Do you think raising Pheasants to hunt is ethical?

[Ttannahill14]

Everything I've read I think you are correct. I wouldn't be charging just helping the population. It would be hard to know the difference between a wild bird and a surrogated released bird anyways. We already have some milo plots planted within our CRP which should be ideal habitat for holding birds and hunting. We just need more birds and when they get whiped out by a dry summer I get tired of waiting for the population to recover.

On a side note... when can we start lobbying to hunt hawks? There's too many of them!

 

[Ttannahill14]

Would the guys who've responded have a different answer if the bird were a native species? Just curious.

Even though it's not a native species, the pheasant really has a lot of history in my state.

Antelope is a native species and is in our state song... yet no one associates Kansas with good Antelope hunting. Kinda the opposite with pheasants. When I think of Kansas hunting I think of Whitetail, Pheasants, and hunting waterfowl in the field. All three of those hunting traditions have been going on a lot longer than I have been alive.

 

[Flatland Crusoe]

Even though it's not a native species, the pheasant really has a lot of history in my state.

Antelope is a native species and is in our state song... yet no one associates Kansas with good Antelope hunting. Kinda the opposite with pheasants. When I think of Kansas hunting I think of Whitetail, Pheasants, and hunting waterfowl in the field. All three of those hunting traditions have been going on a lot longer than I have been alive.

But you are talking about a high manipulated state of things, in presettlement times you wouldn't have had pheasants, there were fewer deer and ducks and geese were generally limited to feeding immediately around water not cut corn fields. Where do you draw the line? You should also have both species of bears, bison and significant elk numbers .

 

[Ttannahill14]

Yes good points. Gosh I wish we still had a large number of elk and Bison in this state. Oh well.


But the introduction of pheasant wasn't the reason for those species disappearance. So I'll continue to hunt what this state has to offer today.

 

[MTBirdhunter]

The three methods you mentioned are not unethical in my opinion, hell, the pheasant was imported to the U.S. and released here, however I have never hunted pen raised birds, even when training numerous dogs for hunting. I would have to say method #3 you mentioned is the one I think is best. Releasing birds the day of the hunt, that just does not sit right with me. Habitat improvement and predator control in my opinion is better then all three options your mentioned. Anyone who says pen raised birds offer a hunt similar to wild pheasant, in my opinion is way off.

 

[Ttannahill14]

The three methods you mentioned are not unethical in my opinion, hell, the pheasant was imported to the U.S. and released here, however I have never hunted pen raised birds, even when training numerous dogs for hunting. I would have to say method #3 you mentioned is the one I think is best. Releasing birds the day of the hunt, that just does not sit right with me. Habitat improvement and predator control in my opinion is better then all three options your mentioned. Anyone who says pen raised birds offer a hunt similar to wild pheasant, in my opinion is way off.

I think that's the biggest frustration though with consistent pheasant hunting... We have great habitat, we keep land in CRP, we plant plots, we do an okay job at predator control (could be better)... and all it takes is for one bad summer to drop the numbers for the next 5 years.

 

[teamhoyt]

My family raised pheasants in nd for years. We might have even received some of the starter birds at little or no cost through pf. For years we picked and incubated eggs till sometime in June and then let the hens raise their own brood. We released the birds at 8 weeks old. We would always keep some hens for brood stock. Anyway we released birds all over the county and supplemented our farm as well. I personally never could tell the difference in how they acted vs the wild birds except for a few we banded. Raising birds as a kid was a great time but chores kinda sucked as we had 1000 birds at one point. We Shot some roosters 3 years later that we knew through banding. Ps incubating eggs was a full time job with the old stuff we had. I Don't know that I buy the fact that these bids flew different or were any more susceptible to predators than wild birds. Maybe releasing them at 8 weeks old played a part in that. If you get into this kinda thing I would encourage you to do something similar vs releasing right before the hunt. As far as predators goes there's not much harder on the birds as owls, Hawks and wild(stray cats).

 

[teamhoyt]

On another note I believe upland birds population is affected way more by having a wet spring than a dry summer. It's affects the hatches for the worst when nesting time is too wet

 

[TimeOnTarget]

And a bad winter being the worst

 

[kenton]

Im really glad you brought this topic up Ttannahill. Next month I start a new job at a private hunting/shooting club that "put and take" about 9000 birds a year between pheasant, quail, and chukar. I've hunted both pen raised and wild pheasants and don't really notice much of a difference. Nothing about the hunt is different besides pen birds do run a little more but compare that to hunting high-fenced big game vs wild because those two appear vastly different.

I'm curious what does everyone think if I put out a dozen birds at sunrise and a group hunts at noon but has no idea where they were placed. Does it make a difference if nobody knows where the birds are? The dogs are going to work until they find the birds and then point until the hunters catch up and then the bird flies and the hunter either hits or misses, about as close to a wild bird hunt as possible.

 

[TimeOnTarget]

Being in Ohio, I'll assume you'll be hunting stripped plots of some sort. If that's the case chances are the majority of the birds will run to the end anyway so it doesn't really matter

 

[emrah1028]

Raise them, release them, and shoot them..... at some later point in time. Not sure how long that "time'" is, but long enough to feel ethical about the hunt. Pretty vague, but I know it when I know it. No different than fishing in a large pond or lake that has been stocked by DNR/Fish and Wildlife in the spring.

Emrah

 

[Topgun 30-06]

The three methods you mentioned are not unethical in my opinion, hell, the pheasant was imported to the U.S. and released here, however I have never hunted pen raised birds, even when training numerous dogs for hunting. I would have to say method #3 you mentioned is the one I think is best. Releasing birds the day of the hunt, that just does not sit right with me. Habitat improvement and predator control in my opinion is better then all three options your mentioned. Anyone who says pen raised birds offer a hunt similar to wild pheasant, in my opinion is way off.[/QUOTE]

There have been a lot of excellent comments on this thread. However, I do have a problem with your last comment because if it's done right you can't tell the difference. If you have been to a place where you can legitimately make that statement, then the place isn't doing the job properly. If I were to hunt a place like that I wouldn't return, but the couple places up here that I've been to do the job right and it's as real as when I go out to ND.To answer a question asked in this thread, I would have no problem with other birds being done just like pheasants and chukars if done properly. I have no idea what the question regarding farm raised large animals was all about because that would relate back to a high fenced hunt where an animal has no chance of escape.

 

[MTBirdhunter]

Sorry you have trouble with my opinion....but it is just that, my opinion as I stated. Sorry it bothered you, but sometimes the truth hurts.

 

[M. R. Byrd]

As an individual when you release the pheasants into the wild in Kansas, take of the birds is now governed by the game laws of the state, i.e. open seasons, hunting license requirements, bag limits, possession limits, etc.

One use for pen raised birds is for hunter's first hunts. Such was the case recently here at Dodge City. The football coach has had 185 students take Hunter Safety Ed at the high school. Partnering with Pass It On, Outdoor Mentors, NWTF, Kansas Department of Wildlife, Parks and Tourism pen raised birds were used to give these young people their first experience with safety in the field with a shotgun, other hunters and bird dogs, shooting a pheasant in flight and cleaning the bird for the table.

The day I helped with the hunt, I believe there were fourteen young men and ladies from the high school and three from BBBS. Pass It On, Outdoor Mentors works especially with BBBS in finding outdoor mentors for the Little Brothers and Sisters. That group is one that is very unlikely to have an outdoor mentor in their life. It is a good program.

The day of this first hunt was typical southwest Kansas with lots of wind. First thing was to begin with the new hunter shooting clays. We had two traps, one outgoing and one incoming and two stations. All the time the instructors are stressing safety. After a few were hitting targets pretty well they began the hunting phase. There were two groups of two hunters going out with a mentor, a bird dog and its handler. Birds had been placed in launchers. With the strong wind we knew which way the bird would go coming out of the launcher so once the dog went on point the two hunters would go up wind prior to the launch. Almost every hunter shot at least one bird and some two. It was a great day for the young hunters and all of us that helped and a good use of pen raised birds.

 

[Ttannahill14]

As an individual when you release the pheasants into the wild in Kansas, take of the birds is now governed by the game laws of the state, i.e. open seasons, hunting license requirements, bag limits, possession limits, etc.

One use for pen raised birds is for hunter's first hunts. Such was the case recently here at Dodge City. The football coach has had 185 students take Hunter Safety Ed at the high school. Partnering with Pass It On, Outdoor Mentors, NWTF, Kansas Department of Wildlife, Parks and Tourism pen raised birds were used to give these young people their first experience with safety in the field with a shotgun, other hunters and bird dogs, shooting a pheasant in flight and cleaning the bird for the table.

The day I helped with the hunt, I believe there were fourteen young men and ladies from the high school and three from BBBS. Pass It On, Outdoor Mentors works especially with BBBS in finding outdoor mentors for the Little Brothers and Sisters. That group is one that is very unlikely to have an outdoor mentor in their life. It is a good program.

The day of this first hunt was typical southwest Kansas with lots of wind. First thing was to begin with the new hunter shooting clays. We had two traps, one outgoing and one incoming and two stations. All the time the instructors are stressing safety. After a few were hitting targets pretty well they began the hunting phase. There were two groups of two hunters going out with a mentor, a bird dog and its handler. Birds had been placed in launchers. With the strong wind we knew which way the bird would go coming out of the launcher so once the dog went on point the two hunters would go up wind prior to the launch. Almost every hunter shot at least one bird and some two. It was a great day for the young hunters and all of us that helped and a good use of pen raised birds.

That's an awesome story! I've met that coach a few times I believe... Always super nice to me and glad he's doing his part to pass it on.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Sorry you have trouble with my opinion....but it is just that, my opinion as I stated. Sorry it bothered you, but sometimes the truth hurts.

So how is it that you can say in one sentence of that post that you have never hunted pen raised birds and then be an "authority" following it up with that opinion that is "the truth hurts",?! Pretty lame IMHO!

 

[MTBirdhunter]

So how is it that you can say in one sentence of that post that you have never hunted pen raised birds and then be an "authority" following it up with that opinion that is "the truth hurts",?! Pretty lame IMHO!

Your good entertainment, I have lived in Bird country all my life, I never said I haven't seen pen raised birds, quite to the contrary. That is why I can speak on the subject....how many days do you spend in pheasant country a year? I would wager I spend more days pheasant hunting in a year then you dream of hunting.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Your good entertainment, I have lived in Bird country all my life, I never said I haven't seen pen raised birds, quite to the contrary. That is why I can speak on the subject....how many days do you spend in pheasant country a year? I would wager I spend more days pheasant hunting in a year then you dream of hunting.

Come on birdman! You stated you have never HUNTED pen raised birds in your initial post and then followed it up with that sentence that ended up with what I stated. Now you are saying you have SEEN pen raised birds and that makes you an authority on hunting them. There is no sense in getting into a pizzing contest, but you best keep your money in your pocket sonny because at 68 and having hunted for over 60 years of my life, especially with even more time in the field since I retired 14 years ago, you would lose your bet! These were wild birds my buddy and I took over my DD in just one short evening and the next morning. God only knows how many I've shot in my lifetime and a number were on a couple preserves I mentioned where you can't tell they are pen raised. Maybe the places you say you're familiar with suck at doing it properly to put out a bird like we're talking about.

 

[Aceman]

Pen raised birds

Getting a consensus on this topic will be tough as hunters have different views on the definition of ethical. I would think that the act of hunting in a pen raised situation would depend on the size of the area hunted, the condition of the birds, and how the birds were released. Birds that are hard set in a small hunting area will react differently then those that are free flighted in large hunting areas. Also the condition of the birds will react differently when hunted or released. I know this does not answer the original question but I do know that in my area where pheasants are very small in numbers, locals will take advantage of the hunt clubs for training their dogs and just getting the opportunity to pop a few caps.