EF2’s 2020 Fall Hunt

[Pucky Freak]

Got to watch this deer and another like him spar and fight at 40 yards for 10 mins. He eventually came in to 3 yards.

This guy came in to 0 yards and got run off by the 1st one, then came back and worked a scrape. Lots of action for public land!

I went ahead and cancelled my week of vacation this week. Forecast is in the 70s Every day. The following week I have work commitments on 2 days, but I should be able to get out and hunt peak rut the rest of the time.

 

[Pucky Freak]

The two little guys met up again to spar in the same spot, so for another 15 mins I got to hear grunts, antler clacks, and brush crashing. Soon after, a doe came in to work the scrape, and passed at 5 yards. The last deer I saw was just a flash of antlers through thick brush 50 yards out. I tried getting him to turn my way with a snort wheeze and a couple grunts, but he ignored me. When walking out I saw by headlamp where the bucks had been fighting and the ground was all tore up down to the dirt.

 

[Pucky Freak]

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Fawn goes pretty quick because there is very little tallow to remove (calories go to body growth rather than fat reserves), the hide is easy to pull off, and meat between the ribs is so thin you can see thru it, and it’s not worth bothering with. The doe took quite a bit longer.

I feel like you could teach a master class in field butchering.

I like to think I'm decent at boning out in the field, but it always taken me a ton of time to deal with silver skin/tendons. That meat looks basically ready to wrap.

 

[Pucky Freak]

I feel like you could teach a master class in field butchering.

I like to think I'm decent at boning out in the field, but it always taken me a ton of time to deal with silver skin/tendons.

Haha...thanks, although you are closer than you think to having a speedier process. My fawn antelope was 3 hours from tagged to completely deboned, processed, wrapped, and chilled but the reasons that was so quick was I only removed the WY legally required meat, and there was zero tallow.

After totally processing maybe 15 animals I’ve learned where the silver, tallow, and tendons are (or aren’t) on each muscle, so the process for removing them is the same from cut to cut, etc.

The video Randy posted of the elk at the butcher shop was useful. They explain that if you can grip a piece of silver between thumb and forefinger (use knife tip to start to get it separated from the meat, if needed), then it needs to get cut off. If you can’t grip it because it’s too thin, i.e. it tears, just leave it. This results in maybe 10-15% of the silver being left on the meat. The little thin stuff that’s left won’t make hardly any difference on any whole cut or in ground. I used to try and remove ALL the silver and this takes forever. We’ve all probably bit into a piece of thick silver that is unpleasant, but that’s not what you get from this process.

Tendons are similar. If you aim to remove 100% of the collagen tissue it takes forever. Aim for 90% instead. Tendons transition from complete collagen to gradually less collagen and more muscle, to the point where there’s just a small amount of collagen as the tendon fades into muscle. Trim off the small amount of muscle along the with 90% or so of the tendon. The 10% remaining tendon is usually pretty thin and short, and again is hardly noticeable in whole muscle cuts or ground.

I can do a picture tutorial with some examples of each when I cut up my deer tonight if you or anyone else is interested.

Tallow - I haven’t figured it out. You have to remove as much as possible. The only thing it gets left in is the ribs, whole shoulder, and whole hocks, but even then you need a method to cook and drain it off since you don’t want to consume even a tiny piece of it. I don’t trim any off the ribs, but I do get as much as I can off the outside of the other 2 cuts.

If the meat is too warm, tallow is like trying to remove soft wax. If it’s too cold, your hands suffer. Even when it’s pretty cold, it crumbles into tiny pieces when you try to pull it off. You can’t scrape it off the meat with the knife blade, because it smears, and if you cut off a thin layer of meat beneath it then you waste that meat.

That meat looks basically ready to wrap.

It was. That took another hour (plastic wrap, squeeze air bubbles out, paper wrap, tape, label, weigh, chill).

 

[Deleted member 28227]

Haha...thanks, although you are closer than you think to having a speedier process. My fawn antelope was 3 hours from tagged to completely deboned, processed, wrapped, and chilled but the reasons that was so quick was I only removed the WY legally required meat, and there was zero tallow.

After totally processing maybe 15 animals I’ve learned where the silver, tallow, and tendons are (or aren’t) on each muscle, so the process for removing them is the same from cut to cut, etc.

The video Randy posted of the elk at the butcher shop was useful. They explain that if you can grip a piece of silver between thumb and forefinger (use knife tip to start to get it separated from the meat, if needed), then it needs to get cut off. If you can’t grip it because it’s too thin, i.e. it tears, just leave it. This results in maybe 10-15% of the silver being left on the meat. The little thin stuff that’s left won’t make hardly any difference on any whole cut or in ground. I used to try and remove ALL the silver and this takes forever. We’ve all probably bit into a piece of thick silver that is unpleasant, but that’s not what you get from this process.

Tendons are similar. If you aim to remove 100% of the collagen tissue it takes forever. Aim for 90% instead. Tendons transition from complete collagen to gradually less collagen and more muscle, to the point where there’s just a small amount of collagen as the tendon fades into muscle. Trim off the small amount of muscle along the with 90% or so of the tendon. The 10% remaining tendon is usually pretty thin and short, and again is hardly noticeable in whole muscle cuts or ground.

I can do a picture tutorial with some examples of each when I cut up my deer tonight if you or anyone else is interested.

Tallow - I haven’t figured it out. You have to remove as much as possible. The only thing it gets left in is the ribs, whole shoulder, and whole hocks, but even then you need a method to cook and drain it off since you don’t want to consume even a tiny piece of it. I don’t trim any off the ribs, but I do get as much as I can off the outside of the other 2 cuts.

If the meat is too warm, tallow is like trying to remove soft wax. If it’s too cold, your hands suffer. Even when it’s pretty cold, it crumbles into tiny pieces when you try to pull it off. You can’t scrape it off the meat with the knife blade, because it smears, and if you cut off a thin layer of meat beneath it then you waste that meat.


It was. That took another hour (plastic wrap, squeeze air bubbles out, paper wrap, tape, label, weigh, chill).

I’d definitely be interested in some pics and a walkthrough.

You nailed it with your 90-100% I think I’ve been shooting for 100% when likely a lot of the minor silver skin doesn’t matter.

 

[Irrelevant]

WOW, just caught up, apparently I've been neglecting the thread while you've been filling the freezer. Great job!

 

[Pucky Freak]

Marinated heart cubes, then seared, combined with locally grown German cabbage and celery, plus my green garden tomatoes, in a pickling brine for 24 hrs. Divine!

 

[JShane]

you have my attention

 

[Pucky Freak]

Monday 11/2 - I only had early morning to hunt, as I had kid duty the rest of the day, and then couldn't get out again until the following weekend. I chose to try my hand on the one private section I have permission on, for just my second tree stand hunt of the year. Had two coyotes running around close to begin, and I wondered if it would be a quiet morning for deer. About 15 mins after sunrise I heard rustling behind my right shoulder. Looked over and I saw a small-antlered buck, and my initial thought was to pass, but then my heart started hammering and I was filled with a desire to take him. He came in perfect right behind my tree and stopped broadside at 6 yards. As so often happens with me in these situations, my brain goes blank and I don't execute the shot I've practiced a thousand times over. Clean miss (!) underneath him, and he runs off a short distance.

He's facing away from me now at 20, head over his shoulder looking for the source of the noise. I'm frantically trying to regain my faculties, block out the miss, and stay in the game. Eventually he moves off to 25 and stops, but is quartering away at a 30 degree angle - too sharp. He repositions to 40 degrees, and I've got a shot. Slow and deliberate this time, I slip an arrow in the exact point of aim, which passes through the body cavity and out the opposite foreleg. He walks 30 yards and is dead in 15 seconds.

The resident doe fawn group of 4 (5 minus the doe I killed in Oct) walks in to bed, being harassed by a spike. He eventually gives up on non-receptive does and goes over to sniff the profuse spray of blood that was just pumped all over the grass.

IMG_1252 (1).mov

Spike

www.hunttalk.com

When I approached the buck I can see warts all over (skin virus)


Once I got home my daughter insisted on a picture with the deer


When cutting him up I found the spinal cord in his neck had been ruptured, likely from fighting


Here is the private land area I hunt. Property 1 does not allow hunting, and I have permission from owners of 2 and 3. The down arrows are the doe/fawn group's evening route, and the up arrows are their morning route. "A" are the access points, "S" is my stand (morning hunt), and "B" is my blind (evening hunt).



I stopped by the house on property 3 to update them about the doe and the buck I killed, and say thanks again for the access. The son, who manages the property, was really upset about me killing the buck (???) which was a big surprise to me since we talk regularly and I thought we were on the same page about what the hunting guidelines were. Anyways, after a long talk the short of it is he only wants me to shoot a yearling buck next year. No one else hunts this area. I spent the last few days second guessing myself about whether I could/should be happy about the buck I killed, and feeling really terrible about doing something that upset the landowner, and apparently betrayed their trust, even though that was the furthest thing from my intention. After talking with some friends I've come to the point where I don't feel bad since I can't read someone's mind, and I can only make decisions based on what I knew at the time. At this point I'm thinking that next year I'll only hunt property 2 since I can move my stand and blind literally 20 feet to the N, and shoot any buck I want.

Freezer is now 100% full, and I've got a nice new addition in the mancave! (second from right)

 

[Mica Man]

Just viewed this thread and can't believe how busy you've been in the woods! Congrats!

 

[TheBenHoyle]

Monday 11/2 - I only had early morning to hunt, as I had kid duty the rest of the day, and then couldn't get out again until the following weekend. I chose to try my hand on the one private section I have permission on, for just my second tree stand hunt of the year. Had two coyotes running around close to begin, and I wondered if it would be a quiet morning for deer. About 15 mins after sunrise I heard rustling behind my right shoulder. Looked over and I saw a small-antlered buck, and my initial thought was to pass, but then my heart started hammering and I was filled with a desire to take him. He came in perfect right behind my tree and stopped broadside at 6 yards. As so often happens with me in these situations, my brain goes blank and I don't execute the shot I've practiced a thousand times over. Clean miss (!) underneath him, and he runs off a short distance.
View attachment 160984
He's facing away from me now at 20, head over his shoulder looking for the source of the noise. I'm frantically trying to regain my faculties, block out the miss, and stay in the game. Eventually he moves off to 25 and stops, but is quartering away at a 30 degree angle - too sharp. He repositions to 40 degrees, and I've got a shot. Slow and deliberate this time, I slip an arrow in the exact point of aim, which passes through the body cavity and out the opposite foreleg. He walks 30 yards and is dead in 15 seconds.

The resident doe fawn group of 4 (5 minus the doe I killed in Oct) walks in to bed, being harassed by a spike. He eventually gives up on non-receptive does and goes over to sniff the profuse spray of blood that was just pumped all over the grass.

IMG_1252 (1).mov

Spike

www.hunttalk.com

When I approached the buck I can see warts all over (skin virus)
View attachment 160987View attachment 160988View attachment 160989

Once I got home my daughter insisted on a picture with the deer
View attachment 160990

When cutting him up I found the spinal cord in his neck had been ruptured, likely from fighting
View attachment 160991

Here is the private land area I hunt. Property 1 does not allow hunting, and I have permission from owners of 2 and 3. The down arrows are the doe/fawn group's evening route, and the up arrows are their morning route. "A" are the access points, "S" is my stand (morning hunt), and "B" is my blind (evening hunt).

View attachment 160983

I stopped by the house on property 3 to update them about the doe and the buck I killed, and say thanks again for the access. The son, who manages the property, was really upset about me killing the buck (???) which was a big surprise to me since we talk regularly and I thought we were on the same page about what the hunting guidelines were. Anyways, after a long talk the short of it is he only wants me to shoot a yearling buck next year. No one else hunts this area. I spent the last few days second guessing myself about whether I could/should be happy about the buck I killed, and feeling really terrible about doing something that upset the landowner, and apparently betrayed their trust, even though that was the furthest thing from my intention. After talking with some friends I've come to the point where I don't feel bad since I can't read someone's mind, and I can only make decisions based on what I knew at the time. At this point I'm thinking that next year I'll only hunt property 2 since I can move my stand and blind literally 20 feet to the N, and shoot any buck I want.

Freezer is now 100% full, and I've got a nice new addition in the mancave! (second from right)

View attachment 160993

I'm glad you were able to get a second shot and seal the deal. I would agree with the move of the stand and blind for next season. that property owner sounds like a mess to deal with.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Out for turkeys this evening. Busted a flock, but they didn’t scatter, and I had no luck turning them up again in seas of bush honeysuckle. Here’s where they had been scratching beneath a small oak, with clover and soybeans nearby.


Yesterday made fawn neck/brisket, 7 hrs on low in the crockpot, rubbed with McCormick steak seasoning. A hit with my wife and daughter.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Shooting woes at an inopportune time. Monday I shot 9 times at the same duck. 2 woodies flew in and I shot at one as it landed, then shucked the shell to shoot the other one, but paused at the last moment when I noticed the first one wasn’t hit. I shot at the sitting duck 5 more times, one of which wounded it. By that time it had swam out of range so I walked over to retrieve it and it flew up. I instinctively drew the gun and shot it down. It was still alive so I put another shot in, but I could see the shot splash some distance from the duck. The next shot I had the safety on, and I flinched. This was telling. The final shot to kill the bird I took my time. I wrote it off as a bad shooting day and didn’t think anymore of it.

Today I had all day for turkeys. I left fresh sign I had found on Monday to find new birds, which turned into 7 hours of seeing nothing.


By mid afternoon I quit the spot and returned to the fresh sign. Nothing until the last half hour of light when I left to hunt my way back to the truck. An ideal situation unfolded as I eased around a bend and had a dozen turkeys at 20 yards. I had the gun up quickly and worked to find a lone head as birds were moving in all different directions. I missed and then short shucked the shell, jamming the action. I would have had ample time to shoot again. About a minute later I hear flapping wings about 40 yards off in thick cover. Did I wound a bird? It took 5 minutes to finally pry out the spent shell with a pen. I couldn’t find a downed bird anywhere, but I could hear a turkey another 100 or so yards away. In the last 15 minutes of light I relocated several turkeys and missed 3 more times! I’ve never missed a turkey before. I also short-shucked all these shots. The first of these 3 misses was a group of 7 as they were taking off at 40 yards. The next two were singles flying, crossing at 35 and 40 yards. I want to say I led too much, as they were slow fliers, but it probably had just as much to do with my frustration with the earlier misses.

Five more days to hunt turkeys, but I’ll be taking some of that time to correct the shooting flaws I’m developing.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Sat AM cleaned my shotgun to get the action perfectly smooth, and practiced some shooting fundamentals. Also refletched a couple arrows and ordered some small game points for archery cottontail in Jan/Feb.

In the afternoon returned to try and turn up the turkeys I missed on Weds. No dice - just a couple opossums and a little buck spotted.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Today tried a new spot. I killed my fall turkey here 2 years ago. The morning started promising when I could hear yelping from the roost. I set up ambush with picked corn behind me, but birds didn’t arrive. I crept on wet leaf litter through bush honeysuckles for a few hours, hoping to jump them, and only found sign - over 100 scratches and a fair amount of fresh droppings. There’s a bumper acorn crop this year and the animals have been feasting.

I had one last section to work through on the way out. I caught what appeared to be 3 polts hurrying away through a gap at 50 yards. I stopped and scanned for the rest. The commotion brought a mature doe charging in.

IMG_2192.MOV

Breeding doe

www.hunttalk.com

The silence was unnerving to a hen and she flushed flying away at 40 yards. A second followed suit in a different direction. At that point I started videoing the deer, and a third hen flew over my head. The deer hung out at 20 yards for 5 mins with the doe nervously looking me over, and the bucks’ attention solely on the receptive doe. I was directly downwind and I could smell them.

I usually see a mature buck on public every fall season and today was the day - he’s one of the nicer ones I’ve turned up, and with a lot of luck maybe I’ll see him again during gun season.

Mid-day walked a different spot and saw no birds or sign. Returned to the morning spot to put them to bed, but another hunter spooked them first.

I gave chase, but those birds were trucking and long gone.

 

[TWC]

Cool photos and stories

 

[Pucky Freak]

Just about ready for an afternoon hunt and my daughter said she wants to come too, which is an every time occurrence. My wife isn’t comfortable signing off on that yet, so I say “When you’re older.” I’m given a list of requests: A turkey feather to tickle her brothers with, a picture with her and a dead turkey, an opportunity to touch and feel the bird before it gets cut up, and play with her on the swing set before I leave. I figured 15 mins wouldn’t hurt - well - pushing the weight capacity of an old weather-worn wooden playset sent me crashing through it and a board skinned my shins like a potato peeler.


I’m off to hobble around in the woods for a couple hours and when I get back I’ll be asked by a 3-year-old “What’d you catch?”

 

[kansasdad]

Ruh roh!

Ripping the tape off might be as bad as the primary injury with your "natural" long underwear.

 

[Pucky Freak]

Lots of action tonight and nothing to show for it

Set up on a field edge facing to the edge to my right and about 4PM I hear a ton of noise behind me along the left field edge. I first thought it had to be a human, then I thought it must be two. I’m looking over my right shoulder in the woods looking for the approaching hunters, but can’t see anything. Is it deer? Finally I see this huge racket is turkeys - close - and I’m not ready! I made an awkward stretch to pick up my gun, waiting for them to walk past me a ways before shouldering my gun. But the turkey in front is walking inside the timber right at me, from what I can hear. At 3 yards she starts putting at the suspicious blob blocking her path, and I briefly consider whipping around, but I instead I figure I’ll wait until they sound about 25 yards away and then I’ll whip around. I could hear the hen close for quite some time - which seemed odd - I just wait. Finally she sounds far enough and I whip around, line up the sights, and shoot. And miss. What?

The noise I was hearing following the putting was a songbird foraging through leaf litter, while the turkey flock had walked out of range. Lucky accidental decoy fools the hunter.

At the shot they flew off in all different directions; a good calling scenario. I moved, set up, called, and had one fly off from about 100 yards. Next a hen walked in quiet to my calls and stepped behind a tree at 30 yards. I figure she’s done for. But I somehow miss this easy shot Busted a tom in some thick stuff on the way out and soon after that shooting hours were done.