Are tungsten turkey loads worth the money?

[Bonasababy]

Please expand on this? If it is going away I'd like to get a few more boxes to carry me through my turkey hunting days.

Much of our tungsten comes from China. Think about Tariffs. The war creates more demand for an already limited supply. Raw material shortages and increasing prices have led to some stopping new production all together. Talk of that not changing anytime soon.

 

[Wild Bill]

I'll start with this. I'm not saying that TSS isn't effective, but I just get a kick out of all the praise here that birds shot with TSS don't flop when they die, as opposed by birds shot with any other lead based turkey load that do flop when they die. So what?

My dad gave me 2 boxes (10 shells) of 20 gauge Federal 3rd Degree TSS that he hadn't used. I've killed 4 toms with those loads this year. Shots from 12 to 38 yards. All birds died. All birds flopped. All one shot clean kills with no shot in the breast. They're good rounds, but all those birds would have died just the same with 3" Long Beard XR #6 ($2.70/round).

Do both rounds not cause turkeys to cease being alive when it's all said and done? Is there a real tangible benefit of the turkey not flopping at all? And if so, is the cost worth it?

Just a quick thought experiment here. According to google AI, TSS is 5-10x more expensive than standard nickel-plated lead. For this exercise, we'll say 7x.


Just for fun, lets change the scenario to whitetail deer using a .270. Again, google AI says the average cost of a .270 average/budget hunting round (Hornady American Whitetail) costs about $1.20-$1.45/ round, or about $29.00/box.


If there was a new development in rifle ammo that caused a whitetail deer to drop dead on the spot (not because of shot placement, but because of the specific projectile) rather than running 30 yards and falling over dead, would you pay 7x for that round? That would be equivalent to about $200 box of 20 rounds (on the low end).

If you're now killing birds with TSS that you could not kill with a basic lead round, I'd simply challenge you to get the bird closer. That is what turkey hunting is about. Or spend some time patterning your gun to know what kind of pattern you shoot at different ranges. The reinventing of the wheel, IMO is unnecessary and a move by ammo manufacturers to get more cash out of your pocket.

Maybe I'm the old man (35) yelling at clouds here, but in the end you're still bringing home a dead turkey, you're just spending a lot more money than you need to. Long Beard XRs (or any other quality round) are always on the shelf for me now and I don't have to sell a kidney for them. You guys can keep buying the TSS.

Sorry, end of rant.

 

[MNElkNut]

Good conversation.

The clouds answer: If I was shooting 20 rounds per year at turkeys, I think cost would make a difference. But 1 shot? Decimal dust. Is it more effective, I believe it is but YMMV. More effective killing means less chance of a wounded bird running or flying away. I like that a lot. It really bothers me to see a wounded animal or bird. Ethically, I like a bird who doesn't even flop. Killed instantly. Mine did that this year.

As for deer, if I could spend more to anchor a deer or elk on the spot, 100% of the time I would choose that. I would sell your other kidney so I could afford it Bill!!

 

[Bonasababy]

The difference isnt as big in 20s and even less so in 16s and 12s. But in .410 and I assume 28s its a huge difference. And in those recoil is minimal, important to kids and some people.

 

[Sheltowee]

I'll start with this. I'm not saying that TSS isn't effective, but I just get a kick out of all the praise here that birds shot with TSS don't flop when they die, as opposed by birds shot with any other lead based turkey load that do flop when they die. So what?

My dad gave me 2 boxes (10 shells) of 20 gauge Federal 3rd Degree TSS that he hadn't used. I've killed 4 toms with those loads this year. Shots from 12 to 38 yards. All birds died. All birds flopped. All one shot clean kills with no shot in the breast. They're good rounds, but all those birds would have died just the same with 3" Long Beard XR #6 ($2.70/round).

Do both rounds not cause turkeys to cease being alive when it's all said and done? Is there a real tangible benefit of the turkey not flopping at all? And if so, is the cost worth it?

Just a quick thought experiment here. According to google AI, TSS is 5-10x more expensive than standard nickel-plated lead. For this exercise, we'll say 7x.
View attachment 407765

Just for fun, lets change the scenario to whitetail deer using a .270. Again, google AI says the average cost of a .270 average/budget hunting round (Hornady American Whitetail) costs about $1.20-$1.45/ round, or about $29.00/box.
View attachment 407767

If there was a new development in rifle ammo that caused a whitetail deer to drop dead on the spot (not because of shot placement, but because of the specific projectile) rather than running 30 yards and falling over dead, would you pay 7x for that round? That would be equivalent to about $200 box of 20 rounds (on the low end).

If you're now killing birds with TSS that you could not kill with a basic lead round, I'd simply challenge you to get the bird closer. That is what turkey hunting is about. Or spend some time patterning your gun to know what kind of pattern you shoot at different ranges. The reinventing of the wheel, IMO is unnecessary and a move by ammo manufacturers to get more cash out of your pocket.

Maybe I'm the old man (35) yelling at clouds here, but in the end you're still bringing home a dead turkey, you're just spending a lot more money than you need to. Long Beard XRs (or any other quality round) are always on the shelf for me now and I don't have to sell a kidney for them. You guys can keep buying the TSS.

Sorry, end of rant.

TSS is to lead shot what an ELD-M or a Berger (or, dare I say, a Hammer) is to a flatbased cup-and-core. The old standbys will kill just as effectively within their range but there are marginal improvements in range, pattern density and the ability to use smaller calibers/bores. I rolled my Kansas bird at a slightly-longer-than-ideal range this year with 20 gauge TSS. I don't think I would have cleanly killed it with Remington Nitros.

I'll say that I shot my first couple of birds with Longbeard and it certainly stomps them. My only quibble with it was that the patterns were almost *too* tight using an X-Full turkey choke at spitting distance. The TSS patterns seem to open a little faster but still retain desired density at longer ranges.

 

[Hem]

I dont buy lattes, I buy TSS.

 

[X13]

If you're now killing birds with TSS that you could not kill with a basic lead round, I'd simply challenge you to get the bird closer.

No thank you. One $12 shell to kill a turkey at 50-60 yards is far from the dumbest thing I’ll spend money on this year

 

[NR_Hunter]

On paper, and on birds, #9 TSS is some bad medicine. I patterned at 25 and 50 yards, and the #9 shot at 50 was punching thru the sheet metal and I had my paper on. The lead 5's wasn't at all. I have cleanly killed turkeys at distances with it I'm not proud to admit. I turkey hunt with a bow now, if I even go at all.

 

[NoWiser]

I’ll use lead myself with no problem, but my kids aren’t shooting turkey loads out of a 12 gauge. TSS allows us to use the .410. They can enjoy the hunt without having to worry about getting their bell rung. As long as we keep it to a shot or two per year, I’ll hopefully have enough to last until prices come down.

 

[alwayshunting]

I have used Long Beard XR for quite awhile now. Typically only shoot a few rounds a year depending on how many tags I have. For how few shells I shoot the actual cost is probably not the limiting factor. The thought of a tinu tungsten pellets in the meat is more of a concern. My wife already finds every lead or steel pellet I miss in the meat.

 

[Bonasababy]

I dont buy lattes, I buy TSS.

Is your last name Tafoya, by chance?

 

[Hem]

Is your last name Tafoya, by chance?

Huh?

 

[Wild Bill]

I understand the .410 argument. I have one and I shoot TSS out of it. It makes sense. I should have clarified, I'm speaking more on anyone buying TSS in anything other that .410.

 

[WIbiggame]

I understand the .410 argument. I have one and I shoot TSS out of it. It makes sense. I should have clarified, I'm speaking more on anyone buying TSS in anything other that .410.

This is what I meant to say when I changed my mind. I see no reason to shoot it out of a 20g or 12g but I feel its a must in the 410 and 28g.

 

[Hem]

Any other changes to add to opinion?

 

[Gellar]

I dont buy lattes, I buy TSS.

Do you put your pinkie up when you load your .410? ️

 

[Hem]

Do you put your pinkie up when you load your .410? ️

I dont have a .410 turkey gun, im ashamed to have a 20 bore and shoot TSS.
I DO have a pinkie that " froze" a few years back, its better, but still sticks out kinda funny like. Thank goodness, for awhile l couldnt put my hand in my pocket without hanging up.

 

[shannerdrake]

I'll start with this. I'm not saying that TSS isn't effective, but I just get a kick out of all the praise here that birds shot with TSS don't flop when they die, as opposed by birds shot with any other lead based turkey load that do flop when they die. So what?

My dad gave me 2 boxes (10 shells) of 20 gauge Federal 3rd Degree TSS that he hadn't used. I've killed 4 toms with those loads this year. Shots from 12 to 38 yards. All birds died. All birds flopped. All one shot clean kills with no shot in the breast. They're good rounds, but all those birds would have died just the same with 3" Long Beard XR #6 ($2.70/round).

Do both rounds not cause turkeys to cease being alive when it's all said and done? Is there a real tangible benefit of the turkey not flopping at all? And if so, is the cost worth it?

Just a quick thought experiment here. According to google AI, TSS is 5-10x more expensive than standard nickel-plated lead. For this exercise, we'll say 7x.
View attachment 407765

Just for fun, lets change the scenario to whitetail deer using a .270. Again, google AI says the average cost of a .270 average/budget hunting round (Hornady American Whitetail) costs about $1.20-$1.45/ round, or about $29.00/box.
View attachment 407767

If there was a new development in rifle ammo that caused a whitetail deer to drop dead on the spot (not because of shot placement, but because of the specific projectile) rather than running 30 yards and falling over dead, would you pay 7x for that round? That would be equivalent to about $200 box of 20 rounds (on the low end).

If you're now killing birds with TSS that you could not kill with a basic lead round, I'd simply challenge you to get the bird closer. That is what turkey hunting is about. Or spend some time patterning your gun to know what kind of pattern you shoot at different ranges. The reinventing of the wheel, IMO is unnecessary and a move by ammo manufacturers to get more cash out of your pocket.

Maybe I'm the old man (35) yelling at clouds here, but in the end you're still bringing home a dead turkey, you're just spending a lot more money than you need to. Long Beard XRs (or any other quality round) are always on the shelf for me now and I don't have to sell a kidney for them. You guys can keep buying the TSS.

Sorry, end of rant.

I have a lot of Longbeard XRs. Care to trade for those TSSs? I’ll pay shipping.

Premium ammo isn’t about ideal or perfect scenarios.

Also, praising Longbeard XRs is actually a logical fallacy. If premium ammo like TSS is unnecessary and overly expensive, why compare it to the MOST premium of lead loads? If it’s all about calling them in closer, why use premium anything? You can get Winchester Super X 12 gauge #5s for $8 for 10. Or $.80 per round. Longbeard is almost 3.5x as expensive! I’m being extreme to make a point.

Ammo is the absolute cheapest part of my hunt. I’ll shoot a cheap firearm before I go cheap on ammo (and often do).

Now the fact that you laid down four birds this year means you are a turkey killing machine. Nothing but respect for that. If I was pulling the trigger four times a year on birds I might reconsider. But where I hunt I’m lucky to hear a gobble every few days and a good year is seeing a Longbeard.

 

[DIY HUNTER]

A good shot at the head and neck at 30 yds and in with a full choke with lead it will be a dead bird every time. When you start getting 40+ yards a bit tighter choke and heavier shot will be worth the money. I still use the federal heavyweight shot which is just a tick less dense than tss and it is wonderful. As far as chokes I have known plenty of guys shoot past really close birds with really tight chokes. You have to be on em if they are close, if they are always at 30 to 40 yds + then a tighter choke is fine. All of it boils down to the terrain you are in.