Glock people up

[James Riley]

I've carried .45 1911 for 38 years but when it came to my wife, for Christmas, I went astray and got her a Glock 42 in 380. We were shooting it for the first time today and periodically she'd get a stove pipe or a complete failure to cycle. It never happened to me and it would only happen to her sometimes. I thought maybe we should return the weapon. Who needs that, right?

I watched her closely, no sleeve or clothing issues. Recoil control seemed fine. The only thing I noticed was that the web of her hand was not fully seated high up. It's not that her hand was way down the grip or anything, maybe just a half inch from being all the way up. When we corrected for this, things we didn't have any more failures. However, we were also running out of ammo so I don't know if we got a fair shot at it.

Does this sound like something you've seen or heard of before?

As a side note, when I tried it with my hand down the grip a half inch from all the way up it still functioned fine.

Thanks for any education you might provide.

 

[MKotur325]

Sounds like recoil control to me... Could also be limp wrists...

I would suggest shooting more with her hands all the way up the grip, and you can have her lean into the stance a bit and focus on pushing the gun forward so that it has something to push against to cycle the action during recoil.

 

[James Riley]

Sounds right. We'll load up and try again. Thank you.

 

[Muskeez]

I have been considering the same gun for myself and/or wife. Please keep us posted on how it works out. My wife hasn't done much shooting in her life and I don't want her to have to worry about jam issues. Maybe the .38 revolver is still the most reliable.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

I would tend to agree with he recoil control issue. I would say that that once she gets a little higher on the grip it goes away.

 

[El Jason]

It sounds like a classic limp wrist issue. Happens with guys also. The web of her thumb should be right up into the tang, pretty tight.

If she is shooting two handed and doing this, she also isn't likely locking her wrists out to give her the most stability and recoil control. What is her support hand doing? Is it "tea cupping" the bottom of the grip? If so, have her get it up higher so that both thumbs are at the same level. The meaty part of the off hand thumb should press into the grip between the fingers and thumb of her shooting hand.

I'll try to take a picture tonight to better illustrate it.

 

[El Jason]

I have been considering the same gun for myself and/or wife. Please keep us posted on how it works out. My wife hasn't done much shooting in her life and I don't want her to have to worry about jam issues. Maybe the .38 revolver is still the most reliable.

Glocks are incredibly reliable. I used to make fun of them all of the time. I've been shooting one for five years now, and have been nothing but impressed with them. A revolver MAY be a little more foolproof, but not by much.

 

[Aries]

It sounds like a classic limp wrist issue.

What he said.

 

[chuckyd313]

My wife used to shoot the same way. I had to tell her over and over to choke up on the grip and to make sure she keeps her wrists stiff. She has a G19 and now that it doesnt jam up anymore she loves it.

 

[James Riley]

Yes, she was tea cupping with her off-hand. We'll make some corrections as you all suggest. I guess I take a lot for granted having shot for so long, I am not a "teacher" and she is new to this. She's fired my 1911 without a problem but this little gun is new to us both. I wanted a Colt Mustang but this was a last minute purchase, kind of like buying gifts on Christmas Eve at 7-11.

I will update after we get to town and buy more ammo for it.

Thanks all.

 

[elkantlers]

Sounds like recoil control to me... Could also be limp wrists...

My bet is limp wrist.

When I bought my wife a CC weapon I went with the S&W 642 revolver in 38 W/ crimson trace grips. Some women have a hard time working a semi auto and in cruch time I like the idea that all she has to do is pull the trigger.

 

[MichiganMan]

Glock 42

The glock 42 is now my carry weapon. Easy to carry. Shoots well. So far I put 550 rounds through mine with no jams or stove pipes. The gun disappears it so small while carrying. I will never carry a full size gun again.
She must be limp wristing. If it continues I would consider a revolver. Ruger LCR is what I bought my wife and she was pleasantly surprised at how well it shoots. You can never go wrong with a smith either.

 

[StrutNut]

It is limp wrist. I used to be a Conceal Carry instructor and saw it all the time. I would never carry a glock for that reason. Even though I have good form if I am injured somehow, who knows.

 

[6speed]

I have to train people to shoot the full size 45 Glock 21 for work. Limp wristing, allowing the frame of the gun to move rearward as the slide operates, is a very common problem. Proper grip is critical. Try this, clear the weapon, have her point it down range with only her strong hand make sure there is no gap between the tang and the web of her hand. The thumb of her hand should be pointing at the target. This helps with both target acquisition and grip. Once she has a good strong hand grip add her off hand to the mix by placing the thumb of her off hand under the thumb of her strong hand. Both thumbs should point to the target again assisting with target acquisition. The end of the thumb of her strong hand will generally be at about the knuckle of her off hand and the meaty part of her off hand should fill the space on the grip left uncovered by her strong hand. Once the thumbs are in place the fingers should wrap naturally around the grip.

 

[El Jason]

It is limp wrist. I used to be a Conceal Carry instructor and saw it all the time. I would never carry a glock for that reason. Even though I have good form if I am injured somehow, who knows.

I also train people to shoot with Glock 21's. We shoot quite frequently with weak hand only, and also do a drill where the shooters hold the gun only with their thumb and their trigger finger. Even small statured shooters can do this without limp wristing.

Edit: Also, limp wristing certainly isn't unique to Glocks. It can happen with any semi auto pistol.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

I find it difficult to judge a Glock to harshly, as some of most experienced combat shooters (I am not talking about 3gun or IDPA) chose a Glock when given a choice (75th Rangers, US Special Forces, Delta).

IMHO, no semi auto pistol should be relied upon to save your life until it has been throughly broken in. Maybe 500 rnds or so. Not only does this smooth out functioning, but it also builds muscle memory in the shooter.

James, google "modified isosceles stance". This is the technique taught to most serious combat shooters, and the grip assosciated with it is what JLS was talking about. Having a limp wrist can only be part of the problem. You can have a super solid wrist, but weak elbow position, it is all about giving the recoil spring something solid to push back against.

 

[El Jason]

I find it difficult to judge a Glock to harshly, as some of most experienced combat shooters (I am not talking about 3gun or IDPA) chose a Glock when given a choice (75th Rangers, US Special Forces, Delta).

IMHO, no semi auto pistol should be relied upon to save your life until it has been throughly broken in. Maybe 500 rnds or so.

Not to mention a great number of SWAT teams across the US.

And yes, break in is crucial. I had a Kahr CW40 that took 200 rounds before it would cycle reliably every time. The next 300 rounds were flawless.

FWIW, I've never seen a Glock have any major issues during break in.

 

[MinnesotaHunter]

And yes, break in is crucial. I had a Kahr CW40 that took 200 rounds before it would cycle reliably every time. The next 300 rounds were flawless.

Kahrs are notorious for this. Great pistols, but they come pretty rough functioning from the factory.

 

[6speed]

We shoot quite frequently with weak hand only, and also do a drill where the shooters hold the gun only with their thumb and their trigger finger.

A good drill that necessitates the need for proper web of the hand positioning.

 

[starvingoutdoorsman]

I would say limp wrist also. I have a G20 and it happened to me a couple times about 2 years ago out shooting one day.