Attack on the Feds independence

[thomas89]

This thread ought to convert some people if the past 35,397 political threads didn’t. Just like what politicians have been selling for decades…”I promise I’m different than the last one!”

Congratulations that kind of thinking is part of a bigger problem. We all lose when thats how people form their opinions.

This is so true. I’ve met some truly fascinating people in my life, 9 out of 10 of them I have no idea their political affiliation and it makes no matter at all to me. So sad it’s at the forefront of everyone’s brains anymore.

 

[SaskHunter]

My god. Is there a standard deduction or do poor people really pay 25.5% on every dollar earned?

Depending on your income, household size and age, dependants, etc., you are entitled to tax breaks, child benefits, subsidized childcare, etc. So there's a good chance they are not paying that much taxes, but yes, some people would be taxed at that level.

 

[Bonasababy]

This thread ought to convert some people if the past 35,397 political threads didn’t. Just like what politicians have been selling for decades…”I promise I’m different than the last one!”



This is so true. I’ve met some truly fascinating people in my life, 9 out of 10 of them I have no idea their political affiliation and it makes no matter at all to me. So sad it’s at the forefront of everyone’s brains anymore.

Sad yes...but very understandable. Someone who daily expresses behavior we wouldn't let a child get away with. A convicted and widely acknowledged abuser of women, a compulsive liar, who wants to be treated like a dictator, who outinely belittles, degrades and attacks those who disagree with him, and runs roughshod over the constitution....

Certainly does not help, but its pretty easy to see how many think that people that support that person like and agree with all of those very evident problems themselves.

 

[Bonasababy]

My god. Is there a standard deduction or do poor people really pay 25.5% on every dollar earned?

You are probably ignoring how much those taxes pay for.

Just look at health insurance alone.

Right now for awhile we are paying 36k a year for health and dental insurance insurance. That will drop to 11k or so when we hit 65. That's at today's prices, which go up every year.

Canadians pay....nothing.

 

[RG300]

if your paying 36k for medical & dental, you need a different employer...
if you think Canada has such great health care, move there & find out how long it takes to get anything done....
They pay in other ways as well....like promoting assisted suicide.

 

[Rainer]

Theirs over 100 million adults in healthcare debt today. You can't even compare the two. The US also promotes suicide by forcing people into healthcare and student debts that they'll never pay off. Theirs a reason Canada is ranked 5th in global freedom and the US is ranked 54th.

 

[Dougfirtree]

You are probably ignoring how much those taxes pay for.

Just look at health insurance alone.

Right now for awhile we are paying 36k a year for health and dental insurance insurance. That will drop to 11k or so when we hit 65. That's at today's prices, which go up every year.

Canadians pay....nothing.

Not to mention the fact that there are a lot of Americans, especially those who are successfully self-employed and making a good, but not ridiculously good salary, and who are also paying for health insurance, who would love to only pay 25%. (And who live with the knowledge that many of the truly wealthy people in their country, including elected leaders, are paying less than they are...)

Canada looks pretty good.. @SaskHunter how successful, would you say, is Canada at getting the wealthy to actually pay taxes at a percentage that matches their income on the chart you posted?

 

[F250]

Theirs over 100 million adults in healthcare debt today. You can't even compare the two. The US also promotes suicide by forcing people into healthcare and student debts that they'll never pay off. Theirs a reason Canada is ranked 5th in global freedom and the US is ranked 54th.

Over 70% of Canadians have private health insurance to supplement their socialized medical insurance.

 

[406dn]

Your as old as dirt, and claim to be worth 2 to 3 million. You also so claimed to be in the 98% net worth.

Then you say......
"It's no accident and should be no surprise that the middle class and median wealth has declined the way it has over my lifetime. Makes only one thing, and that's total sense based on our policies to favor the top 10%, and that maybe a bit overstated, more like the top couple percent."

Crushing it, or not crushing it?

Your first sentence describes me, more or less. I'm not as old as Bernie, and much closer to the 2 than the 3.

Wealth does generally accumulate over a lifetime. So compared to the entirety of the population, a household with a couple of million in net worth, puts you somewhere in the top 10%. For older households, it does not.

As far as crushing it, no, it's more like we did pretty well over a working lifetime.

 

[Bonasababy]

if your paying 36k for medical & dental, you need a different employer...
if you think Canada has such great health care, move there & find out how long it takes to get anything done....
They pay in other ways as well....like promoting assisted suicide.

It was cheap before I retired. Its hard to beat after 65 but they make us pay through the nose if we retire before 65. That rate is for both of us not just me.

 

[Hunting Wife]

if your paying 36k for medical & dental, you need a different employer...
if you think Canada has such great health care, move there & find out how long it takes to get anything done....
They pay in other ways as well....like promoting assisted suicide.

To be fair, my brother has been waiting 5 months to see a hematologist. My dad post quadruple-bypass routinely waits 4 months to see his cardiologist. My grandparents are often 3-4 months wait to see their GP. Surgical appointments for folks I know are sometimes 5-6 months out. It’s not like people in the US have care on demand exactly either.

I’m always curious about these tax comparisons, because its difficult to make a straight comparison. I don’t think you can just compare tax rates- you have to factor in the total costs of equivalent services. I have pretty decent health insurance through my employer, and a single plan, and I pay 6% of my income just in premiums, before any of the myriad out of pocket costs if I need to see someone. That should at least get factored in to any comparisons of tax rates. Most people pay much more than I do.

I’m always a little surprised how many Americans are supremely confident in the “knowledge” that things in America are so great, and so much better than everywhere else in the world. Sure, we’ve got it infinitely better than some countries. But if you go visit enough other places and talk to the people, and listen to how they live, and see how utterly shocked they are about some of the things we just accept as “normal”, you start to consider it’s possible we’ve been misled.

 

[BigHornRam]

Speaks volumes what little it takes to be in the top 2% doesn't it?

Thank you for clarifying the problem with concentrating wealth.

What ever wealth redistribution scheme you guys try to implement, they will be coming after you and Bernie's assets as well. Lucky for you, even crazy California passed on a wealth tax, at least for now.

Edit : Looks like it is still in play, but more than likely to fail.

Billionaire tax sparks intraparty war in California - POLITICO https://www.politico.com/news/2026/01/16/wealth-tax-push-california-politics-00732882

 

[Rainer]

Over 70% of Canadians have private health insurance to supplement their socialized medical insurance.

It's to cover Prescription and Eye coverage. Though most of our pharmaceuticals are pretty cheap here. Our travel health insurance stats are also lumped in their.

 

[Dougfirtree]

To be fair, my brother has been waiting 5 months to see a hematologist. My dad post quadruple-bypass routinely waits 4 months to see his cardiologist. My grandparents are often 3-4 months wait to see their GP. Surgical appointments for folks I know are sometimes 5-6 months out. It’s not like people in the US have care on demand exactly either.

I’m always curious about these tax comparisons, because its difficult to make a straight comparison. I don’t think you can just compare tax rates- you have to factor in the total costs of equivalent services. I have pretty decent health insurance through my employer, and a single plan, and I pay 6% of my income just in premiums, before any of the myriad out of pocket costs if I need to see someone. That should at least get factored in to any comparisons of tax rates. Most people pay much more than I do.

I’m always a little surprised how many Americans are supremely confident in the “knowledge” that things in America are so great, and so much better than everywhere else in the world. Sure, we’ve got it infinitely better than some countries. But if you go visit enough other places and talk to the people, and listen to how they live, and see how utterly shocked they are about some of the things we just accept as “normal”, you start to consider it’s possible we’ve been misled.

Good points. There is actually some data out there about how people actually feel about the healthcare systems in their countries.. Plenty of variables, but enough consistency to make it clear to anyone who is actually open to learning and changing their ideas, that we are not doing this very well here in the U.S.

Public satisfaction with national health systems by country worldwide 2019| Statista

According to the findings of a survey by IPSOS, satisfaction with national health systema varies widely between countries.

www.statista.com

 

[Dave N]

It was cheap before I retired. Its hard to beat after 65 but they make us pay through the nose if we retire before 65. That rate is for both of us not just me.

When I retired my total insurance premium was $450/mo for the 2 of us. After she died it went to $180 for me and went up $8 this year. Medicare kicks in this May. If you pay 3K a month you must have a zero deductible plan. Those are a ripoff.

 

[MTGomer]

You are probably ignoring how much those taxes pay for.

Just look at health insurance alone.

Right now for awhile we are paying 36k a year for health and dental insurance insurance. That will drop to 11k or so when we hit 65. That's at today's prices, which go up every year.

Canadians pay....nothing.

That is a lot of money to spend in health insurance. I always thought it was crazy that they outlawed a lot of plans people were happy with and then told you you had to buy a more expensive plan and considered that progress.

I want to be able to buy a lower cost plan that covers catastrophic things like car crashes and brain cancer, but I would rather pay cash for a broken arm than $36,000 in insurance.


Americans that do not have Canadian healthcare view Canadian healthcare a lot higher than my Canadian friends that have it, view it. They told me it’s very bureaucratic and that they cannot get what they want, when they want it. American border city hospital parking lots being full of Canadian plates seems to confirm that. The ones that can afford to, come here to pay cash to get what they want, when they want.

 

[MTGomer]

Surgical appointments for folks I know are sometimes 5-6 months out.

I think Canadians would view that as an improvement. The Canadian friend I guided with last month is going on year four waiting to get a shoulder fixed from falling off a horse.

 

[406dn]

That is a lot of money to spend in health insurance. I always thought it was crazy that they outlawed a lot of plans
people were happy with and then told you you had to buy a more expensive plan and considered that progress.

I want to be able to buy a lower cost plan that covers catastrophic things like car, crashes and brain cancer, but I would rather pay cash for a broken arm than $36,000 in insurance.


Americans that do not have Canadian healthcare view Canadian healthcare a lot higher than my Canadian friends that have it, view it. They told me it’s very bureaucratic and that they cannot get what they want, when they want it. American border city hospital parking lots being full of Canadian plates seems to confirm that. The ones that can afford to, come here to pay cash to get what they want, when they want.

A good friend of mine who is Canadian, lost his wife to breast cancer, after a long battle. She received timely treatment for over a decade in her cancer battle. Their out of pocket cost for all of the treatment was zero. Mare than once, he has told me that he is very grateful that in the long battle, their finances were not wiped out, as well.

My sister's husband waited months for the surgeon he wanted for a hip replacement surgery. This is in a large metro area, with many fine medical centers.

I have another friend who was told it would be months for an opening for a hip replacement surgery. He scoured the country to find an earlier opening.

It is a fallacy that for non emergency treatments that in the US, there is not a waiting line.

 

[Irrelevant]

If everyone here hates our healthcare then it's not good. You don't have to find some "metric" to analyze and compare

 

[MTGomer]

A good friend of mine who is Canadian, lost his wife to breast cancer, after a long battle. She received timely treatment for over a decade in her cancer battle. Their out of pocket cost for all of the treatment was zero. Mare than once, he has told me that he is very grateful that in the long battle, their finances were not wiped out, as well.

My sister's husband waited months for the surgeon he wanted for a hip replacement surgery. This is in a large metro area, with many fine medical centers.

I have another friend who was told it would be months for an opening for a hip replacement surgery. He scoured the country to find an earlier opening.

It is a fallacy that for non emergency treatments that in the US, there is not a waiting line.

It’s just that the wait is measured in months instead of in years.

Four years is 12 times longer than four months