Montana Deer Management- If I were King for a day.

[BuzzH]

Correct.

Edit to add- That would be a really reasonable compromise to add the ability to hunt whitetail during archery to the general whitetail tag though.

What is preventing an archery hunter from choosing the whitetail only rifle tag and hunting whitetails with a bow during the general firearm season?

I know a handful of dedicated archery whitetail deer hunters that do that in Montana now. Most very successfully.

 

[sclancy27]

Oh, and they (deer and elk) also, surprisingly enough, actually use and stay on public land...so strange.

At least part of that can be explained by the difference in public land % of the states, in all fairness. But pressure in MT is certainly an issue

 

[rogerthat]

The split between mule deer general and w-tail general is where the reduction in crowding is going to be the most significant. If I choose a w-tail only tag, I'm not going to be over hunting the Custer for mule deer...and vice-versa. Plus, that will save a mule deer from me shooting one, since I don't have a tag valid for mule deer to begin with.

I'm not seeing how adding a shit-load of days to archery is going to sweeten the pot...very few archery hunters in Montana are archery only guys. They're 2 season hunters that will drop the bow in the trash if they have to choose one or the other, more days won't change that.

No different than if you had a "traditional only muzzleloader tag"...very few would choose the December only season no matter how long it was.

Finally, if we truly care about the resource and giving them a break from all hunting...archery, rifle, muzzleloader, then stacking more days to pacify archery hunters makes NO sense.

The animals need a break, from all weapon types. If 30 days isn't enough, then go shoot coyotes, ducks, pheasants, etc. or go fishing.

Right. And if I want to hunt whiteys with my bow in November like I currently do I can still do that. I like it.

Edit: should have kept reading. You already made that point

 

[brocksw]

No, you're absolutely right. This is a proposal that is dead on arrival.

Like the title said, it's what I would do if I were king for a day and was trying to do best by the resource and the hunters of Montana that I interact with.

I disagree there, and maybe that's just some rose colored glasses. I think it is absolutely doable, but it will take a plan (like the one you have laid out) to garner support. Multiple ways to go about this, could be grassroots based movement to take this plan around and garner support. Could be advocating to the FWP to put a working group together (like we've done in ND) to work through that plan and then present it to the public for feedback/support/etc.

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the time is now. Like schaaf said, they wouldn't have the meeting they had last night if they weren't hearing complaints. Now would be the time to force the issue and make the FWP assemble a citizens working group to start fleshing the details out. If it's anything like ND, those joint working group meetings will answer some questions and raise some more questions, and the process may take another season or two. But the best time to start, is now.

That's my opinion, worth what you paid for it.

 

[huntin24/7]

The bottom line is that if we want things to get better, everyone is going to have to make some sacrifices, whether you’re an archery or rifle hunter, and some of those are going to sting a little at first. I’m tired of how many commemts(mostly not on here) that I hear that are totally selfish with total disregard to the resource. People act like if they can’t shoot a mule deer buck every year with their rifle in November that there are no other hunting opportunities in MT. Even if, god forbid, you had to draw a tag and got turned down one year, you can still go out with friends and family with tags, have a phenomenal fall of bird hunting, fishing, etc.

 

[rogerthat]

No, you're absolutely right. This is a proposal that is dead on arrival.

Like the title said, it's what I would do if I were king for a day and was trying to do best by the resource and the hunters of Montana that I interact with.

This plan has gotten way more support than anything else anyone has proposed. Survey says it’s a winner.

 

[BuzzH]

At least part of that can be explained by the difference in public land % of the states, in all fairness. But pressure in MT is certainly an issue

I respectfully disagree...where I hunt general elk in Wyoming there is tons of private for them to run into. The short general season, 30 day archery season, and the 2 week break between archery and rifle keeps them on public. Plus, we don't kill off nearly 100% of the elk on public, while leaving the elk on private untouched like Montana does.

If our season structure was like Montana's, those elk would NOT be available on public land for more than a couple days.

Its bigger, when you kill off all the elk that use public land, more just don't move in behind them...see the rose petal information that's been shared. Its no different for elk.

 

[brocksw]

This plan has gotten way more support than anything else anyone has proposed. Survey says it’s a winner.

Put that same poll on the Montanica FB page.

 

[huntin24/7]

Put that same poll on the Montanica FB page.

If you posted his poll there, @Randy11 would need personal security guards at his house. Lol

 

[brocksw]

If you posted his poll there, @Randy11 would need personal security guards at his house. Lol

Sad, but I believe it. But someone has to take the jump into the deep end to start figuring this stuff out. If citizens want to be involved in these changes, now is the time. That or Montanans will just have to be happy with whatever FWP decides. I know it makes for good HT banter(which i also thoroughly enjoy), but not really productive for driving towards a desirable change.

 

[huntin24/7]

Yeah, I know. I was just making a joke…sort of.

 

[TheTone]

Just saw on another site where a guy said he killed a muley doe yesterday that he predicted would have winter killed and commented how many deer were in the area and how poor conditions are across montana. To me reading things like that just reinforced how much of an uphill fight Montanans that want what’s best for the deer will have to get positive change made

 

[brocksw]

Just saw on another site where a guy said he killed a muley doe yesterday that he predicted would have winter killed and commented how many deer were in the area and how poor conditions are across montana. To me reading things like that just reinforced how much of an uphill fight Montanans that want what’s best for the deer will have to get positive change made

It will be even harder if proposed changes are kept within the confines and echo chambers of HT and that's where they live and die. To be accepted into the FWP's framework, social support must be gathered. To gather social support, an idea must be released into the wild and survive the hammer of public opinion. If that is not done, it is likely no changes will be made and we will continue to just talk about it on HT.

 

[sclancy27]

Just saw on another site where a guy said he killed a muley doe yesterday that he predicted would have winter killed and commented how many deer were in the area and how poor conditions are across montana. To me reading things like that just reinforced how much of an uphill fight Montanans that want what’s best for the deer will have to get positive change made

That's weird, we killed 4 bucks in MT (albeit a month ago) and they were the fattest deer I have seen in a while. Huge amounts of fat on backs, hams, surrounding the organs, etc.

 

[Bambistew]

If you're not adding opportunity to shoot something in MT hunters will just oppose it. Transplants trying to change things, PL locked up animals, go back to where you came from, NR are killing all the deer, etc, etc. FWP, will claim all is fine, you're just in a slump due to the drought, or winter, or whatever.

This is a great proposal, but it won't have support from any of the hunting groups in MT. MTBHA will oppose it unless they have exclusivity.

I'm still saying 10 years and no changes.

 

[DFS]

I’d hate to think what things are going to look like with 10 years of the same management. Or even 2 years of the same. Some of the areas will struggle to come back even if we changed things next year.

 

[antlerradar]

One thing I hadn't considered with moving general deer season to October would be the effect on Antelope hunting. Having spent one antelope opener in WSS, I can't imagine what the zoo would look like if there were also rifle hunters going after deer in the same limited bits of public/BMA. I'm sure it's the same in Region 7. I'm not sure what I would change, but it would be nice to still have one weekend where the only people out with rifles are those who drew antelope tags.

Might not be as bad as you think, some of the best antelope habitat is not appealing deer hunting and most of the best deer habitat has few antelope. You may find the antelope flats all to yourself.

 

[BuzzH]

I’d hate to think what things are going to look like with 10 years of the same management. Or even 2 years of the same. Some of the areas will struggle to come back even if we changed things next year.

I agree, I think for lots of what was great deer hunting and deer habitat its going to take decades for it to come back, if it ever does.

Same with many elk areas, particularly those on public land.

 

[Irrelevant]

Okay, so I guess misread your earlier posts. You do think that the October rifle season would have less pressure than our current season, but with adding a late archery season it would reduce pressure more. Correct?

correct, you got it.

 

[brockel]

I’d hate to think what things are going to look like with 10 years of the same management. Or even 2 years of the same. Some of the areas will struggle to come back even if we changed things next year.

My oldest will be able to hunting in 2024. Honestly not as excited as I thought I would be because I know what it was like when I was a kid compared to what it is now and what it is becoming at an incredibly fast rate.