7mm project done...

[Spitz]

Looks great Buzz!

So here's a quick question maybe you can deliver some insight on:

I took my scope off my rifle the other day and have it ready to go and boxed up with the paperwork to have leupold put the cds dials on it for the specific load I'm using. Haven't sent it off yet because I'm trying to decide if I should just have them throw M1 or target turrets on instead and be a little more versatile for the varying elevations and temperature ranges I hunt in. I've seen the target turrets and the cds dials on other guns but never the M1 which it looks like you have. They're obviously working well. Would you have done anything different other than just getting an elevation turret? How easily would those move if they were to be bumped? Also, are they limited to only a single revolution? I'm wondering if they can move with a bump if I would have to be concerned with them having been turned more than a complete revolution which could screw things up real bad. Thanks!

 

[BuzzH]

In fairness that rifle always shot well, I'd say its improved the accuracy by 20%...but I dont think its all just the rifle. Part of it is the COAL and finding and measuring to the contact of the lands and working loads from there. In the past, I've always just kind of guessed on where to seat the bullets, blacken a bullet and if I didnt see any mark from the lands, try it and see how it shoots. The reason for my choices for the rifle were 2 fold, one I wanted something that was bomb proof and two I wanted consistancy in all weather conditions. Not sure I could have trusted a wood stock for that reason. The bedding, the trigger, and the loads are probably the big reasons for the improvements, IMO.

Ben, I full length resize everything, always have, probably because I dont know any better.

Spitz, you have to crank on those m1's pretty good to make them turn, plus there are marks on the turret to make sure you get back to zero. You'd definately know if you spun past a complete turn I would think. Frankly I cant see why a person would go with the cds over MOA or MIL adjustments on a turret. For starters, you're pretty well committed to a specific rifle and specific load with the cds. If you never plan on changing anything, I suppose that would be a great way to go. If you're wanting to change loads or put the scope on another rifle, I'd think the cds would be less desireable. Also, with the MOA or MILS, you can pick ANY zero range you want and run your drop charts from there. I dont really have to worry about adjusting anything until after 300 yards.

This stuff is largely new to me and I just barely know shit from clay about it. I'm learning though and I did quite a bit of research before I decided on anything.

There are many guys on this board and others that are much better qualified than I am when it comes to these type of things. I'm even hesitant to suggest anything as I've barely scratched the surface on squeaking out accuracy and dealing with turrets, etc.

Its a constant learning game for me...

 

[cowboy]

Looks great Buzz!
Haven't sent it off yet because I'm trying to decide if I should just have them throw M1 or target turrets on instead and be a little more versatile for the varying elevations and temperature ranges I hunt in. How easily would those move if they were to be bumped? Also, are they limited to only a single revolution? I'm wondering if they can move with a bump if I would have to be concerned with them having been turned more than a complete revolution which could screw things up real bad. Thanks!

Spitz: I'll try and throw a few comments your way on some of your questions.

If you hunt at drastic elevation differences, with a lot of temp difference the M1 turrets are much more flexible/accurate - you will really see the difference beyond 500 yds.. The rough rule of thumb is you can go + or - 2000' of elevation from what your turret is calculated at and get by pretty well.

My son has a Leo. 4.5-14 with 30mm tube and M1 turrets and it is nuts on. He went one step further and having a CAD program at work he created a yardage strip that he put on his turret so he just dials the yardage in, adjusts for wind and sends it. I also took his scope when he got it and had a zero stop installed by a very reputable gunsmith down in Wyo..

The Leo. my son has is not limited to a single revolution - so a zero stop in my opinion is mandatory. I've seen way too many long range shooters get one rev. off and it sure messes with your brain. It would take quite a bit to actually move the M1 turret by accident - his has very noticeable/defined clicks.

You never mentioned if your scope had a 1" tube or a 30mm tube. The reason I mention this is the 30mm tube will have more clicks available overall than a 1" tube will. The answer to your question as far as going more than one revolution is what is the tube size of your scope along with the speed/weight/BC of your bullet - I guess what I'm trying to say is it takes a hell of a lot of clicks to get a 30-30 out to 800 yds. and probable half as many clicks to get a 300 win mag out to the same distance. I am assuming that your scope is 1/4" moa per click and not 1/8" moa. The 1/8" moa only gets you out half as far per revolution.

I used a conventional cross hair system for many many years, went to a leupold with a B&C reticle, then to a swarovski with a BR reticle, and finally 4 years ago went to a Huskemaw scope with a turret system. My Huskemaw has 1/3" moa clicks so I can get more distance per revolution versus a 1/4" clicks. There is no comparison when you get beyond 400 yds - the turret system is far and above the most dependable.

FYI: I know a number of people that have had turrets built by Kenton Industries and they perform very well also. Kenton has been making turrets for a long time and they make them for a lot of different scope manufacturers.

Hope I didn't muddy the water too bad for you - it's not all that complicated once you get into it and get comfortable knowing what variables you are dealing with.

Take care and good luck.

 

[Ridge Runner]

Looks great and shoots just as good as looks! Nice job Buzz. You have a nice weapon there for sure.

 

[gundog]

I'd set the dies to neck size only. You may see even smaller groups!

 

[Drake4]

Looks great Buzz!

So here's a quick question maybe you can deliver some insight on:

I took my scope off my rifle the other day and have it ready to go and boxed up with the paperwork to have leupold put the cds dials on it for the specific load I'm using. Haven't sent it off yet because I'm trying to decide if I should just have them throw M1 or target turrets on instead and be a little more versatile for the varying elevations and temperature ranges I hunt in. I've seen the target turrets and the cds dials on other guns but never the M1 which it looks like you have. They're obviously working well. Would you have done anything different other than just getting an elevation turret? How easily would those move if they were to be bumped? Also, are they limited to only a single revolution? I'm wondering if they can move with a bump if I would have to be concerned with them having been turned more than a complete revolution which could screw things up real bad. Thanks!

Spitz..go with the M1. I went through the same thing with my rifle last year. I have a 4.5x14 30mm that I ordered from the custom shop, and had them put an M1 on it. You aren't limited to one revolution, but I can get out to 850 yards on one turn with my load/rifle. I can't imagine them moving with a bump..I sure haven't had a problem, and the gun has spent quite a bit of time on my Kifaru sling. You are right, they are very versatile. I can post some pics. of mine if you want to see any close ups. I was a little bit worried about the exposed knob, but I really like it, and am glad I don't have to mess with a turret cap, etc.

 

[1_pointer]

WOW!! Who'd a thunk it a few years ago that Buzz, of all people, would have a synthetic stock AND advertising that fact! Rifle looks good and you definitely can shoot it, congrats!

Spitz- re: CDS dials, they can be had in MOA hashes as well. So you could get one calibrated for the load you're using now and a MOA one to use if you want to change things up. I have a scope with the target turrets. Though I haven't used M1s or CDSs more than playing with a few other's scopes, I prefer them to the target turrets.

 

[Ben Lamb]

Buzz, try backing your sizing die off 1/4 - 1/2 turn so that it just grabs the neck. Or, buy a neck sizing die (they're $20-25 bucks). Might shrink those groups a little more. Not that it needs it, but it does stretch the life of your brass a little longer.

 

[Spitz]

Thanks guys. I hope not to detract too much from the thread about Buzz's sweet shooting modern day setup. I've got a 4.5-14LR 30mm scope with the B&C reticle on it. I'm pretty sure when it gets sent off to Leupold tomorrow I'll be requesting the M1 elevation turret for it. Though I hadn't considered a cds with just MOA hashes . . . . Maybe I just need another rifle/scope setup since there are too many options out there for just one perfect setup.

 

[MuddyBull]

Wow, that turned out very nice. My only big game rifle is a Remington 7 mag, it has served me well on many elk and mulies. However this post has me really considering getting my Leo fiitted with the turrets and going to a composite stock for better consistancy. Love your groups!

 

[sweetnectar]

With a group like that at 300 yards, do not touch anything. That is a great set up.