would have to be watching.

 

[Corax]

This checkerboard business goes back to the 1870s or thereabouts when the railroads were being built - the railroad got 50% of the land for 10 miles on either side of the railroad. I think the interested parties knew what the result would be.

IMO, this issue is the same as any other "special interest" issue - the ones who care most strongly about it, and who influence the legislators the most, are those most affected by it - in this case the landowners. Whether it benefits the general public, or is "fair" is pretty much irrelevant.

The more we attempt to influence the legislature (state and federal) the more chance we have of prevailing. So write letters, support the candidate you favor, and vote.