Oh yes, same here. Capability to shovel snow off the driveway is also very attractive.
Moving Trends for 2025
- Thread starter BigHornRam
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Oh yes, same here. Capability to shovel snow off the driveway is also very attractive.
Colorado has been a real hot commodity for a long time. Only recently has the trend started to flip.
When all the jobs are concentrated in like a narrow 60 some mile corridor the place seemingly fills up fast. Considering the historical decades of anti growth sentiment from leadership it's an infrastructure nightmare here.
Montanans are very familiar with how property taxes go up when your neighborhood becomes popular. Colorado is pretty middle of the pack in overall tax burden, thankfully, but COLA outpaces any help there instantaneously.
I think Colorado is the poster child for gaslighting people into thinking they're moving "out west" into a mountain paradise only to find themselves living in a big stinky urban corridor with outrageous cost of living. Many of the dozens of people from Texas and other places across the south I met as a single dude living in Denver are long gone. A lot of folks change their mind before they commit to families and home buying.
Most of us born here would prefer to leave too, but we prioritize family, for now.
The politics? It's certainly adding fuel to the fire in my desire to leave, but it's far from the impetus.
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Forkyfinder
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It all makes sense now.
Nick87
Well-known member
Funny thing about that is its a vicious circle imo. Stay because of family and then so do your kids. Then come the grandkids and your stuck after retirement. I'm 100% guilty of it.
Fwiw, I don't think Medicare underpays. They just don't overpay like regular insurance. If you compared the two, you are only losing if you planned on getting overpaid like regular insurance.
AFAIK, there isn't any rule that says that you have to take Medicare, and yet, there is a large number of providers. I take it that the only people who lose money are "losing" being overpaid.
As most know, the price is generally different for cash vs insurance. My thought is the differentials between Medicare and regular insurance is similar.
AFAIK, there isn't any rule that says that you have to take Medicare, and yet, there is a large number of providers. I take it that the only people who lose money are "losing" being overpaid.
As most know, the price is generally different for cash vs insurance. My thought is the differentials between Medicare and regular insurance is similar.
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Irrelevant
Well-known member
Well, WA now has an income tax so my comment above is moot (ish, only taxes "millionaires", for now)
BigHornRam
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There goes the Seahawks!
elkduds
Well-known member
Overall population size belongs in this discussion. I submit it suggests why CO lost some population: density of Front Range population from Ft. Collins to Colorado Springs. Western half of the state typically has geography unsuitable for urban sprawl.
Sad fact:50% of this state's share of Colorado River water is diverted across the Continental Divide to benefit these Front Range population centers.
Sad fact:50% of this state's share of Colorado River water is diverted across the Continental Divide to benefit these Front Range population centers.
- Top 13 Western U.S. States by Population (approx. 2024 Estimates)
- California: ~39.4 million
- Washington: ~7.9 million
- Arizona: ~7.5 million
- Colorado: ~5.9 million
- Oregon: ~4.2 million
- Utah: ~3.4 million
- Nevada: ~3.2 million
- New Mexico: ~2.1 million
- Idaho: ~2.0 million
WildWill
Well-known member
But the cost are never as high as they claim usually it's not even close.For the record - i dont disagree. Its an outrage the costs are that high, if they are. But...
2025 The Cost of Caring Report | AHA
This report outlines the key trends impacting hospital financial stability in 2025.www.aha.org
View attachment 403727
Elkmagnet
Well-known member
This looks reliving to the discussion. That 1% has plenty of places to hide.
I'm not sure if it is relevant without context. Some of those states have no income tax or flat rates.
PoleX
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- 290
Do you have another source you'd recommend that would more accurately show what countries have the largest outflow of business moving abroad? Most of my opinions are based of economists and political journalists not a cherry picked article. That one synthesized the information and thoughts I shared so I shared it.I personally try to examine at a multitude of sources and apply a little critical thinking before developing any sort of certainty on a subject:
Millionaires may not be fleeing the UK in droves – but there are reasons these stories persist
It’s often not the super-rich who argue for lower taxes – but those whose incomes depend on their wealth.theconversation.com
Moreover, that same bit you cited states that one reason the wealthy have left is that Brexit closed off access to a lot of capital access. That wasn't exactly a socialist cause. "The UK’s exit from the European market has also made it significantly less attractive and less flexible than expected.
More specifically, the UK’s attractiveness to the wealthy has also been eroded by the loss of some Euroclear activities since Brexit, leading to a shift elsewhere of market participants and capital."
Editing to add a few things so I'm not just cherry-picking quotes to support my biases. Taxes do indeed play a role, especially the abolishment of the "non-dom" (non-domiciled) tax loophole, essentially disallowing wealthy foreigners who sheltered cash in other countries but reside in the UK to avoid paying tax on that income. Looks like it was originally a Tory policy that Labour tightened up.
Here's some info: https://www.bbc.com/news/business-32216346
Moreover, the Henley Group that published the report you cited is in the "Golden Passport" facilitation business. There are numerous issues with the collection of data and their own citations that are easy to find online. Even they acknowledge some issues in their footnotes. Methinks Brit tabloid media saw an attention grabbing headline and ran with it. All in all, it's just not true.
I could go into more detail on places like NYC that I'm familiar with, but this is already a long post. The largest outflow has been and is the middle class, as it's really difficult to live comfortably past your 20's there on less than $200k a year. Taxes haven't got much to do with keeping teachers around when rent is $4k a month and they've still got student loans to cover.
I'm more interested in the rate of business migrating than "millionaire" departures. Anyone that bought a house in suburbia NYC could be classified a millionaire if you were to consider their total assets. It would greatly dilute that stat for obvious reasons.
Do you see a correlation between middle class departures and industry departure? I guess my research has led me to that conclusion.
I guess I hope I personally never have to make that decision as my family values spending time in the outdoors and we enjoy where we live but if work dried up and I couldn’t find a job for my skill set I’d probably move if it came down to it. I'm pretty sure the data suggests jobs/industry are the number 1 contributor for out of state moves.
geetar
Well-known member
I can't explain it but please don't stop them from leaving or avoiding us.
