Am I crazy or would you agree... solitude v success
- Thread starter Ben Long
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Irrelevant
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Nope... That's never crossed my mind
Big Sky Guy
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Sounds like you’re at a similar stage/mindset to me and many others. Generally, I would rather not see any of my target game or people than to see a bunch of game and people. There are some caveats and area, access and ability to get away from folks may change this a little. I also don’t let seeing folks at the parking spot/trailhead discourage me like it use it as 9/10 times they have completely different plans than I do.
During the late elk seasons, similar to ice fishing, I’m a bit more social and find great joy in helping others succeed (twice I have run into two different complete strangers and we “teamed” up and both killed cows that day). Perhaps if those guys had been complete dicks my view would be different lol. The game is either extremely bountiful or non existent so that’s probably the difference versus searching for an antlered animal that I would be excited about. If I’m still hunting that late I’ve already gotten my solitude experience and am just seeking meat.
During the late elk seasons, similar to ice fishing, I’m a bit more social and find great joy in helping others succeed (twice I have run into two different complete strangers and we “teamed” up and both killed cows that day). Perhaps if those guys had been complete dicks my view would be different lol. The game is either extremely bountiful or non existent so that’s probably the difference versus searching for an antlered animal that I would be excited about. If I’m still hunting that late I’ve already gotten my solitude experience and am just seeking meat.
I've been wondering about this for years! It seems intuitive to always be dynamic in where to hunt, right? Animals move, conditions change, spots get burnt (literally and figuratively), etc. Considering animals often try avoid human activity in the wild, being in places without very many people just seems to make sense.
Then I came to Montana, where people hunt the same drainage and fish the same hole nearly religiously. Seemed kinda strange at first, but then realized that something had to be going on, because it was so consistent. A lot of the old timers I would talk to had their spot they would go to every year, and the ones who knew each other knew those spots, and it was territorial in a friendly way. Same with fishing - if you're familiar with fishing around Helena, people treat the Causeway and Hauser Dam powerhouse like they have ancestral fishing rights there, and if there is someone there, they will sit and wait for them to leave.
And that was the thought that sort of flipped it for me. They aren't stubborn, necessarily, nor are they just lacking in creativity. They hunt that drainage for elk every season and they exclusively fish that hole because it's a part of the culture. You put work in to find a productive place, or you inherit it from family, and it's 'yours'. You may share it with others, sure, but the very close relationship they've built with that certain place for hunting or fishing becomes unshakeable.
It has a sort of indigenous aspect that I appreciate. They've built a reciprocal relationship with that spot, and in return for their blood, sweat, tears, and stewardship, they have productive and reliable access to fish and wildlife and maybe even some kind of spiritual satisfaction. That seems agreeable enough.
Where I live and hunt now has great animals and virtually no pressure, so I'm pretty happy with sort of always being on the move, but even I've noticed that my roaming area has gotten a lot smaller than it used to be, and I basically stick to the same 3 or 4 areas these days. Maybe that's the next entry on that preposterous hunter stages list: become so connected with the land and wildlife that even the suggestion of hunting somewhere else is just plain ridiculous.
elkduds
Well-known member
The prime time of my elk chasing in Colorado is between the end of archery season and the start of rifle season. Shooting photos, not bucks or bulls.
Heck yeah! This big guy was munching away at 30 yards and never once raised his head. Dumb? Perfect wind? Maybe he just knew it wasn't legal to take him home right then and there.
I ran into a few hunters in MT over the years and most have been really respectful and everyone so far either myself or the other hunter changed course if we bumped into each other. I dont mind the increased pressure as long as they obey vehicle restrictions and adjacient landowners dont herd animals (see photo of a landowner/outfitter blocking elk from entering onto public).
Seems like 50-70% mostly road hunt, 20-30% are hardcore backcountry types. Of the hardcore types Ive noticed since 2020 that a lot carry 30 lb backpacks, carry a decked out rifle with a suppressor, bipods extended, ballistic turrets, level bubbles, etc, and make a tremendous amount of noise which push elk. They cover huge amounts of land and would be better off still hunting or waiting to ambush. I have relatively poor hearing and I can hear them from 100-200 yards out. These are heavily timbered/blowdown areas and most shots are off hand at 75 yards. But I dont mind a little hunting pressure bc it pushes animals around and might help everyone get a shot. We are all just enjoying the same thing.
Seems like 50-70% mostly road hunt, 20-30% are hardcore backcountry types. Of the hardcore types Ive noticed since 2020 that a lot carry 30 lb backpacks, carry a decked out rifle with a suppressor, bipods extended, ballistic turrets, level bubbles, etc, and make a tremendous amount of noise which push elk. They cover huge amounts of land and would be better off still hunting or waiting to ambush. I have relatively poor hearing and I can hear them from 100-200 yards out. These are heavily timbered/blowdown areas and most shots are off hand at 75 yards. But I dont mind a little hunting pressure bc it pushes animals around and might help everyone get a shot. We are all just enjoying the same thing.
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I think this depends entirely on what you want out of the hunt or what kind of hunt you are on. If I have a cow or doe tag, I'm there to make meat. If I have a LE permit then I want solitude and trophy potential. If I am hunting an area that is close to home and will have more folks, then my hunt plans change accordingly. If I'm in an area that's a general tag with low success rates then again - plan accordingly.
I also wouldn't underestimate the amount that success plays in retention. It's always lovely to take a walk with a gun but unless there is a reasonable expectation of success, people will stop hunting. On crowded public, that's awesome as that means there's more for me, but for wildlife management that outcome is not always the best option. Solitude is a declining commodity in today's world. So is being successful on heavily pressured lands.
Nameless Range
Well-known member
I lean toward less people, and I thought about this thread while hunting yesterday. I think geographically there are overlapping chunks of earth on the Venn Diagram of less people vs more critters, and they are obviously often associated with terrain and difficulty of access. That said, there are interesting areas of interest that provide decent hunting and not a lot of people, and they are those places that people often just drive by on their way to their perceived promise land. Sometimes folks think they have to be hardcore, and overlook the "front country".
I was talking to a fellow hunt talker the other day about his hunting plans and he said something that rings true. He said, "Also, I have a superpower: The Weekday". Places with higher critter concentrations that might be a bit zoo-ish on a Sat/Sun, can become bearable and fun on a Wednesday. If you can hunt weekdays, do it. Like inclement weather, they change the nature of a place.
I was talking to a fellow hunt talker the other day about his hunting plans and he said something that rings true. He said, "Also, I have a superpower: The Weekday". Places with higher critter concentrations that might be a bit zoo-ish on a Sat/Sun, can become bearable and fun on a Wednesday. If you can hunt weekdays, do it. Like inclement weather, they change the nature of a place.
Eric24
Member
This topic was really relevant to me this weekend. I have not been particularly excited to hunt deer locally for the last few years due to access changing so much in Western WA. We now need to buy a permit from Weyerhaeuser Co to hunt most of the land i grew up hunting, and they are usually sold out in the first few minutes for the areas around my place. You need to be logged into their system immediately upon the sale start time and there is no guarantee you will be able to actually buy a permit. That and the permit is around 500$ if they are still available. We have some other timber company land that you can walk into but there are always 3-4 pickups parked there 2 hours before daylight and i am not going to pile into the same 80 acre chunk as six other guys. Same with any State owned land. Usually a blaze orange parade through the woods. I decided to get an early start yesterday and went to 4 different spots that i knew held deer well before sunrise. Each spot i went to already had multiple empty vehicles. I could have parked and joined the crowd but just moved along to the next spot looking for anyplace I thought might be unoccupied by other hunters. 2 hours after daylight I decided to head home and change oil in the pickup and watch football instead. I know complete solitude is not a reasonable expectation, but the overcrowding that is currently the state of hunting over here is really not worth it to me anymore. I keep telling myself that a pack in wilderness hunt is happening next season, I guess I'll have to actually make it happen this time.
Stone_Ice_1
Well-known member
I think this discussion needs a graphic to best portray the thinking process here. Similar to the hot/crazy matrix that I am sure many of you are familiar with... Which by the way, AI really has not idea what a mule deer buck looks like.
Benfromalbuquerque
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The Orange Army and the deep walk tech bros overlap 1/2 mile off the roads. If you can find a swamp, hellhole thicket or nasty blowdown adjacent to the busiest road, you’ll find deer.
