bullet size

diamond hitch

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I wandered through our local sporting goods store today and exited extremely disappointed. The trend of small fast bullets I guess might work for the praries but certainly not in my experience for jungle hunting. A close friend of mine many years ago shot a buck with a 300 win mag. He shot a smaller bullet at well over 3000 ft/sec. About half of the deer was bloodshot.

We slowed those bullets down to about 2700 ft/sec and found we could eat nearly up to the holes without losing accuracy. I shoot a 7 mag with 175 gr roundnose bullet which Hornady no longer makes. I think I bought the last four boxes available. This year I found a tender cow bedded in a doghair thicket of 2 inch lodgepoles. I shot through the trees at 30 yds and killed her dead. We had to cut a path to get her out. It was too thick to get horses into her. I had no meat loss and no bloodshot. Frankly I was amazed but very pleased and I have killed a lot of elk. A very tender cow elk.

A few years ago I walked into a meadow and found 4 cow elk feeding in an Aspen swamp. I couldn't get a clean shot and waited 30 min for the elk to move. Three of the cows walked off and the last was still behind an aspen. I took a careful bead on the tree (about 4 inches in diameter) and shot through the tree and killed the elk on the other side. The tough part was where she fell into the creek. She was too big to move by myself so I placed a lariat over her head and pulled out with my horse. A much drier way to gut and quarter her up for packing. For you do it your selfers I did it by myself and rode the six miles to the truck. It is possible. Just a little slower as you get older.

If you hunt the jungles like me, I recommend a bigger gun and heavy bullets. It gives you an edge when the hunting is tough.
 
I took a careful bead on the tree (about 4 inches in diameter) and shot through the tree and killed the elk on the other side.
Weren’t you at all concerned about the bullet breaking down or deflecting off the tree in some way and hitting they elk where you weren’t intending? I do agree with you on heavier bullets and big stick though. I’ve had similar experience shooting deer with too high fps and light bullets. Makes nothing but blood pudding out of them.
 
I agree with Sim864 comments. My experience over the years has shown a high probability of deflection in hitting limbs. Especially the small ones. However I have had good success with shooting through small trees near the animal. Very little deflection if the tree is centered.

On bullet competency, the hornady interlock has been very consistent for me. For a number years I changed to Sierra Game King bullets. I hoped the boattails would give me an edge. Many friends gave me boxes of them but said at the high speeds they came unglued. I had good success for many years but experienced jacket separation in most cases if they hit a bone. In the early 90s I found something changed and I couldn't depend on them any more. Hornady round nose interloc bullets became more available and I pulled the Sierras and reloaded with Hornadys. I have had perfect expansion and no breakups in 99% of the cases ever since. It's a shame Hornady stopped production in favor of ELD X.

In the early years, I used to shoot an 06 and went through a year where I loaded Remington bronze points. Like the Sierras they were very accurate. In a heavy snowstorm in 1970, I walked into a huge 7x7 bull at about 12 ft. However there was a bushy Grand Fir between us. I could see his feet, horns and butt. I could also see the trunk of the trees. I made the determination that at 12 ft that I could not miss. Good assumption but the bullet let me down. It broke up and hit the bull with hundreds of pieces like a 410 shotgun. I tracked the bull for 4 miles and lost him the next day when the rain removed my tracking snow. He had quit bleeding and was going up. At that point I puled those bullets and reloaded with corelocts. I had good luck with them but had difficulties in buying them.

Shortly after that I got a really good deal on a Huskvarna 7 mag that I still have. I shoot the bullets that my gun likes and that gives me the most consistant good performance.
 
In the early years, I used to shoot an 06 and went through a year where I loaded Remington bronze points.
i have loaded and shot buckets of those bullets out of a 30-06 as well and they are very accurate but like you said they come apart easily. My grandpa must have bought all the remaining bronze tip stock from Remington back in the day because I still have some left. I enjoy loading my own stuff and experimenting with different bullets and like you mentioned you have to find what your guns like.
 
I agree with Sim864 comments. My experience over the years has shown a high probability of deflection in hitting limbs. Especially the small ones. However I have had good success with shooting through small trees near the animal. Very little deflection if the tree is centered.

On bullet competency, the hornady interlock has been very consistent for me. For a number years I changed to Sierra Game King bullets. I hoped the boattails would give me an edge. Many friends gave me boxes of them but said at the high speeds they came unglued. I had good success for many years but experienced jacket separation in most cases if they hit a bone. In the early 90s I found something changed and I couldn't depend on them any more. Hornady round nose interloc bullets became more available and I pulled the Sierras and reloaded with Hornadys. I have had perfect expansion and no breakups in 99% of the cases ever since. It's a shame Hornady stopped production in favor of ELD X.

In the early years, I used to shoot an 06 and went through a year where I loaded Remington bronze points. Like the Sierras they were very accurate. In a heavy snowstorm in 1970, I walked into a huge 7x7 bull at about 12 ft. However there was a bushy Grand Fir between us. I could see his feet, horns and butt. I could also see the trunk of the trees. I made the determination that at 12 ft that I could not miss. Good assumption but the bullet let me down. It broke up and hit the bull with hundreds of pieces like a 410 shotgun. I tracked the bull for 4 miles and lost him the next day when the rain removed my tracking snow. He had quit bleeding and was going up. At that point I puled those bullets and reloaded with corelocts. I had good luck with them but had difficulties in buying them.

Shortly after that I got a really good deal on a Huskvarna 7 mag that I still have. I shoot the bullets that my gun likes and that gives me the most consistant good performance.
Gol dang bullets are no good, won't even go through trees.
 
I agree with the heavier bullets, especially shooting at closer distances, but purposely shooting through a tree, is courting disaster. It does not make any difference which bullet you shoot, or how heavy that it is. It can still break, or deflect.

The down side to shooting the big, slow round-nosed bullets, is if you get a chance at a bit longer shot (over 200 yards), you had better really know your ballistics. And just to be clear, 2700 fps is not really that slow. Most loads with the 175s are in the 2800s. I have shot some elk at pretty close distances, but used the same load at over 400 yards. Heavier bullets can be viable at longer ranges, if you load the rifle to its capability. Even with higher velocity, I have had very little blood-shot issues with 160 Partitions, 175 Partitions and 175 Interlocks, from my 7 mags. I push the 160s to 3000 fps and the others were close to 2900.

Some small, frangible bullets can cause a lot of blood-shot meat, but it isn't bad, as long as you shoot them in the lungs. I like bullets-of whatever weigh-that stay together fairly well, penetrate well and hopefully, exit (although not imperative).

I really don't see the attraction to round-nosed bullet anymore. They hinder you past 200 yards and I have actually read a couple of bullet tests, where they come apart worse and penetrate worse than pointed bullets in some calibers.
 
Your initial problem sounds more like a bullet composition problem than a velocity problem. A good mono pushing high velocities will produce less bloodshot meat than a “slower” moving but “explosive” BT/SST style bullet. Lighter and faster monos are proven killers - slower heavy lead bullets are effective too, but often overrated.
 
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