So WHAT does Kerry stand for?

[Iron Buck]

Ever wonder what Kerry really thinks?

So, this guy John Kerry is the moderate alternative to Howard Dean? Yeah, right - in the sense that getting hit with a brick is the moderate form of being smacked with a sledgehammer.

What does John Kerry believe?

Well, he believes that illegal immigrants should be given a blanket amnesty provided they avoid the border patrol for a sufficient period of time.

He wants to force American businesses to get into "compartive pay" vis a vis male and female employees. This is the abomination wherein we get government bureaucrats figuring out the "just" wage for any particular job, and then insisting it be paid, regardless of economic rationality.

Wants to force kids to volunteer for community service as a pre-requisite for graduting high school.

Thinks that disarming the United States is the best means to convince our enemies not to arm (didn't we do away with this nonsense in the 1980's?)

Apparantly thinks the President of United States is the School Board President in Chief - wants to provide massive new funding for class size reduction; leaving aside the debateable issue of whether smaller class size helps, what in heck is Uncle Sam doing involved in this exceptionally local issue?

Is determined that under no circumstances will the failing public school systems be forced to improve by giving them some competition. Marching in absolute lock-step with the corrupt union bosses, Kerry opposes any form of school choice.

Apparantly never got the word on the number of female college students of late - wants a major program to give more opportunities for women to go to college. After that, he'll be initiating a plan to ensure that black men are better represented in professional sports.

Wants to tell Bangladesh that they can't trade with us unless they live up to our standards of doing business. Aren't we supposed to not be arrogant and overbearing to small, poor Third World nations?

Has a litmus test for judges - only supporters of racial quotas and abortion on demand need apply.

Wants to turn Iraq over to the UN, after the UN's amazing success in the "Oil for Food" program and its bang-up job of rebuilding Kosovo and Bosnia. He'll also, he says, "reach out to the European nations" to build an international coalition...apparantly, Poland, Spain, and Britain aren't in Europe anymore...and they must be part of the United States, as well...otherwise we wouldn't need to build an international coalition, right?

Wants to increase the sovereignty of our Indian tribes, and massively increase the direct involvement of the federal government in Indian affairs....isn't this sorta like letting someone go by locking them up?

All in all, he's a liberal's liberal. Only moderate in the sense that he doesn't shout and have a vein pop out of his neck when he gives a speech.

Basically..............he is NOT my choice for President. Vote Bush

[ 03-17-2004, 22:22: Message edited by: Iron Buck ]

 

[pawclaws]

Hey didn't we already do all that in Germany; late thirties, early forties??

 

[ROCKYMTNELKSTALKER]

Yes they did paws, only they skipped the brady bullsh@%

 

[ELKCHSR]

Liberalism/Socialism/Communism....
All varying degrees of the same thing.
The way the Democrats are set up, one could add that name to the trio!!!

 

[JoseCuervo]

Iron Buck,

What is wrong with some of these??? (I'd ask Elkchsr, but I don't think he even reads any of these posts, just starts typing into a spellchecker.... )

He wants to force American businesses to get into "compartive pay" vis a vis male and female employees.

Is this for the same job, or for different jobs?

Wants to force kids to volunteer for community service as a pre-requisite for graduting high school.

Would there be something wrong with teaching kids "community service"? Maybe then we would have to sentance so many to "community service". I had heard this as a way to earn college tuition, but I would be curious as to why this would be evil? I expect my kids to grow up learning they are responsible for making their community a better place. Have you ever heard of " Nobles Oblige ?

Apparantly thinks the President of United States is the School Board President in Chief - wants to provide massive new funding for class size reduction; leaving aside the debateable issue of whether smaller class size helps, what in heck is Uncle Sam doing involved in this exceptionally local issue?

This is exactly what ErikInAlaska advocated. (Elkchsr, are you calling Erik a Communist/Socialist?) IronBuck, who are the idiots that are debating if smaller class size helps?

Apparantly never got the word on the number of female college students of late - wants a major program to give more opportunities for women to go to college.

Any program that helps ANYBODY go to college would seem like a good idea. Why would this be a bad idea?

he'll be initiating a plan to ensure that black men are better represented in professional sports.

Is this a worse plan than Dubya wanting to ban steroids from pro-sports, as the State of the Union address called for?

Wants to tell Bangladesh that they can't trade with us unless they live up to our standards of doing business. Aren't we supposed to not be arrogant and overbearing to small, poor Third World nations?

The US exerts pressure/influence all over the world, to dictate foreign policy. I am not sure what behaviour in Bangladesh is being addressed, do you know?

Has a litmus test for judges - only supporters of racial quotas and abortion on demand need apply.

Did you make this up, or has this been released as Kerry's criteria? And why would you not want judges to support abortion on demand? When else would you want an abortion?

Wants to turn Iraq over to the UN, after the UN's amazing success in the "Oil for Food" program and its bang-up job of rebuilding Kosovo and Bosnia.

At least Kerry has a plan on who to turn Iraq over to. Dubya does not know who he will turn Iraq over to on the day that Paul Bremer leaves. Talk about a disaster! His latest plan is to have a Super-Embassy, with 4000 staffers.... I think you have to give Kerry credit for a vision on this one. Dubya dropped the ball big time.

He'll also, he says, "reach out to the European nations" to build an international coalition...apparantly, Poland, Spain, and Britain aren't in Europe anymore.

Iron Buck, do you really think that is a coalition of European nations? Spain just said they would withdraw their 200 troops. I think Poland has 2500. Bush Sr. built a coalition of European Nations. Dubya failed big time on that one.


Thanks in advance, Iron Buck.


(You know what would be really funny, is to see Elkchsr try and address some of these issues. We would all get a big kick out of that... )

 

[ELKCHSR]

The spell checker is very easy, a couple of you are so tied up on perfect grammar it's just easier to do that than to give you or Buzz any ammo, no matter how insignificant, you two are never happy or use any excuse to try and bash some one (said in whiney, high pitched nasal voice) "YOU can't spell, Now you cheat using spell checker"

, it also helps on my writing skills any way!!!
Your first quote you took from.
I believe the worker comes first, they get paid what ever their worth for the type of job they do. I ran a business long enough to do that. I don't think the pay between the sex's is that disparaging any more.
I don't believe kids should be doing community service, they should be going into active military for the first two years after high school and high school students shouldn't be allowed into collage for two years after high school for the simple fact the biggest share of them haven't the mental stability to use these institutions for higher learning, instead of high rent party spots.
It has been shown countless times that smaller class rooms aren't the answer, the quality of the teacher is. I run classes some times of forty five people, some times of ten. I prefer the higher number, I get the info out to more people faster that way. The individual is still addressed and their needs met...
Women and minorities have ample chances at collage now. I really don't believe any new programs are needed to get more people into institutions of higher learning, if it be known, there may be need to lesson governments role in the institutions of higher learning.
The post wasn't about Georges plans, it is about Kerry's. I wouldn't believe for a second the poor down trodden colored guy is misrepresented in any of the sports. Ceptin for maybe Gymnastics and Swimming!!!
I am not up to speed with Bangladesh, I would say though that we have been shutting out some third world countries trading with us for a very long time, or haven't you been keeping up on Cuba? We as a nation can trade with whomever we chose, same as a private enterprise, this isn't a touchy feely thing, it is some thing that is run on what ever the clashing political climates are at the time. If there is a big problem with it, maybe you should run over to Washington DC and picket on the front steps. Or is this just put up as some thing to get an argument going and you really don't have much to say on the subject?...!!!
The litmus test thing didn't make a lot of sense, seems to be three different subjects in one sentence.
I wouldn't turn any thing over to the U.N. They are a bunch of no-bodies that are clamoring for world recognition and trying to run the world in their own ideals, when they can't seem to even feed the country they represent. I would keep a few of our own dignitaries there until their police and politicians can run things as smoothly as the run this country. We can always keep a few military bases set up in that country, just like we do around the world, this will always ensure we have places to set the landing forces up again if need be.
I will respectfully have no comment on the last one.
So Gunner, if you actually read the entire post, did you not want me to post on. I know the snide comments were only to see if you could show your arrogant superiority of having read more Socialistic news papers than I and that you have watched more news reports on our "UNBIASED" news media. Was there actually a point to it, or are you just needing some one to down grade to show that you can be the bigger smarter bully? This only shows how small, petty and insignificant you can really be!!!
And yes, this whole thing went thru spell check. This gives me ammo when you don’t spell perfect, I will call you on it as I have seen you do to others….

 

[JoseCuervo]

be allowed into collage[/B] for two

You see, spell check won't keep you from putting the wrong word into your pointless rant. But you do prove that people need more education, to be able to clearly communicated.

I wished I had time enough to rip into this post of your's, but I gotta run. I'll get to it later, if somebody else hasn't made a fool out of you prior.

 

[ELKCHSR]

My "Pointless Rant" only answered your questions down the line of how you posted them, nothing more. It is you that are taking things out of context, so what is your point on my using spell check any way? Is there some thing about spell check that just bothers the heck out of you, or is it you just have nothing better to come back with?

 

[JoseCuervo]

The spell checker is very easy, a couple of you are so tied up on perfect grammar it's just easier to do that than to give you or Buzz any ammo, no matter how insignificant, you two are never happy or use any excuse to try and bash some one (said in whiney, high pitched nasal voice) "YOU can't spell, Now you cheat using spell checker" , it also helps on my writing skills any way!!!

That is an amazing sentence. Or at least I think it was supposed to be a sentence….I think the point was the spell checker improves your writing skills, but your opening on this post contradicts any claims to improvement.

Your first quote you took from.
I believe the worker comes first, they get paid what ever their worth for the type of job they do. I ran a business long enough to do that. I don't think the pay between the sex's is that disparaging any more.

How disparaging does it ihave to be, before you are concerned? Why should there be any difference? Equal pay for equal work.

I don't believe kids should be doing community service, they should be going into active military for the first two years after high school and high school students shouldn't be allowed into collage for two years after high school for the simple fact the biggest share of them haven't the mental stability to use these institutions for higher learning, instead of high rent party spots.

What is the difference between community service and the military? They both serve the purpose to “serve the community”. Why would 10 hours a month of community service be bad? But your call for Mandatory military service is interesting….Kind of like North Korea, East Germany, USSR, and other Communist regimes. Could you provide some facts to your claim that “the biggest share of them haven’t the mental stability” for college? My guess is you little to no time on a college campus, so you don’t really know anything on the topic. I may be wrong, but I think that it is funny that our states spend huge amounts of tax dollars on Higher Education, and only Elkchsr knows the students aren’t mentally stable. And as for “high rent party spots”, when I was in college, we spent a ton of effort making sure we have “low rent party spots”, including way too many roommates, drinking Ranier and Oly during the week, and learning creative ways of cooking Smack Ramen or Mac and Cheese.

It has been shown countless times that smaller class rooms aren't the answer, the quality of the teacher is. I run classes some times of forty five people, some times of ten. I prefer the higher number, I get the info out to more people faster that way. The individual is still addressed and their needs met...

Who has ever shown that smaller class sizes aren’t the answer? We have state guidelines indicating maximum class sizes, and they increase as the students get older. I think Kindergarten starts at about 15:1. Have you ever been in a classroom with 28 5-year olds and one teacher??? Not that much learning can happen. And when you consider some of the kids don’t speak English, some have “special needs”, the classroom size DOES matter. And I am impressed that you can handle up to 45 adults in your classes, and still be effective. Of course, I am sure it can’t be that difficult to teach adults which end of a Pulaski to hold…..(hint: It is the wooden end..

)

Women and minorities have ample chances at collage now. I really don't believe any new programs are needed to get more people into institutions of higher learning, if it be known, there may be need to lesson governments role in the institutions of higher learning.

What are “lesson governments”? We, as a country, have always provided education to our people. Why on earth would that not be a role for a “lesson government”? And why would anybody be against the idea of encouraging more to go to college? Dubya can’t create the jobs for the workers now, how high would un-employment be if colleges were closed down?

The post wasn't about Georges plans, it is about Kerry's. I wouldn't believe for a second the poor down trodden colored guy is misrepresented in any of the sports. Ceptin for maybe Gymnastics and Swimming!!!

I have no idea why Dubya or Kerry is interested in “fixing” pro sports. Maybe removing the Anti-trust exemption from MLB… Elkchsr, do you know? Why didn’t you question IronBuck on this?

I am not up to speed with Bangladesh, I would say though that we have been shutting out some third world countries trading with us for a very long time, or haven't you been keeping up on Cuba? We as a nation can trade with whomever we chose, same as a private enterprise, this isn't a touchy feely thing, it is some thing that is run on what ever the clashing political climates are at the time. If there is a big problem with it, maybe you should run over to Washington DC and picket on the front steps. Or is this just put up as some thing to get an argument going and you really don't have much to say on the subject?...!!!

Elkchsr, what was your point on this? IronBuck said it was wrong for us to tell Bangladesh they could not trade with us. And you now say we can chose who we want? Why are you telling me to go picket the front steps of Washington DC? (I am not sure who’s steps you want me to picket…. Should I just pick somebody's house to picket? ) If you had any ability to read, you would see that I questioned IronBuck by saying “The US exerts pressure/influence all over the world, to dictate foreign policy.” Could you please show me where I put this up “to get an argument going”?

The litmus test thing didn't make a lot of sense, seems to be three different subjects in one sentence.

Then call IronBuck out, and have him explain it. Look at your post after IronBuck’s original post. “Liberalism/Socialism/Communism....
All varying degrees of the same thing.
The way the Democrats are set up, one could add that name to the trio!!!”

I wouldn't turn any thing over to the U.N. They are a bunch of no-bodies that are clamoring for world recognition and trying to run the world in their own ideals, when they can't seem to even feed the country they represent.

Ummmm… Just what countries can’t the feed that they represent? It is the flipppin’ UN, there are member representatives from almost every country in the world. Are you saying the US can’t feed the US? And Canada can’t feed Canada? You make absolutely no sense with this sentence, despite the fact that it went through your spell checker. And how are they “clamoring for recognition” or a bunch of “no-bodies”. Do you even know how the UN works, and how the Security Council works?

I would keep a few of our own dignitaries there until their police and politicians can run things as smoothly as the run this country. We can always keep a few military bases set up in that country, just like we do around the world, this will always ensure we have places to set the landing forces up again if need be.

Why would you keep “dignitaries” there? Wouldn’t you be better off keeping experts in Banking, Petroleum, Law, Medicine, Education, etc… in Iraq, to help build the nation that Dubya wants? I don’t think you need “dignitaries”, you need people of vision and effort.

I will respectfully have no comment on the last one.

Which one did you duck?

So Gunner, if you actually read the entire post, did you not want me to post on.

What does the above sentence say?

I know the snide comments were only to see if you could show your arrogant superiority of having read more Socialistic news papers than I and that you have watched more news reports on our "UNBIASED" news media.

The only newspaper I read is the Idaho Statesman. Is that a Socialistic paper, in your opinion? It is owned by Gannet, the USA-Today company. Do you even know what Socialism is? I rarely have time to watch “UNBIASED" news media, is that the same as Televison?

Elkchsr, it is funny that you defend the postions of IronBuck, when he appears to have ducked the topic, likely as indefensible. Can you again tell me the point of your post that was:

Liberalism/Socialism/Communism....
All varying degrees of the same thing.
The way the Democrats are set up, one could add that name to the trio!!!

What did that post state? Or was that a “pointless point”…..

 

[ELKCHSR]

"How disparaging does it ihave to be, before you are concerned? Why should there be any difference? Equal pay for equal work."
I am for that and for clarity on your part, if there is much if any difference any more, it seems to hit the main stream news media.

"What is the difference between community service and the military?"

One actually takes a commitment away from momma's apron strings and gets the individual out on their own to start learning how to provide for themselves. There is a big difference on Military and Community Service, some thing that is obviously lost to you.

"My guess is you little to no time on a college campus"

I understand what you said, but I will bring it out that even you can't be perfect with your English...

" may be wrong, but I think that it is funny that our states spend huge amounts of tax dollars on Higher Education, and only Elkchsr knows the students aren’t mentally stable. And as for “high rent party spots”, when I was in college, we spent a ton of effort making sure we have “low rent party spots”, including way too many roommates, drinking Ranier and Oly during the week, and learning creative ways of cooking Smack Ramen or Mac and Cheese"

And your point is???
I will ask you a question, with your knowledge of how the world is run, would you learn more now if you went back to school from the same lessons, and if so, why would that be???

"Why would you keep “dignitaries” there? Wouldn’t you be better off keeping experts in Banking, Petroleum, Law, Medicine, Education, etc… in Iraq, to help build the nation that Dubya wants? I don’t think you need “dignitaries”, you need people of vision and effort."

Works for me!!!

"Elkchsr, it is funny that you defend the postions of IronBuck, when he appears to have ducked the topic, likely as indefensible. Can you again tell me the point of your post that was:"

I could go on endlessly to what point, it will change your mind none and you will still only see what you want to see from what ever it is that I post....Your mind is made up and nothing will sway you from that fact!!!

Here is one for you, what is the big deal that spell check is used, is it that you want to show your mental superiority on spelling and putting sentences together...If that is all it is, then go suck eggs, there is two men on the board that has you beat hands down, fortunatly they don't rub your nose in the fact, they are men that I fully admire because they are true gentle man. If it is actually supposed to be meant as some thing possitive, then enlighten me!!!

 

[pawclaws]

"The President is the one who dragged our troops to Iraq, which has apparently been a factor in the death of 200 Spaniards over the weekend. For the President of the United States to assert that we were safer because Saddam Hussein is in jail is ludicrous, given what happened three days ago in Spain." --Howard Dean, speaking in support of John Kerry, arguing that fighting terrorism is the root of all terrorism.

DNC is just overflowing with patriots!

[ 03-20-2004, 07:37: Message edited by: pawclaws ]

 

[JoseCuervo]

Elkchsr,

It is funny that you continue to defend this rant that IronBuck posted. It was not even IronBuck's thoughts, and he certainly has not even considered defending them. If you would like to see the original Blog he cut them from, it is at Blogs for Bush (at least I hang around and defend my Cut and Paste jobs...)

But, to some of your points....

One actually takes a commitment away from momma's apron strings and gets the individual out on their own to start learning how to provide for themselves. There is a big difference on Military and Community Service, some thing that is obviously lost to you.

The rant that IronBuck posted said "prior to High School graduation". Do you really want to start taking 14 year olds away from their momma's apron strings and conscripting them into the Military? Like Iraq and Iran do???

And as a side topic, doesn't the military have bigger apron strings for new recruits? Don't they tell you when to wake up, when to eat, when to go to bed? No such "apron strings" exsist for 17 year old college freshmen, away from home the first time.

My point was you posted the ridiculous comment of

I don't believe kids should be doing community service, they should be going into active military for the first two years after high school and high school students shouldn't be allowed into collage for two years after high school for the simple fact the biggest share of them haven't the mental stability to use these institutions for higher learning, instead of high rent party spots.

How do you reconcile your claim that kids 18-19 aren't mentally stable enough to learn, with the fact that when they were 5-18 we were sending them to school every day in K-12 systems. I think you are completely wrong on this, and you seem to not be able to defend it. Perhaps on topics of Education, you should read a bit more.

I will ask you a question, with your knowledge of how the world is run, would you learn more now if you went back to school from the same lessons, and if so, why would that be???

I am not sure if I would learn more now than I did when I was 17-21. I know I have taken classes in the Evening since I have earned my Bachelors degree earning a Masters degree. I think the foundation I developed and the learning ability I developed during my undergraduate helped me earn my Masters degree. And then I have taken additional post-graduate college courses since the second degree. And all of these courses, I learned from. The other thing I learned is that one should never quit learning.

Can you hit the claims you made, and were off base on?
Particularly the claims you made on class size, encouragment to attend college, your claim of trade not being a touchy feeley thing, the UN not being able to feed their own country , the Idaho Stateman as a Socialist paper, your inability to define Socialism, and your original "pointless point".

Liberalism/Socialism/Communism....
All varying degrees of the same thing.
The way the Democrats are set up, one could add that name to the trio!!!

 

[ELKCHSR]

There are some that will bury thier heads in the sand until some one comes along and shoots it off, still hoping beyond hope that the world can just get along if it just were not for the evil Americans!!!

 

[pawclaws]

Gunner those comments aren't at all rediculous. You will make this discovery when your kids leave home for college. When an 18 or 19 year old leaves home for their first taste of freedom they want to have fun. Unfortunately in the collective wisdom of every Freshman class; this is the focus, sometimes through metriculation.
Military discipline has nothing to do with apron strings, it is to occupy the mind and body, to instill a sense of self discipline. Kids entering college, away from home are capable of learning; however, the temptations are great and they aren't really seasoned to effectively separate fact, from opinion, from bullshit. We do a a real dis-service to our kids by not giving them a few years to taste life, gain some experience, and develop some judgment before we place them into an academic environment. Learning is a process of progressing from the "known to the unknown." Doesn't it seem reasonable that the greater the base of knowledge, the greater the strides can be? While I agree that community service, military service, etc are very valuable; I do not believe that such should be forced on the kids; rather freely offered, and encouraged.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Originally posted by ELKCHSR:
There are some that will bury thier heads in the sand until some one comes along and shoots it off, still hoping beyond hope that the world can just get along if it just were not for the evil Americans!!!

Anybody have any clue what this means????

 

[pawclaws]

The polling feature for this forum has been disabled.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Originally posted by pawclaws:
rediculous. metriculation.

We do a a real dis-service to our kids by not giving them a few years to taste life, gain some experience, and develop some judgment before we place them into an academic environment.

While I agree that community service, military service, etc are very valuable; I do not believe that such should be forced on the kids; rather freely offered, and encouraged.

Paws,
When you put words like "rediculous metriculation" in a post, I always have to waste time trying to figure out if they are spelling errors, or some obscure word that I do not have in my everyday vocabulary.

Paws,
Last time I checked, we do give kids the choice what to do the day after High School graduation. There is absolutely no forced college, that I am aware of. Kids can choose to go spend a summer mowing lawns, and enroll in the Fall at State U., or they can enroll in the Marines and head for San Diego. They can buy an airline ticket and a backpack and go see Europe on $10 a day. Or, they can decide they like working at the local McD's,and spend their days asking if you would like to "Supersize" that.

Are you aware of Forced College programs that do the dis-service you fret about?

It was Elkchsr who was proposing banning kids for the first two years from attending college. Certainly, with your knowledge of statistics and education, you would have to admidt that the distribution of maturity levels among 18-19 year olds is great enough that there are kids more than ready for additional education. And conversely, do you know any kids that would not be better served by additional education? Or even adults..?

. When an 18 or 19 year old leaves home for their first taste of freedom they want to have fun.

Perhaps if parents were to raise their kids properly, their first taste of freedom wouldn't come at age 19.

 

[pawclaws]

Yes at present we do offer the kids a choice; however, the impression I gained from "Kerry's idea" was that it become mandatory community service. I also used the word "encouraged." By the way; if I occasionally mis-spel a wurd; get over it!

 

[JoseCuervo]

Paws,

Unlike Elkchsr, I give you the benefit of the doubt, and assume you spell correctly, so then I have to figure out if the word you are using is just a word that I am not familiar with. It was a backhanded compliment (or complement to Elkchsr).

So, am I to understand that there is no "dis-service" done to these kids, and, since they were likely "adults" at the time of the decisions, we have to hope we gave them the education to make good decisions as adults?

And would there be anything wrong with Kerry's plan for community service, as part of a graduation requirement? I hadn't thought much of it until now, but it seems like a "no cost" type of thing that could help restore strong communities in the Country.

 

[pawclaws]

OK; no biggie. I don't get a lot of heartburn of mis-spelled words. I figure if I can grasp the meaning; the job got done. If I occasionally use a word outside of one's vocabulary, just shout; I'll 'splain it! We all come from different backgrounds and I'll bet there are very few here who know what "Skillygalee" is! (A Civil war era field recipe consisting of hard tack, soaked in hot coffee, tea, or water, then fried in gobs of bacon grease and bacon.) {Yummy!!)