Use Promo Code Randy for 20% off OutdoorClass

Exceeding Max Recommended Loads

Losing_Sanity

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2019
Messages
1,060
Location
Sometimes, I don't even know.
I have always been way too anal about not going over max recommended loads listed in the load manuals. Call it afraid or cautious, I don't usually load to the max. However, lately I have ignored my own advice and went over max recommendations with now signs of excess pressure on the case. Also, I worked up to max levels years ago with the current manual of that time. Today, with newer manuals, the max load is lower by 2 or 3 grains than in the manual used in the past. I called Sierra Tech Support and the consultant stated that this is due to the use of different rifles, powder lots, and testing conditions. Is it really that bad to go over, or is it common to exceed max recommendations using caution and watching for pressure signs? What do you do when chasing better groups and higher speeds? Any comments will be appreciated.
 
There are many variables to loading and MAX pressure for an individual rifle. Use proper eye protection and watch for pressure signs. When loading past book Max I normally increase by .3 or .5gr at a time and watch for pressure signs on the brass, bolt lift and velocity on the chrony.
Speed is nice but accuracy kills. If you aren’t obtaining the velocity you’re after I’d try another powder also.
 
I'll take accuracy over max velocity every time!
If i want more speed i'll choose a magnum.
That said, i have several "obsolete" cartridges that are built on modern bolt guns. Namely 250 Savage, 257 Roberts, 284 Win.
While sticking with the +P loads for the Roberts, the other 2 really shine with some increased pressure.
But everything done in moderation.
I've seen on this forum some people taking 280 Rem to 7mm Rem Mag velocities. Never a good idea.
 
One thing that was stressed to me is if you are in the higher end of the load when you switch powder lots reduce back and work back up
 
Every gun is different, start low work up to accuracy and if you find pressure sign stop. I own a bunch of weatherbys, usually start load development at just shy of published max load, lawyers screw up lots of stuff!
 
there is a reason why it is max recommended .

sure you can go over and more often then not with no issue . BUT ,it only takes once!

there are only a few people who I trust enough, that I would shoot their reloads
 
My .308 and 7mm08 both seem to have their most accurate loads when the primers are coming back a little flat. Sometimes that's still below the max load published, usually its a little over. I have a new .270 I've been trying to work up a load for, but so far haven't really found a level of accuracy I'm satisfied with. Yesterday I shot a ladder test using 140gn Federal TBT's and H4831sc. The max published by Federal Premium is 56gns. This seems a little over-cautious on Federal's part considering that Nosler list its max for tha 140gn Accubond as 58gn and Barnes as 60.1gn (if memory serves). On my ladder I went up to 56.4gn with no pressure signs. I feel I could go higher, but like the OP I'm a little cautious about. I believe I will try it, maybe on up to 58gn, or at least until the primers start coming back a little flat.
 
I don't reload but know many that do,and many of them should not..................more is better,less may work has ruined many rifles & faces.
Never understood folks who do not listen to advice ,on anything.
 
Max load is kind of bullshit. Now every rifle has a do not enter zone as far as powder charges go, but they can be quite a bit over what's listed, or quite a bit under. I have an 06 that's over pressure 2 grains below listed max load on a particular recipe. Start low, and work up watching velocities, and pressure signs, and stop when you find your rifles most accurate load without going too hot. Book data is great stuff, and should be followed as a starting point, but it ain't perfect by any means.
 
For the most part there isn't a great deal of practical difference between 2950 fps and say 3025 fps out to a few hundred yards as far as the game is concerned.

I'd use the manuals or other published data as a guide and check several to see how much they agree for a certain bullet weight and powder. I'm told that bolt lift is a better indicator of pressure than primer flatness since different brands of primers are of different hardness. Usually the Remington 9 1/2 are the hardest with Federal generally the softest.

Here is some published data for the 6.5-06 that can't possibly be right.

6.5-06 at https://imrpowder.com/warning/

I use 129 and/or 130 grain bullets interchangeably.

I routinely use up to 54 grains of IMR 4831 with a Federal 210 match primer and 129 grain or 130 grain Hornady or Sierra TGKs and don't see a pressure issue. The bolt lift is ok and the primers don't look flat hardly. I likely could creep higher, but don't see a lot of point to it.
I may contact them and see what they have to say about it.
 
Last edited:
I have simply gone to the Nosler Forum when I have any questions on reloading. Great group of guys and your getting Real Statistical data. Just ask for YOUR specific loads data and you'll get the brass tack QL facts, no bullshit. In truth, I've found that their data more closely matched my home grown results than "The Books".
 
I go over max loads probably more than I should. Something to remember about book data is I believe it's conservative to protect the maker of the data, lawyer loads. Been a long time since I found a max load I couldn't reach. But a lot of people will never exceed a max load and that is fine and dandy, they get what they are looking at at lower velocity's, no sweat! I think putting together the data is kind of like building a bridge. Build a bridge with a 40 ton weight limit and the bridge must stand when a weight equal to 1 1/2 time's the listed weight is put on it. Safety net! Makes sense too. Something I found with rifle's and pressure is you will get plenty of pressure signs long before you'll blow up the rifle. That's not to say just go for it but there is likely a safety net built into the book data. Imagine if there wasn't!
 
Last edited:
there is a reason why it is max recommended .

sure you can go over and more often then not with no issue . BUT ,it only takes once!

there are only a few people who I trust enough, that I would shoot their reloads

I too do not shoot other peoples reloads nor do I reload for anyone or let anyone shoot mine. It's just not worth the guilt if anything went wrong. (y)
 
My .308 and 7mm08 both seem to have their most accurate loads when the primers are coming back a little flat. Sometimes that's still below the max load published, usually its a little over. I have a new .270 I've been trying to work up a load for, but so far haven't really found a level of accuracy I'm satisfied with. Yesterday I shot a ladder test using 140gn Federal TBT's and H4831sc. The max published by Federal Premium is 56gns. This seems a little over-cautious on Federal's part considering that Nosler list its max for tha 140gn Accubond as 58gn and Barnes as 60.1gn (if memory serves). On my ladder I went up to 56.4gn with no pressure signs. I feel I could go higher, but like the OP I'm a little cautious about. I believe I will try it, maybe on up to 58gn, or at least until the primers start coming back a little flat.

That sounds like me! I'm really not too concerned with speed, but I am wanting good groups and the most out of the bullet. It seems with some calibers you just end up higher than published data. In another thread one contributor to the post commented (who knows a lot more than I do) that I may be going too slow with my 300 RCM, but faster loads seemed to spread out. Like I stated, I'm usually too anal about going to close to max. But as of late it seems it is necessary.
 
I go over max loads probably more than I should. Something to remember about book data is I believe it's conservative to protect the maker of the data, lawyer loads. Been a long time since I found a max load I couldn't reach. But a lot of people will never exceed a max load and that is fine and dandy, they get what they are looking at at lower velocity's, no sweat! I think putting together the data is kind of like building a bridge. Build a bridge with a 40 ton weight limit and the bridge must stand when a weight equal to 1 1/2 time's the listed weight is put on it. Safety net! Makes sense too. Something I found with rifle's and pressure is you will get plenty of pressure signs long before you'll blow up the rifle. That's not to say just go for it but there is likely a safety net built into the book data. Imagine if there wasn't!
This makes a lot of sense to me. I kind of have to think there is a plus or minus error rate. But, as long as we carefully watch the warning signs we shouldn't get into trouble.
 
I go over max loads probably more than I should. Something to remember about book data is I believe it's conservative to protect the maker of the data, lawyer loads. Been a long time since I found a max load I couldn't reach. But a lot of people will never exceed a max load and that is fine and dandy, they get what they are looking at at lower velocity's, no sweat! I think putting together the data is kind of like building a bridge. Build a bridge with a 40 ton weight limit and the bridge must stand when a weight equal to 1 1/2 time's the listed weight is put on it. Safety net! Makes sense too. Something I found with rifle's and pressure is you will get plenty of pressure signs long before you'll blow up the rifle. That's not to say just go for it but there is likely a safety net built into the book data. Imagine if there wasn't!


Well they have the advantage of pressure measuring equipment which the average handloader doesn't have so as long as the loads are within some sort industry accepted pressure range then that should good. Seems to me like 50,000 -60,000 or so is about the norm.
 
For the most part there isn't a great deal of practical difference between 2950 fps and say 3025 fps out to a few hundred yards as far as the game is concerned.

I'd use the manuals or other published data as a guide and check several to see how much they agree for a certain bullet weight and powder. I'm told that bolt lift is a better indicator of pressure than primer flatness since different brands of primers are of different hardness. Usually the Remington 9 1/2 are the hardest with Federal generally the softest.

Here is some published data for the 6.5-06 that can't possibly be right.

6.5-06 at https://imrpowder.com/warning/

I use 129 and/or 130 grain bullets interchangeably.

I routinely use up to 54 grains of IMR 4831 with a Federal 210 match primer and 129 grain or 130 grain Hornady or Sierra TGKs and don't see a pressure issue. The bolt lift is ok and the primers don't look flat hardly. I likely could creep higher, but don't see a lot of point to it.
I may contact them and see what they have to say about it.

I did send them an inquiry so I'll post with their reply. Their data for .25-06 and .270 Win with similar weight bullets seems more realistic and the data for all 3 should IMO be similar.
 
Some of the older reloading books have the same load with 3 to 7% more powder. If you know what your doing and read the signs the max book numbers are just a go-by guide. At the end of the day what really matters is a good group and low SDV.
 
I rarely look at loading books, but generally, pay attention to what powder companies publish. Most published loads are "lawyered" up a bit. Speer has been the most accurate velocities for me, as far as books go. I used to think that I needed to squeeze as much velocity out of a round as possible. I have come to realize that it is not that important, as long as the bullet performs well at the velocity that you settle on and the accuracy is there. I have burned out two barrels, partly because of running fairly hot loads. Now, I generally have found a load in about any caliber that is 1/2, to 1 grain under max, that has all of the performance necessary. An extra 100 fps is not a game changer for most cartridges and especially at normal hunting ranges. If you do a lot of shooting, your barrel will have better longevity, with more reasonable loads, also.
 
Back
Top