Iowa public trust resource for sale

[Gellar]

I just received an Alert on this bill. Sf516 https://www.legis.iowa.gov/legislation/BillBook?ga=90&ba=SF 516

among other things it would force the Dnr to create yet another strategic plan which they have already done several times over with input from the citizens of Iowa, it would also make it more difficult for public agencies to purchase land as any high priority maintenance issues would need to be resolved before acquisitions. As many of you know often times an acquisition happens quickly with public agencies when they are given an exclusive opportunity by the landowner to purchase property, but if the agency doesn’t act quickly the landowner puts the parcel on the market.

There is a zoom sub committee meeting tomorrow about the bill if you have time and would like to sit in on it.

Meet virtually with Cisco Webex. Anytime, anywhere, on any device.

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ialegis.webex.com

 

[Gellar]

Good job everyone who voiced their opposition for sf 216. Because of the showing of support against the bill it is stalled, but not dead!

Public lands bill stalls in the Iowa House - Iowa Capital Dispatch

A bill that received the Senate's approval and would -- according to opponents -- limit new public land did not get subcommittee approval.

iowacapitaldispatch.com

 

[Gellar]

Update on SF 216. It reared its ugly head again last week and was shut down, but late Wednesday it was reintroduced on the whole senate floor for vote on Thursday, yesterday, at noon. A call for email and phone calls was sent out by all parties opposed and the bill was eventually pulled from vote and is done for this session.

This gives sportsman a bit of a hope because it shows there voice is actually being heard through phone calls and emails but it also is depressing because even with the negative feedback on these bills the knuckleheads keep trying to pull fast ones on sportsmen and women through late night shenanigans and back door moves.

Stay Alert, friends!

 

[Pucky Freak]

Legislative session is over and as far as I can tell only two hunting-related bill were signed into law. The first was the “skunks, coons, and opossums” nuisance law, which liberalizes the take of these animals. The second bill allows physical therapists to certify disabled persons to use a crossbow to hunt deer.

Overall, a good year for the public land hunter as the slew of really terrible bills died along the way. Thanks everyone who made public comment, attended zoom meetings, contacted legislators, or spread the word about threats to public land and hunting in Iowa.

I fully expect another stack of terrible bills to surface again next year and every year thereafter to appease industry donors, wealthy nonresidents and Farm Bureau.

 

[Ben Nicholson]

We need to push to get IWILL funded. The voters approved this a decade ago. The fact that our legislators have yet to fund it is maddening at best.

And yes, the Farm Bureau sucks!

 

[Gellar]

We need to push to get IWILL funded. The voters approved this a decade ago. The fact that our legislators have yet to fund it is maddening at best.

And yes, the Farm Bureau sucks!

A total disgrace that the people of Iowa have permission to raise the sales tax for the better of Iowa’s natural resources and it has not been done.

 

[trackerbacker]

Someone will have to explain the crossbow thing as:
I haven't seen anyone that hunts, have one
I haven't ever seen one on public
I haven't seen one on private
I haven't seen one bought
I haven't heard of in field incidents


The dnr, per the convo I had with the officer at Polk city's range, didn't like approval of straight wall, I'm guessing they don't like the relaxed laws post that year nor do I think they like the late rifle season allowances. But that's all based on my interactions with dnr in the field and such.

Or "processing game in field". Try boning out an animal and include the head (per regs) and argue with dnr for an hour over "wanton waste". You think the dnr (or other hunters) want you doing much more than dragging or pulking?

The one out of many dnr interactions thst was positive, and this stretches all over iowa, hunting fishing hiking and boating-1 was good (reestablishing habitat-a forestry guy), the rest presume guilt long before cordial hellos.

Much ado about nothing.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Someone will have to explain the crossbow thing as:
I haven't seen anyone that hunts, have one
I haven't ever seen one on public
I haven't seen one on private
I haven't seen one bought
I haven't heard of in field incidents

Maybe you live under a rock.

 

[trackerbacker]

Maybe you live under a rock.

Average about 10 miles/week in any various public lands in iowa, once September hits, usually double that until March. From one county west of i35 to the mighty Miss. Morning-lunch-evening-overnight. Have not seen 1 other than at a theisens-scheels-sportsman etc.

And no, mostly ontop of the rock, but that's NEIA.

But for real, add something-statistical, anecdotal, objective, aubjective. Don't care. Any argument why the crossbow shouldn't be allowed via its lethality on game-im all ears.

Anything like "cause rifles boolits go farther than shotguns and blah blah blah it'll KILL MORE SLEEPING NUN BABIES A COUNTY OVER THAN LUCIFER HIMSELF....", is childish, juvenile and intellectually lazy.

I don't mean to be so direct, but I have never, ever, seen one in the wild or at a range or in the hands of a hunter who hunts with it, since maybe forever?

Course-im not usually on wheelchair accessible trails..

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Average about 10 miles/week in any various public lands in iowa, once September hits, usually double that until March. From one county west of i35 to the mighty Miss. Morning-lunch-evening-overnight. Have not seen 1 other than at a theisens-scheels-sportsman etc.

And no, mostly ontop of the rock, but that's NEIA.

But for real, add something-statistical, anecdotal, objective, aubjective. Don't care. Any argument why the crossbow shouldn't be allowed via its lethality on game-im all ears.

Anything like "cause rifles boolits go farther than shotguns and blah blah blah it'll KILL MORE SLEEPING NUN BABIES A COUNTY OVER THAN LUCIFER HIMSELF....", is childish, juvenile and intellectually lazy.

I don't mean to be so direct, but I have never, ever, seen one in the wild or at a range or in the hands of a hunter who hunts with it, since maybe forever?

Course-im not usually on wheelchair accessible trails..

Maybe i'm dense. What point are you trying to make by saying you don't see crossbows being used illegally during archery season or when they are a less effective weapon during firearms/muzzleloader season?

 

[trackerbacker]

Maybe i'm dense. What point are you trying to make by saying you don't see crossbows being used illegally during archery season or when they are a less effective weapon during firearms/muzzleloader season?

My point is other than a shelf at a store, I've never seen a crossbow, let alone in use, and don't understand that sentiment towards crossbows, based on my experience. Though, to be frank, I don't go out of my way to talk to everyone possibly out n about and catalog what they are hunting with.

Regarding used illegally, is that the crossbows fault or the user? Doesn't that fall into the same argument of why suppressors shouldn't be legal, because they make murderers more quiet and more effective at assassinating people in the streets?

Regarding effective compared to other ballistic options, that's a lazy argument as then we should only hunt with 10g, 50bmg or 460sw.

Heck, iowa says a 9mm at 500ftlbs is more effective than a 338, so you'll have to excuse me if the laws are poor quality and idiotic, and lazy arguments are lazy.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

My point is other than a shelf at a store, I've never seen a crossbow, let alone in use, and don't understand that sentiment towards crossbows, based on my experience. Though, to be frank, I don't go out of my way to talk to everyone possibly out n about and catalog what they are hunting with.

Regarding used illegally, is that the crossbows fault or the user? Doesn't that fall into the same argument of why suppressors shouldn't be legal, because they make murderers more quiet and more effective at assassinating people in the streets?

Regarding effective compared to other ballistic options, that's a lazy argument as then we should only hunt with 10g, 50bmg or 460sw.

Heck, iowa says a 9mm at 500ftlbs is more effective than a 338, so you'll have to excuse me if the laws are poor quality and idiotic, and lazy arguments are lazy.

Nobody is saying "crossbows are terrible contraptions, they shouldn't exist" but more how opening up the regulations to allow their use during archery season might impact the existing hunting experience. It's a reasonable assumption that making crossbows legal for all in archery season would result in more people hunting during archery season. More people hunting during archery season with more effective weapons would logically result in more buck harvest and more pressured deer which has potential to impact the quality of hunting. People can debate the extents of impacts and whether they matter but there would be impacts.

 

[trackerbacker]

Nobody is saying "crossbows are terrible contraptions, they shouldn't exist"

well, yeah, they have and are, see below.

but more how opening up the regulations to allow their use during archery season might impact the existing hunting experience.

very limitedly discussed, but ok, not sure how my hunting with a 20g or 16g effects your hunting with a 12g in the same season, but okay?

It's a reasonable assumption that making crossbows legal for all in archery season would result in more people hunting during archery season.

if tags were increased sure, but more people interested in hunting is bad how? or just bad because now there might be more competition, and the better hunter wins, or the lucky hunter strikes again and you or i eat tagsoup, ohh the humanity..

More people hunting during archery season with more effective weapons would logically result in more buck harvest and more pressured deer which has potential to impact the quality of hunting. People can debate the extents of impacts and whether they matter but there would be impacts.

then maybe ONLY THE MOST EFFECTIVE WEAPON per season, that would fix this argument much more equitably.

see how dumb that sounds on both sides?

i agree, there would be impacts, maybe a lifelong hunter is born, maybe a person with a disability can hunt easier, and maybe it makes you and me better hunters as it wont be a cake walk anymore during any season.

and sure, maybe there will be more accidents and deaths or animal suffering, which 9/10 is the user and not the tool. but that argument was made why rifles shouldnt be allowed in iowa deer hunting, yet here we are, living and breathing not killeded from 2 counties away.

---

Below are all the points made towards crossbows.

seems like theres every reason to get rid of them emotionally.

I'm asking, why crossbows? do they kill more people yearly? do they injure and not kill or allow more game to suffer yearly? or is it simply "im rabidly anti crossbow"?

the reason i ask that, is other than on a shelf in a store, i have not seen, not heard of, nor know anyone who who has used one, seen one in the wild or heard of their buddy using one.

so, because of the above experience, and/or lack there of, im asking why all the hate as not one person said why they are so bad except that:

"If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. "

and

"The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is."

if you are worried about buck age class, lobby for less tags

then, the arguement is theres too much opportunity, stop asking for more options, suck it up and deal with what "I" like. so, again, lobby for the limiting of tags, what does the method of take have to do with it so long as again, its a ballistically effective method of take.

then, they changed the verbiage to be anterless only, gasp, what happens to buck age class?

if "you" want less seasons, less hunters, less tags, come out and say it directly, dont hide behind the above (and some below) statements, which iare pansy statements.

if the eco system can sustain 1000 buck tags, and its decided it can handle 1100 next year, i dont care if they were taken with .223-50bmg, longbow-compound-crossbow, any caliber muzzleloader, 9mm-460sw,etc, that has backing for some bottom threshold of efficacy for take (meaning i dont agree with gun1-2 rifle restrictions and its clear it comes from someone with room temp IQ)




---

SF 175 Crossbows valid on vertical bow deer tags. Ravin Crossbows persistently funds political campaigns in order to try and expand its market share. This strategy has been very successful in other eastern states and Iowa sits firmly in it's crosshairs as a holdout. If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is.

---

I'm pretty rabidly anti-crossbow.

---

Lord have mercy.

Crossbows and crowds.

What’s not to love…

---

SF175. It looks like they may have changed the verbage on this yesterday, 02/02/23 The only thing I see talking about cross bows is being able to use them in the January antlerless season which is only in counties with 100 or more unsold antlerless deer tags after January 10. https://www.legis.iowa.gov/legislation/BillBook?ga=90&ba=sf175

---

The new verbage is pretty tame. While I am still not in favor of "crossbow creep", I don't really care if the archery bow tag converts to a crossbow antlerless tag for the late Jan season. I can't imagine too many persons utilizing this anyways, since anyone can just buy a late Jan antlerless permit for $15 and hunt it with a crossbow anyways. My guess is the entire point of the bill, now renumbered SF208 is just a nod to Ravin at this point.

---

One gentlemen commented that he would like the crossbow bill that is currently being proposed extended to the whole season for anyone over 65 automatically gets to use a cross bow. Another person commented they were not in favor of the .17hmr for turkey hunting.

---

The second bill allows physical therapists to certify disabled persons to use a crossbow to hunt deer.

---

 

[perma]

well, yeah, they have and are, see below.

very limitedly discussed, but ok, not sure how my hunting with a 20g or 16g effects your hunting with a 12g in the same season, but okay?

if tags were increased sure, but more people interested in hunting is bad how? or just bad because now there might be more competition, and the better hunter wins, or the lucky hunter strikes again and you or i eat tagsoup, ohh the humanity..

then maybe ONLY THE MOST EFFECTIVE WEAPON per season, that would fix this argument much more equitably.

see how dumb that sounds on both sides?

i agree, there would be impacts, maybe a lifelong hunter is born, maybe a person with a disability can hunt easier, and maybe it makes you and me better hunters as it wont be a cake walk anymore during any season.

and sure, maybe there will be more accidents and deaths or animal suffering, which 9/10 is the user and not the tool. but that argument was made why rifles shouldnt be allowed in iowa deer hunting, yet here we are, living and breathing not killeded from 2 counties away.

---

Below are all the points made towards crossbows.

seems like theres every reason to get rid of them emotionally.

I'm asking, why crossbows? do they kill more people yearly? do they injure and not kill or allow more game to suffer yearly? or is it simply "im rabidly anti crossbow"?

the reason i ask that, is other than on a shelf in a store, i have not seen, not heard of, nor know anyone who who has used one, seen one in the wild or heard of their buddy using one.

so, because of the above experience, and/or lack there of, im asking why all the hate as not one person said why they are so bad except that:

"If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. "

and

"The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is."

if you are worried about buck age class, lobby for less tags

then, the arguement is theres too much opportunity, stop asking for more options, suck it up and deal with what "I" like. so, again, lobby for the limiting of tags, what does the method of take have to do with it so long as again, its a ballistically effective method of take.

then, they changed the verbiage to be anterless only, gasp, what happens to buck age class?

if "you" want less seasons, less hunters, less tags, come out and say it directly, dont hide behind the above (and some below) statements, which iare pansy statements.

if the eco system can sustain 1000 buck tags, and its decided it can handle 1100 next year, i dont care if they were taken with .223-50bmg, longbow-compound-crossbow, any caliber muzzleloader, 9mm-460sw,etc, that has backing for some bottom threshold of efficacy for take (meaning i dont agree with gun1-2 rifle restrictions and its clear it comes from someone with room temp IQ)




---

SF 175 Crossbows valid on vertical bow deer tags. Ravin Crossbows persistently funds political campaigns in order to try and expand its market share. This strategy has been very successful in other eastern states and Iowa sits firmly in it's crosshairs as a holdout. If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is.

---

I'm pretty rabidly anti-crossbow.

---

Lord have mercy.

Crossbows and crowds.

What’s not to love…

---

SF175. It looks like they may have changed the verbage on this yesterday, 02/02/23 The only thing I see talking about cross bows is being able to use them in the January antlerless season which is only in counties with 100 or more unsold antlerless deer tags after January 10. https://www.legis.iowa.gov/legislation/BillBook?ga=90&ba=sf175

---

The new verbage is pretty tame. While I am still not in favor of "crossbow creep", I don't really care if the archery bow tag converts to a crossbow antlerless tag for the late Jan season. I can't imagine too many persons utilizing this anyways, since anyone can just buy a late Jan antlerless permit for $15 and hunt it with a crossbow anyways. My guess is the entire point of the bill, now renumbered SF208 is just a nod to Ravin at this point.

---

One gentlemen commented that he would like the crossbow bill that is currently being proposed extended to the whole season for anyone over 65 automatically gets to use a cross bow. Another person commented they were not in favor of the .17hmr for turkey hunting.

---

The second bill allows physical therapists to certify disabled persons to use a crossbow to hunt deer.

---

 

[trackerbacker]

heres the stupid buck age class argument too:

Q: Since Wisconsin legalized crossbows for all archers, which group – crossbow shooters or “vertical-bow” shooters – targets antlered bucks the most?
A: It’s a tie. Both groups in Wisconsin shoot bucks at amazingly similar rates. After varying by only 3 percentage points in 2014, the rates basically merged in recent years:
— 2014 archery season: Of the 81,701 total bowhunting harvest, 46,201 (56.55%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (54,810) was 55.52% bucks, and the crossbow harvest (26,891) was 58.64% bucks.
— 2015 archery season: Of the 87,098 total bowhunting harvest, 51,823 (59.5%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (53,004) was 58.92% bucks, and the crossbow harvest (34,094) was 60.4% bucks.
— 2016 archery season: Of the 88,048 total bowhunting harvest, 51,734 (58.76%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (48,272) was 58.36% bucks, and the crossbow harvest (39,776) was 59.24% bucks.


— 2017 archery season: Of the 92,394 total bowhunting harvest, 53,214 (57.59%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (45,166) was 57% bucks and the crossbow harvest (47,228) was 58% bucks.
— 2018 archery season: Of the 87,629 total bowhunting harvest, 47,632 (54.36%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (40,405) was 53.65% bucks and the crossbow harvest (47,224) was 54.96% bucks.
— 2019 archery season: Of the 94,085 total bowhunting harvest, 54,380 (57.79%) were bucks. The “vertical bow harvest (42,128) was 57.86% bucks and the crossbow harvest (51,957) was 57.74% bucks.
— 2020 archery season: Of the 113,567 total bowhunting harvest, 64,681 (56.95%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (47,836) was 56.72% bucks and the crossbow harvest (65,731) was 57.12% bucks.
— 2021 archery season: Of the 99,141 total bowhunting harvest, 60,751 (61.3%) were bucks. The “vertical” bow harvest (39,733) was 61.2% bucks and the crossbow harvest (59,408) was 61.3% bucks.
Crossbow hunters and “vertical-bow” hunters in Wisconsin shoot bucks at nearly identical rates, which was 61% bucks and 39% antlerless in 2021.
Here are the grand totals for the past eight Wisconsin archery seasons: Of the 743,663 deer taken with all bows, 430,416 (57.88%) were bucks. The total “vertical” bow harvest of 371,354 deer was 57.44% bucks (213,158), and the total crossbow harvest of 372,309 deer was 58.35% bucks (217,258).
Jeff Pritzl, deer-program specialist for the Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources, said the state’s trend away from antlerless harvests is unmistakable and concerning. He notes, however, that it didn’t start with crossbows. Antlered bucks made up 27% of Wisconsin’s archery kill in 1970, but jumped to 43% in 1980 as compound bows took over. The buck kill then climbed to 53% in 1990, and 57% in 1995 — roughly its current rate.
Bowhunting’s buck kill fluctuated from 46% to 50% from 1996 to 2010 when “earn-a-buck” rules and other incentives forced bowhunters to increase their antlerless harvests. The Wisconsin Legislature passed a bill outlawing earn-a-buck in 2011, and former Gov. Scott Walker signed it into law shortly before the season.
“Incentives” like earn-a-buck, which requires hunters to shoot an antlerless deer before shooting a buck, dramatically increased antlerless harvests from the late 1990s through the 2000s.
Pritzl and other biologists are concerned because most hunters today only shoot one deer annually. If they shoot a buck with a bow, they’re often done for the year. They might keep hunting with friends, but they’re not motivated to shoot a second or third deer.
Therefore, Pritzl encourages bowhunters to try shooting antlerless deer in September. “We’d like them to step up their game, and not pass those early-season opportunities,” he said. “If you can’t use the deer yourself, donate it.”
Pritzl’s concerns underscore something important: When crossbows were legalized, some folks feared they would prove so effective that Wisconsin would have to shorten its nearly four-month archery season. That hasn’t happened.
In fact, Wisconsin is relying more than ever on its short gun-hunting seasons to manage its antlerless deer, but gun-hunting’s trend is also toward bucks.
Without incentives like earn-a-buck rules the past decade, Wisconsin bowhunters — whether they carry compounds or crossbows — are choosing to be ineffective at managing antlerless deer.



Golly, gee willikers mister, GET RID OF COMPOUND BOWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DouglasR]

well, yeah, they have and are, see below.

very limitedly discussed, but ok, not sure how my hunting with a 20g or 16g effects your hunting with a 12g in the same season, but okay?

if tags were increased sure, but more people interested in hunting is bad how? or just bad because now there might be more competition, and the better hunter wins, or the lucky hunter strikes again and you or i eat tagsoup, ohh the humanity..

then maybe ONLY THE MOST EFFECTIVE WEAPON per season, that would fix this argument much more equitably.

see how dumb that sounds on both sides?

i agree, there would be impacts, maybe a lifelong hunter is born, maybe a person with a disability can hunt easier, and maybe it makes you and me better hunters as it wont be a cake walk anymore during any season.

and sure, maybe there will be more accidents and deaths or animal suffering, which 9/10 is the user and not the tool. but that argument was made why rifles shouldnt be allowed in iowa deer hunting, yet here we are, living and breathing not killeded from 2 counties away.

---

Below are all the points made towards crossbows.

seems like theres every reason to get rid of them emotionally.

I'm asking, why crossbows? do they kill more people yearly? do they injure and not kill or allow more game to suffer yearly? or is it simply "im rabidly anti crossbow"?

the reason i ask that, is other than on a shelf in a store, i have not seen, not heard of, nor know anyone who who has used one, seen one in the wild or heard of their buddy using one.

so, because of the above experience, and/or lack there of, im asking why all the hate as not one person said why they are so bad except that:

"If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. "

and

"The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is."

if you are worried about buck age class, lobby for less tags

then, the arguement is theres too much opportunity, stop asking for more options, suck it up and deal with what "I" like. so, again, lobby for the limiting of tags, what does the method of take have to do with it so long as again, its a ballistically effective method of take.

then, they changed the verbiage to be anterless only, gasp, what happens to buck age class?

if "you" want less seasons, less hunters, less tags, come out and say it directly, dont hide behind the above (and some below) statements, which iare pansy statements.

if the eco system can sustain 1000 buck tags, and its decided it can handle 1100 next year, i dont care if they were taken with .223-50bmg, longbow-compound-crossbow, any caliber muzzleloader, 9mm-460sw,etc, that has backing for some bottom threshold of efficacy for take (meaning i dont agree with gun1-2 rifle restrictions and its clear it comes from someone with room temp IQ)




---

SF 175 Crossbows valid on vertical bow deer tags. Ravin Crossbows persistently funds political campaigns in order to try and expand its market share. This strategy has been very successful in other eastern states and Iowa sits firmly in it's crosshairs as a holdout. If passed, buck age class is expected to decline in line with what is seen in neighboring states of IL and WI where vertical bows are no longer distinguished from crossbows. The bill also puts more pressure on public lands with additional crossbow hunters on the landscape. Iowa has 8 deer seasons Sept-Jan and there is an overabundance of hunting opportunity as it is.

---

I'm pretty rabidly anti-crossbow.

---

Lord have mercy.

Crossbows and crowds.

What’s not to love…

---

SF175. It looks like they may have changed the verbage on this yesterday, 02/02/23 The only thing I see talking about cross bows is being able to use them in the January antlerless season which is only in counties with 100 or more unsold antlerless deer tags after January 10. https://www.legis.iowa.gov/legislation/BillBook?ga=90&ba=sf175

---

The new verbage is pretty tame. While I am still not in favor of "crossbow creep", I don't really care if the archery bow tag converts to a crossbow antlerless tag for the late Jan season. I can't imagine too many persons utilizing this anyways, since anyone can just buy a late Jan antlerless permit for $15 and hunt it with a crossbow anyways. My guess is the entire point of the bill, now renumbered SF208 is just a nod to Ravin at this point.

---

One gentlemen commented that he would like the crossbow bill that is currently being proposed extended to the whole season for anyone over 65 automatically gets to use a cross bow. Another person commented they were not in favor of the .17hmr for turkey hunting.

---

The second bill allows physical therapists to certify disabled persons to use a crossbow to hunt deer.

---

dude ive 100% seen people using crossbows on public land and my buddy lost a deer with his vertical compound one year, traded it in for a crossbow and successfully harvested a buck the next year. lol
not saying the crossbow got him the deer but I 100% know people who have switched over.
I'm pretty sure I know a guy who hunts early season with his vertical then switches to crossbow late season when you've gotta wear 15 coats too.

 

[trackerbacker]

dude ive 100% seen people using crossbows on public land and my buddy lost a deer with his vertical compound one year, traded it in for a crossbow and successfully harvested a buck the next year. lol
not saying the crossbow got him the deer but I 100% know people who have switched over.
I'm pretty sure I know a guy who hunts early season with his vertical then switches to crossbow late season when you've gotta wear 15 coats too.

you should tell your friend "that because hes using a crossbow, hes wrecking my experience while using an effective tool, he should be outlawed from using the crossbow and pick a different season to hunt, this is my season, too many hunters anyway, just give me his tag too, he doesnt deserve it. fricken punks out here on public thinking they can hunt differently, my daddy and his daddy, and his daddys daddy hunted this piece since forever, its mine wah wah wah"

 

[perma]

you should tell your friend "that because hes using a crossbow, hes wrecking my experience while using an effective tool, he should be outlawed from using the crossbow and pick a different season to hunt, this is my season, too many hunters anyway, just give me his tag too, he doesnt deserve it. fricken punks out here on public thinking they can hunt differently, my daddy and his daddy, and his daddys daddy hunted this piece since forever, its mine wah wah wah"

Who hurt you?

 

[trackerbacker]

Who hurt you?

most of it ive enjoyed, but were not here to discuss when and why your dad calls for me.

any input on why crossbows should or shouldnt be allowed?

 

[Wind Gypsy]

you should tell your friend "that because hes using a crossbow, hes wrecking my experience while using an effective tool, he should be outlawed from using the crossbow and pick a different season to hunt, this is my season, too many hunters anyway, just give me his tag too, he doesnt deserve it. fricken punks out here on public thinking they can hunt differently, my daddy and his daddy, and his daddys daddy hunted this piece since forever, its mine wah wah wah"

Your posts and arguments are ridiculous. I won't tell someone they are wrong for thinking legalizing crossbows during archery season is worth any potential decline hunting quality. They just value things differently than I do.

Since you want to demonize people for safeguarding what most believe to be the best resident whitetail hunting setup in the country, where would you draw the line on opportunity? Should they stop being so unfair to gun hunters and let people hunt with rifles Oct-January?