Ukraine / Russia

[Rhcuam]

All probably true - but where in that says we can't help a bit? Help the Ukraine as France helped us, make Putin's pay a full price for his behavior?

“A bit” is what worries me.

It is not easily defined and a little bit to me might be a lot to you or vice versa.
Throwing $1 billion their way on top of what we’ve already sent seems like more than a bit to me. The idiotic plane swap idea was more than a bit. Might’ve been an act of war.

 

[VikingsGuy]

“A bit” is what worries me.

It is not easily defined and a little bit to me might be a lot to you or vice versa.
Throwing $1 billion their way on top of what we’ve already sent seems like more than a bit to me. The idiotic plane swap idea was more than a bit. Might’ve been an act of war.

We agree on the bizarre plane plan. Either use our planes or don’t - the charade was pathetic. I also agree, at this point we should put no US troops in harms way and should not provide big weapons systems. As for the $1B - seems like a drop in the bucket to make Putin’s task more daunting, but maybe that’s just me.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Two of the three were wars we were directly involved in. This one is not. I’ll say it louder for the kids in the back. This is not our war. We should not allow ourselves to get drug into it. And yeah I wasn’t real crazy about the Wall Street bail outs or the auto bail outs.

It feels like our war with the exception of our soldiers doing the killing and dying. Ukraine has been a NATO (US) / Russia ping pong ball being bounced back and forth for a long time. We've sponsored the overthrow of Russia friendly governments and are now providing weapons for them to kill Russians. Maybe its not "our war" but we're certainly involved and have been long prior to this current Russian attack.

 

[BigHornRam]

I see the complete wreckage of property, the cost to rebuild, the waste of precious resources, the refugees, the environmental and economic destruction..........so fricking senseless.

 

[Irrelevant]

I see the complete wreckage of property, the cost to rebuild, the waste of precious resources, the refugees, the environmental and economic destruction..........so fricking senseless.

I can't imagine what it will take, or how long, to rebuild those urban areas. All those apartment building that will need to be completely demoed then rebuilt. Just such a waste.

 

[VikingsGuy]

I see the complete wreckage of property, the cost to rebuild, the waste of precious resources, the refugees, the environmental and economic destruction..........so fricking senseless.

It is bizarre - other than his completely irrational belief he will be Peter the Great/Stalin of the 22nd century why lift a finger to control Ukraine. If he is a fan of history he should remember how poor hopeless satellite states bled mother Russia dry while the US had large and prosperous allies. And nato on his doorstep is a lousy reason, as before the attack nato had become a confused and bureaucratic paper tiger that would likely only act to protect the traditional west under the gravest circumstances.

So, when Putin wins he will now have another poor hungry satellite national to manage, an insurgency to manage, significantly economic issues at home, and a united nato. Call it a “win” in the loosest terms.

In the end all he really did was turn Russian into China’s Cuba. Will they be chanting “we’re #2” at the kremlin soon?

 

[Panda Bear]

We ( Canada ) have sent nearly one billion dollars to Ukraine since 2014 and now we have decided to "loan" them another 500 million. Does anybody keep track of where this money goes ? Does any of it end up in personal bank accounts. We had a discussion this morning ( not here ) about the majority of citizens from Finland wanting their government to join Nato. The citizens of Finland had never had a majority wanting that to happen in the past . But they do now. People here who know I spend a bit of time Greenland have ask about Greenland. Denmark is already part of NATO. Would boots on the ground by the UN end up like Korea, Viet Nam, Afghanistan or do we fear worse form Putin if the U.N. entered the fray. At this time the United Nations have elected not to enter the fray, but was wondering what your opinions were on them doing so, especially in the capitol of Ukraine, since it seems to be public knowledge that Putin has sent people into Ukraine with the express purpose of murdering a Head Of State of a Country. And if that happen, is it Putins thought that the replacement would favor working with Russia

Following this thread it is obvious that some of you have a fairly good grasp on world events, Russia, Ukraine, NATO, and this war. Far more than I do anyway.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

As for the $1B - seems like a drop in the bucket to make Putin’s task more daunting, but maybe that’s just me.

It's depressing how little billions of government spending even grab attention now that we're sitting 30 trillion in debt.

 

[BigHornRam]

It is bizarre - other than his completely irrational belief he will be Peter the Great/Stalin of the 22nd century why lift a finger to control Ukraine. If he is a fan of history he should remember how poor hopeless satellite states bled mother Russia dry while the US had large and prosperous allies. And nato on his doorstep is a lousy reason, as before the attack nato had become a confused and bureaucratic paper tiger that would likely only act to protect the traditional west under the gravest circumstances.

So, when Putin wins he will now have another poor hungry satellite national to manage, an insurgency to manage, significantly economic issues at home, and a united nato. Call it a “win” in the loosest terms.

In the end all he really did was turn Russian into China’s Cuba. Will they be chanting “we’re #2” at the kremlin soon?

That's why I think he really just wants to light everything up. A rational person would understand that.

 

[Sytes]

We ( Canada ) have sent nearly one trillion dollars to Ukraine since 2014 and now we have decided to "loan" them another 500 million. Does anybody keep track of where this money goes ?

Ukraine has been pretty corrupt for the longest time. Firearms and slaves (sex and work) are heavily black market trafficked "commodities". While I'm 100% in Ukraine's corner against Russia, Ukraine is a gateway hub for transiting illegal goods. President Zelenskyy has been countering this element of Ukrainian's history though I'm sure it's a challenge and a half - now compounded by this event... the refugees are the new fish for the criminal element, unfortunately.
Also, Trying to find your $. Not questioning you though not sure that trillion is correct(?). I found Canada has given Ukraine $890 million since 2014 with an appropriated $340 million since Russia invaded though I believe you're thinking a Billion?

 

[VikingsGuy]

We ( Canada ) have sent nearly one trillion dollars to Ukraine since 2014 and now we have decided to "loan" them another 500 million.

Just to clarify, it is a little less than 1 Billion, not trillion. A thousand fold difference

While I may be flip with a billion here and a billion there, I do draw the line at trillions

 

[VikingsGuy]

It's depressing how little billions of government spending even grab attention now that we're sitting 30 trillion in debt.

While I tend to be a fiscal conservative, in fairness, the US spending $1 billion in the Ukraine is the same as a guy who makes $50,000 spending $2 on a lotto ticket. (Yup our economy has gotten that crazy big that a billion dollars is only 0.004% of our economy)

 

[Deleted member 28227]

While I tend to be a fiscal conservative, in fairness, the US spending $1 billion in the Ukraine is the same as a guy who makes $50,000 spending $2 on a lotto ticket. (Yup our economy has gotten that crazy big that a billion dollars is only 0.004% of our economy)

Though also the Fish and Game budget of CO,WY,MT, and ID combined.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Though also the Fish and Game budget of CO,WY,MT, and ID combined.

The residents of those states are more than welcome to have MN style taxation to fund their priorities.

 

[Sytes]

Though also the Fish and Game budget of CO,WY,MT, and ID combined.

Not to discount Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax... 14 Billion.

 

[VikingsGuy]

Though also the Fish and Game budget of CO,WY,MT, and ID combined.

Serious question. If we subtract Robinson Patman funds, non-res licenses and fees, funds from out of state NGOs, and user fees, how much actual local taxpayer money does go to F&G in the mountain west?

 

[Sytes]

Serious question. If we subtract Robinson Patman funds, non-res licenses and fees, funds from out of state NGOs, and user fees, how much actual local taxpayer money does go to F&G in the mountain west?

God bless legal weed...

"In the first month, the state expects around $2.5 million in revenue from recreational sales alone. A state agency that will be receiving some of those funds is Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks (FWP).

“Any time you can add more resources the department can do more,” says Dustin Temple, deputy director of FWP.

When it comes to marijuana tax revenue, FWP gets a total of 32 percent. That then gets split up 4 ways with 20 percent going to the acquisition fund for the Habitat Montana Program. The remaining three get split up with each getting 4 percent. Those funds go to the general fund for State Parks, Trails and Recreational Facilities accounts and Non-Game Wildlife accounts.

Temple says most of their work at FWP is wildlife habitat and with the 20 percent it sets up FWP, and Montana, for success."

 

[VikingsGuy]

God bless legal weed...

"In the first month, the state expects around $2.5 million in revenue from recreational sales alone. A state agency that will be receiving some of those funds is Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks (FWP).

“Any time you can add more resources the department can do more,” says Dustin Temple, deputy director of FWP.

When it comes to marijuana tax revenue, FWP gets a total of 32 percent. That then gets split up 4 ways with 20 percent going to the acquisition fund for the Habitat Montana Program. The remaining three get split up with each getting 4 percent. Those funds go to the general fund for State Parks, Trails and Recreational Facilities accounts and Non-Game Wildlife accounts.

Temple says most of their work at FWP is wildlife habitat and with the 20 percent it sets up FWP, and Montana, for success."

Right up their with crony capitalism and veggie burgers, I hate sin taxes funding education and conservation.

 

[Panda Bear]

Just to clarify, it is a little less than 1 Billion, not trillion. A thousand fold difference

While I may be flip with a billion here and a billion there, I do draw the line at trillions

Yes, you are correct. thanks for the reply

 

[longbow51]

To make Panda feel better, to paraphrase an old joke, Biden heard there were two Brazilians lost in Washington, and brightened up immediately, thinking maybe losing a couple of trillion wasn't so bad.

And this is true, for a while in my last job a requirement when discussing federal or corporate expenditures was to actually write out the sums with all the zeros. Actually pretty effective.