NR - AK unguided sheep/goat/bear

[Bambistew]

Seems like most do by using caps on draws etc.... Can't blame you.

I thought I had read somewhere that the numbers were really lopsided for guided hunters versus non. I suppose I'm getting lumped into the "guided" category as a NOK hunter. Would be interesting to see some factual stats regarding both. To be honest every time I go I think of so many of my hunter friends that would love to do these hunts but financially will never be able to. This draw idea would at least allow them a chance.

I had read this proposal a couple years ago put out by the Alaska Backcountry Hunters and Anglers. I'm not sure if it's the same general idea that you have or not Ivan?
http://www.alaskabackcountryhunters.org/AK BHA Sheep Proposal 2014 Region III meeting.pdf

The BHA prop is one idea, there have been many others. All of which have been shelved until the working group sorts it out. The prop is for 20A and 19C which is comprised of about 90% state land. There are no rules governing the total number of guides, let alone NR they can hunt. There are a few gluttonous assholes that are really making it difficult for the rest, and the rest of the guides dont have the backbone to stand up against them. I'm sure that will get some dander up, but its the truth.

These areas are completely saturated with guides and their clients are taking the vast majority of the sheep (there is also a pretty big number of NOK harvest as well).

There is more to it than that, as I eluded to earlier about res success and the reason for it. However, when 70-80% of the harvest is going to NR, something need to be looked at, IMO. Just because you can afford it doesn't mean you should get to have it all. It doesn't fit with the NA wildlife model either.

On federal lands, which is most of the rest of the state that has sheep OTC, the guides and consequently their clients are managed for sustainable numbers by the feds. The conflict in these areas is much lower, because there are fewer guides, and they cant rape and pillage, via agreement of their concession... concessions similar to the fed program was pushed for on State lands but continues to fail.

I don't have my computer handy, but will try to add a link to data I compiled for the BOG meeting last winter show in NOK numbers. In the mean time you can search the BOG meetings, go to the wasilla meeting Feb 2015 i think it was, and look up the record copy of what I submitted.

Added Link
http://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static-f..._02_13_15/rcs/rc049_Ivan Clark_Sheep_Data.pdf

Note that the NOK totals were 5 year averages, the last two years have been quite a bit higher, both around 100 NOK each year and about 50 rams taken.

I didn't intend for this thread to go sideways, and was honestly looking for a legit way for all NR's to get a chance to participate, which may spur discussion of other opportunities than just the auction/raffle. Putting facts and stats on the table helps, I think.

We have a sheep meeting this weekend, and I have a feeling there will be some fireworks flying.

 

[brymoore]

I manage the the lottery tag for Idaho through Idaho Wild Sheep Foundation. I can give you some perspective from what we see from a sales effort and expenses if you're interested.

 

[ewludwig]

Absolutely! I could care less about a premium area. I just want to hunt those animals and would prefer to do it on my own without a guide.

this....

 

[BuzzH]

Bambi,

Good luck with your ideas...I think you are on the right track. I applaud your efforts to try to find a way for NR DIY hunters to get at least a chance to hunt griz, goats, and sheep without a guide.

Just be aware that, no matter how good your intentions are, you are going to get flack from all kinds of places. Places that you would least expect it as well.

There are lots of people that pretend they care about others in regard to hunting opportunity, but the reality is, if it were to take 1 tag from their chance to hunt, or for an outfitter to make another dollar...there will be hell to pay.

I have heard public testimony by outfitters in Wyoming on some tag allocation issues, where they stated that they DO NOT care about their own kids drawing tags if it means there will be opportunity lost for their clients.

Whatever you do, make sure to look out for Resident opportunity first and be mindful of where tag allocations are defined. They can be in either Regulation or Statute...

 

[sneakem]

Yep... kinda sucks for some of us. I don't have relatives and I won't fork out to hire a guide. Truth being that its not that I couldn't save to do it, just don't want to and won't pay someone to do what I can do myself. I have absolutely nothing against hiring a guide or outfitter, it can be beneficial for some. Truth being there are thousands of sportsman that are most likely more qualified/skilled outdoorsman than most guides/outfitters themselves. The Wyoming thing is nonsense as well.

So unless something changes I'll just sit here and dream about being able to experience an Alaska adventure chasing white Sheep and Griz etc....

 

[Bambistew]

Apparently ADF&G is leaving about $8 million of P/R funds on the table due to lack of non-federal revenue. This raffle deal may sell itself.

If anyone has info on the Super Tag type programs in your state, I'd like to hear about it.

 

[BuzzH]

Apparently ADF&G is leaving about $8 million of P/R funds on the table due to lack of non-federal revenue. This raffle deal may sell itself.

If anyone has info on the Super Tag type programs in your state, I'd like to hear about it.

Super tags, Governors tags, both?

I can tell you that the Wyoming Super Raffles raise about 700K a year.