The Hedgehog
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2000
- Messages
- 11,620
Isn't that nice of them, offering to sell our land to rebuild a coastal city that is under sea level. Don't let jackasses like this get re-elected.
Anyone Else Seen This Land Grab
- Thread starter Nemont
- Start date
cjcj
New member
Nemont said:cjcj,
The current plan is to rebuild the levee's to withstand a Cat 4 storm so if another Katrina comes along NOLA would still be flooded. Why rebuild the areas that are under sea level at taxpayer expense.
Nemont,I agree 100%... I don`t think we should rebuild That shithole [New Orleans]....Any part that is not above sea level should not have 1 dime of taxpayer money put towards rebuilding any kind of structure that is just waiting for another Disaster. hump
i threw out the question [ how to pay for it] just for feedback.
Sorry to mislead anyone who thinks i would support rebuilding it.
there are other discussions[threads] where i have came out totaly against rebuilding.
Ithaca 37
New member
Please keep these editorials and articles in a file to show your friends as the gubernatorial race in Idaho heats up. I've told a few staunch Republican friends about this bill and Otter's role in it and they wouldn't believe me 'til I showed them proof. From now on I think I'll sucker the Otter supporters into a bet about it! I think I'll give my winnings to the Brady campaign.
I think I'll give my winnings to the Brady campaign.Ithaca 37
New member
Here's a great guest editorial that explains the facts:
Edition Date: 01-04-2006
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On Dec. 19, gubernatorial candidate Jerry Brady criticized U.S. Rep. Butch Otter for cosponsoring H.R. 3855, legislation that would mandate the sale of 15 percent of land held by the Forest Service and the Interior Department to help pay for hurricane Katrina.
In his response in the Idaho Statesman the next day, Otter said the bill was "an effort to restore to local property tax rolls some carefully selected parcels" (5,000,000 acres?!)
News flash, Butch: These lands were never on the tax rolls, and most generate payments in lieu of taxes from the managing agencies.
Second, the legislation's intent statement says it is to raise funds for Katrina and future disasters, not bolster the tax rolls of local or state government.
Third, Otter says land is "too often locked up from multiple use by the federal government." Wrong. Government agencies manage with multiple use, and lands now open to the public could be really locked up in private ownership.
Otter wants to know "where the criticism was when the federal government sold large portions of the Boise Foothills to the city of Boise." Didn't happen. It was a trade of state endowment lands in the Foothills for federal timber land up north. The feds actually gained ground in the Foothills. The people of Boise approved Foothills preservation by voting for a levy to fund it. That's right, people, voting. What a concept. Because of it, the land is protected from development, provides habitat and remains open to the public — unlike the private developer's dream it might have become under a plan like Otter's.
The bill doesn't just include the forest and sagebrush that we typically identify with the Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management. It also includes land managed by the Bureau of Reclamation — waterfront property that would be ripe for real-estate development. You lose access to the shoreline, you lose access from your boat to the public land behind the shore. If federal lands go private, we will also lose access to other public lands behind them. The total impact may well be double the 15 percent predicted.
Otter threw out the term "self-appointed conservationists." We take that to mean us. Combined, we have more than 80 years as professionals working for conservation. Otter's conservation record includes paying a fine and restoring a wetland he illegally drained.
This proposal is not about placing land on the tax rolls or about providing cash for disaster relief. This proposal is about those who covet public lands. It is about those who would rather not share the resources, beauty or recreation that public lands provide. The politically and financially powerful would be the winners in the land rush that would follow passage of this legislation.
If you care about Idaho's public lands, write to your congressional representatives and tell them what a bad proposal this is. Write to your local newspapers so Otter can see how out of touch he is with Idahoans. If you belong to an outdoor-oriented group, urge your organization to speak up. Jerry Brady was right: Otter has a bad idea.
A great American, Republican President Theodore Roosevelt, set aside more than 234 million acres of public lands as national parks, forests, monuments and wildlife refuges. In 1916 he said: "Our duty to the whole, including the unborn generations, bids us restrain an unprincipled present-day minority from wasting the heritage of these unborn generations. The movement for the conservation of wildlife and the larger movement for the conservation of all our natural resources are essentially democratic in spirit, purpose, and method."
Roll over, Teddy!
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060104/NEWS0503/601040308/1055
Please save all this info on what Otter is doing and show your friends next Fall as the race for Governor heats up.
Edition Date: 01-04-2006
Email This ArticlePrinter Friendly Page
On Dec. 19, gubernatorial candidate Jerry Brady criticized U.S. Rep. Butch Otter for cosponsoring H.R. 3855, legislation that would mandate the sale of 15 percent of land held by the Forest Service and the Interior Department to help pay for hurricane Katrina.
In his response in the Idaho Statesman the next day, Otter said the bill was "an effort to restore to local property tax rolls some carefully selected parcels" (5,000,000 acres?!)
News flash, Butch: These lands were never on the tax rolls, and most generate payments in lieu of taxes from the managing agencies.
Second, the legislation's intent statement says it is to raise funds for Katrina and future disasters, not bolster the tax rolls of local or state government.
Third, Otter says land is "too often locked up from multiple use by the federal government." Wrong. Government agencies manage with multiple use, and lands now open to the public could be really locked up in private ownership.
Otter wants to know "where the criticism was when the federal government sold large portions of the Boise Foothills to the city of Boise." Didn't happen. It was a trade of state endowment lands in the Foothills for federal timber land up north. The feds actually gained ground in the Foothills. The people of Boise approved Foothills preservation by voting for a levy to fund it. That's right, people, voting. What a concept. Because of it, the land is protected from development, provides habitat and remains open to the public — unlike the private developer's dream it might have become under a plan like Otter's.
The bill doesn't just include the forest and sagebrush that we typically identify with the Forest Service and Bureau of Land Management. It also includes land managed by the Bureau of Reclamation — waterfront property that would be ripe for real-estate development. You lose access to the shoreline, you lose access from your boat to the public land behind the shore. If federal lands go private, we will also lose access to other public lands behind them. The total impact may well be double the 15 percent predicted.
Otter threw out the term "self-appointed conservationists." We take that to mean us. Combined, we have more than 80 years as professionals working for conservation. Otter's conservation record includes paying a fine and restoring a wetland he illegally drained.
This proposal is not about placing land on the tax rolls or about providing cash for disaster relief. This proposal is about those who covet public lands. It is about those who would rather not share the resources, beauty or recreation that public lands provide. The politically and financially powerful would be the winners in the land rush that would follow passage of this legislation.
If you care about Idaho's public lands, write to your congressional representatives and tell them what a bad proposal this is. Write to your local newspapers so Otter can see how out of touch he is with Idahoans. If you belong to an outdoor-oriented group, urge your organization to speak up. Jerry Brady was right: Otter has a bad idea.
A great American, Republican President Theodore Roosevelt, set aside more than 234 million acres of public lands as national parks, forests, monuments and wildlife refuges. In 1916 he said: "Our duty to the whole, including the unborn generations, bids us restrain an unprincipled present-day minority from wasting the heritage of these unborn generations. The movement for the conservation of wildlife and the larger movement for the conservation of all our natural resources are essentially democratic in spirit, purpose, and method."
Roll over, Teddy!
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060104/NEWS0503/601040308/1055
Please save all this info on what Otter is doing and show your friends next Fall as the race for Governor heats up.
Ithaca 37
New member
Even Otter was smart enough to figure out he was losing votes!
******************************************************
C.L. "Butch" Otter: Support for bill allowing public land sales was a mistake
Edition Date: 01-06-2006
Email This ArticlePrinter Friendly Page
I was wrong.
It wasn't the first time, and it won't be the last.
I'll take my lumps as they come — no one in public life should consider themselves above error. My political mentor, former Governor Phil Batt, lived by the principle that everyone whom the public holds in trust should be prepared to own up to their mistakes.
I always have, and I always will.
For now, that means withdrawing my co-sponsorship and support for H.R. 3855, a bill before the House Resources Committee that Colorado Congressman Tom Tancredo introduced as a way of sending a message to our absentee federal landlords in the West.
I joined Congressman Tancredo as an original co-sponsor of the bill, in part, because I was frustrated that Congress had identified no revenue source to cover the cost of the billions of dollars already appropriated for Hurricane Katrina relief. At the same time, the measure provided the chance for another in a series of "shots across the bow" on the issue of federal land management that I have supported during my time in Congress.
The federal government, which controls almost two-thirds of Idaho's land mass — forest and rangeland that is exempt from the property taxes that you and I pay — has a responsibility to carry its own weight.
Counties in Idaho, particularly those in more rural areas, routinely are shortchanged by millions of dollars on Payments in Lieu of Taxes that Congress has promised as a way to help compensate local communities — critical dollars that are needed to support such services as education, roads and law enforcement.
Federal officials also are failing to maintain such facilities as the backcountry airstrips and other means of access needed for emergency response for citizens who use public lands. The government's reach simply exceeds its grasp.
Regardless, my critics are correct that this bill is not the right approach.
I have been a strong advocate for greater access to our federal lands throughout my public life. I have fought for more multiple use of our forests and rangelands, and for more control by Idahoans over decisions that influence access and use of these tremendous natural resources.
As an avid sportsman, a Grand Slam member of Ducks Unlimited and a life member of Safari Club International, I understand the importance of public land both to our wildlife and to the hunting and fishing public. I also understand that too often federal policies — from "critical habitat" and wilderness study area designations to restrictions on motorized vehicles — have kept Idaho citizens from fully experiencing the wonders of our own state's public lands.
Rest assured, I will continue fighting for better management of, and greater access to, our public lands for all Idahoans.
And finally, thank you to the people who have called and written and stopped me on the street to express their earnest thoughts on this matter. I particularly want to thank the members and leaders of a relatively new organization, Idaho Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife, for their thoughtful and responsible approach.
C.L. "Butch" Otter, a Republican, represents Idaho's 1st Congressional District.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060106/NEWS0503/601060318/1052/NEWS05
******************************************************
C.L. "Butch" Otter: Support for bill allowing public land sales was a mistake
Edition Date: 01-06-2006
Email This ArticlePrinter Friendly Page
I was wrong.
It wasn't the first time, and it won't be the last.
I'll take my lumps as they come — no one in public life should consider themselves above error. My political mentor, former Governor Phil Batt, lived by the principle that everyone whom the public holds in trust should be prepared to own up to their mistakes.
I always have, and I always will.
For now, that means withdrawing my co-sponsorship and support for H.R. 3855, a bill before the House Resources Committee that Colorado Congressman Tom Tancredo introduced as a way of sending a message to our absentee federal landlords in the West.
I joined Congressman Tancredo as an original co-sponsor of the bill, in part, because I was frustrated that Congress had identified no revenue source to cover the cost of the billions of dollars already appropriated for Hurricane Katrina relief. At the same time, the measure provided the chance for another in a series of "shots across the bow" on the issue of federal land management that I have supported during my time in Congress.
The federal government, which controls almost two-thirds of Idaho's land mass — forest and rangeland that is exempt from the property taxes that you and I pay — has a responsibility to carry its own weight.
Counties in Idaho, particularly those in more rural areas, routinely are shortchanged by millions of dollars on Payments in Lieu of Taxes that Congress has promised as a way to help compensate local communities — critical dollars that are needed to support such services as education, roads and law enforcement.
Federal officials also are failing to maintain such facilities as the backcountry airstrips and other means of access needed for emergency response for citizens who use public lands. The government's reach simply exceeds its grasp.
Regardless, my critics are correct that this bill is not the right approach.
I have been a strong advocate for greater access to our federal lands throughout my public life. I have fought for more multiple use of our forests and rangelands, and for more control by Idahoans over decisions that influence access and use of these tremendous natural resources.
As an avid sportsman, a Grand Slam member of Ducks Unlimited and a life member of Safari Club International, I understand the importance of public land both to our wildlife and to the hunting and fishing public. I also understand that too often federal policies — from "critical habitat" and wilderness study area designations to restrictions on motorized vehicles — have kept Idaho citizens from fully experiencing the wonders of our own state's public lands.
Rest assured, I will continue fighting for better management of, and greater access to, our public lands for all Idahoans.
And finally, thank you to the people who have called and written and stopped me on the street to express their earnest thoughts on this matter. I particularly want to thank the members and leaders of a relatively new organization, Idaho Sportsmen for Fish and Wildlife, for their thoughtful and responsible approach.
C.L. "Butch" Otter, a Republican, represents Idaho's 1st Congressional District.
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060106/NEWS0503/601060318/1052/NEWS05
What I can't believe is that I've talked with hunter's who support both this and Pombo's mining law revision!!! Though I understand that management of public lands by the federal agencies is not perfect, IMO it is much better than a lot of the alternatives.
BuzzH
Well-known member
Pointer,
Have you read any posts by Elkcheese lately?
You shouldnt be surprised at all that crap like this is supported by "hunters"...
Have you read any posts by Elkcheese lately?
You shouldnt be surprised at all that crap like this is supported by "hunters"...
Nemont
Well-known member
I see that Cubin of Wyoming is saying that her name was "mistakeningly" used as a cosponsor on this bill.
Yeah right. She was getting an earful from sportsman and other user of public lands.
Nemont
Yeah right. She was getting an earful from sportsman and other user of public lands.
Nemont
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