Montana Mule Deer Mismanagement

[antlerradar]

Ultimately, any argument that will be compelling/convincing enough to drive change is going to have be based on data. Ideally, using data that can prove your point. Or, in the abscence of that, proving that their data and associated long term understanding is flawed. They dont agree with the anecdotes and opinions (of a minority), and the science is on their side (from their perspective) for keeping seasons as they are. Thats my takeaway from the podcast, unfortunately.

Arguing for change because we need more big deer is a losing proposition. We need some change to stop the progression of LE across the state, Spread out hunting pressure, slow the spread of commercialization/loss in BM and improve access. None of this is going to happen if we keep everything the same.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Arguing for change because we need more big deer is a losing proposition. We need some change to stop the progression of LE across the state, Spread out hunting pressure, slow the spread of commercialization/loss in BM and improve access. None of this is going to happen if we keep everything the same.

Im not attempting to do that, sorry if it sounds that way.

Theres been several references to doe/buck ratios and age class diversity being detrimental to herd health in the thread.

The point remains about the data being required to make the case.

 

[bigsky2]

Im not attempting to do that, sorry if it sounds that way.

Theres been several references to doe/buck ratios and age class diversity being detrimental to herd health in the thread.

The point remains about the data being required to make the case.

It's unfortunate that there's no data to show the increase in leasing/paid hunting by resident hunters. It seems like it was pretty rare to hear about residents paying for hunting access 15 years ago. Now I hear about it all the time. I think that's largely due to the decrease of the hunting quality on public land.

 

[Forkyfinder]

It's unfortunate that there's no data to show the increase in leasing/paid hunting by resident hunters. It seems like it was pretty rare to hear about residents paying for hunting access 15 years ago. Now I hear about it all the time. I think that's largely due to the decrease of the hunting quality on public land.

No disagreement there. I honestly dont think theres a lot to be done to change that either.

 

[Rie Bread]

… We need some change to stop the progression of LE across the state, Spread out hunting pressure, slow the spread of commercialization/loss in BM and improve access. None of this is going to happen if we keep everything the same.

 

[antlerradar]

Do you have access to the data? If so, PM me.

The more I look at and think about that comment, I really see 2 potential issues with the data.

The first, you touch on above, some sort of bias that causes people to submit older deer in a higher frequency then younger deer. A quick check on that would be compare the male age data to the female age data. If you look at the pie charts above, they are pretty similar. That causes me to think that the CWD sampling is random and fairly represents the age structure.

Doe harvest is not necessarily a random sample of the doe herd. I have been on more than my share of trophy doe hunts with hunters and when given the chance the hunters are selecting the doe with the larger bodies out of the herd.

 

[8andcounting]

We Want Your Input! FWP Hosts Statewide Workshops To Get Input For New Mule Deer Management Plan | Montana FWP

FWP hosts statewide workshops to get input for new mule deer management plan

fwp.mt.gov

 

[Forkyfinder]

We Want Your Input! FWP Hosts Statewide Workshops To Get Input For New Mule Deer Management Plan | Montana FWP

FWP hosts statewide workshops to get input for new mule deer management plan

fwp.mt.gov

Important takeaways From the link:

Mule deer population overview

Over the past several years, mule deer populations in Montana have fluctuated, and in many areas declined. The three main drivers for mule deer populations are weather, habitat and disease.

Declining and fluctuating mule deer numbers have concerned both hunters and FWP staff. Assessing the population statewide is complicated. Not every part of the state has the same set of challenges. However, persistent drought and the broadening impacts of chronic wasting disease seem to be widespread.

“It’s a challenge to assess the current state of mule deer through a statewide lens,” FWP Game Management Bureau Chief Brian Wakeling said. “That’s why it’s so important we get input from the public in each region throughout our state in order to compile a comprehensive plan.”

.....

If you disagree id attend.

 

[Rie Bread]

FWP will host public workshops around the state. Each workshop will have breakout group discussions led by FWP staff.

• May12, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 3 Headquarters Office, 1400 South 19th, Bozeman
• May 13, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 2 Headquarters Office, 3201 Spurgin Road, Missoula
• May 14, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 1 Headquarters Office, 490 North Meridian Road, Kalispell
• May 19, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 5 Headquarters Office, 2300 Lake Elmo Drive, Billings
• May 20, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 7 Headquarters Office, 352 1-94 Business Loop, Miles City
• May 21, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 6 Headquarters Office, 1 Airport Road, Glasgow
• May 22, 5:30-8 p.m. – Region 4 Headquarters Office, 4600 Giant Springs Road, Great Falls

 

[peeshaunn]

It’s a pretty big stretch to pin 40 years of poor management on the latest governor. IMO

 

[brockel]

Declining and fluctuating mule deer numbers have concerned both hunters and FWP staff.

.....

If you disagree id attend.

If FWP truly gave a shit about declining numbers there would be ZERO doe tags. Yet they even fought having doe tags not valid on public.

 

[brockel]

It’s a pretty big stretch to pin 40 years of poor management on the latest governor. IMO

Welcome to politics

 

[8andcounting]

If FWP truly gave a shit about declining numbers there would be ZERO doe tags. Yet they even fought having doe tags not valid on public.

Cuz I’m sure they caught hell from Montana residents for loss of opportunity…. Fact is lots of residents and probably just as many non residents just want opportunities no matter what they type on here

 

[DFS]

Cuz I’m sure they caught hell from Montana residents for loss of opportunity…. Fact is lots of residents and probably just as many non residents just want opportunities no matter what they type on here

And you are one of them. 18 dinks and counting?

 

[brockel]

Cuz I’m sure they caught hell from Montana residents for loss of opportunity…. Fact is lots of residents and probably just as many non residents just want opportunities no matter what they type on here

They aren’t an elected position so their only concern should be the well being of the animals they are paid to manage.

 

[8andcounting]

They aren’t an elected position so their only concern should be the well being of the animals they are paid to manage.

You bet . But it isn’t so

 

[cgasner1]

Same team boys now how are we gonna rally everyone to show up

 

[Forkyfinder]

They aren’t an elected position so their only concern should be the well being of the animals they are paid to manage.

You bet . But it isn’t so

Sort of. Just like the BLM, USDA, they are ran by political appointees that have agendas, interests, and plans.

They cant really just shit on the public.

 

[8andcounting]

And you are one of them. 18 dinks and counting?

many years I’ve had NR Montana tags and never fired a shot . Last year for deer was another one . I’m all for cuts but it has to start with NR and R both realizing there’s a problem .

 

[brockel]

many years I’ve had NR Montana tags and never fired a shot . Last year for deer was another one . I’m all for cuts but it has to start with NR and R both realizing there’s a problem .

I think LOTS of residents know there is a problem. They just dont think they should give up their opportunity before the non residents give up more.