Compound Bows vs. Crossbows vs. Rifles

[EKYHunter]

I guess some don't see the hypocrisy of condemning technology creep in archery while shooting a high powered rifles.

I'll give you a hint, it's dripping all over your arguments...

States set the regulations for hunting. Hopefully, science drives the process. If the regulations allow tradition archery equipment, compound bows and crossbows during archery season ... you use what you want, and other folks can use what they want. Stop the silly bickering with other hunters. Get out and enjoy the method of hunting that you like to do.

Agree with both of these comments. I don’t own a crossbow and don’t plan on getting one. I could care less which weapon you use as long as your legal. Have fun, enjoy God’s creation, and kill stuff! And no matter which weapon you use, I’ll sincerely congratulate you when you post up pics of your kill.

 

[Pmacc60]

The problem with rifles is it’s very easy to take unethical shots and have a great chance at wounding the animal. And it can be done with even less practice than a compound bow just a big wallet and some YouTube videos and you are well on your way to shooting beyond belief.

Timmy anyone who puts their efforts into something can excel well beyond belief. I found through nearly fifty years of messing with guns and bows that they can be mastered by practice and education . You can watch all the you tubes in the world but until you put time in your just another internet genius all knowledge no practical skill. You can shoot lights out with your bow but drawing without being seen or heard. You are dead wrong when you believe that shooting rifles doesn’t take skill and practice and I have yet to see anyone buy skill and experience . Skill is always hard fought for and won not bought with deep pockets. I have often said I can shoot tighter groups with my compound at fifty yards then many rifle shooters can off hand with their rifles. Ethical is a unicorn , anti hunters say all of us are unethical, there are many hunters out there with bows , Crossbows and firearms who are not proficient because of lack of practice time and dedication to the sport. Across the board hunters in all categories can do better.

I guess some don't see the hypocrisy of condemning technology creep in archery while shooting a high powered rifles.

I'll give you a hint, it's dripping all over your arguments...

i fail to see the hypocrisy , I see as a twist in argument. Many are just saying a crossbow isn’t archery and should not be used throughout the designated archery seasons. Fact is crossbow hunters enjoy a extreme advantage over stick bow and compound archery hunters and if they didn’t they wouldn’t use them. Hypocrisy would be that if a crossbow is being used then why not just make season weapons choice …… no be deal ! Correct no incorrect , there is advantage and more hunters in the field . Archery hunting to me has always been peace and quiet to pursue deer , it’s very personal and has its advantage that I can target one animal with little outside interruption . Practice and a honing of shooting and hunting skills. Archery isn’t for everyone and it isn’t a shoulder fired scoped crossbow.

 

[devon deer]

Enjoy Archery to hunt in any form whilst you still can, I suspect you will go the same way as we did and archery will be banned.
(but they never stopped me hunting rabbits when I was only 10 with a homemade setup!)
That was way back in 1965, no social media then!
I expect in 10 years time on this forum a thread will be raised, 'does anyone remember the good old days when we could hunt archery?'

 

[BWALKER77]

Question-How long have you lived in Montana?

Going on 5 years. Have hunted here since 1991.

 

[shrapnel]

Exactly isn't hard is it.

Nothing is hard on the internet.

 

[tjones]

Going on 5 years. Have hunted here since 1991.

Any pics of the bulls you have killed?

 

[BWALKER77]

Any pics of the bulls you have killed?

Yep.
You will never see them nor will anyone else. I dont post such pics on the internet for a variety of reasons.

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

Than why are archery success rates still so crappy? Why do the majority of bow hunters still come home empty handed?

Because most people are too lazy to look at statistics in detail, making these points spurious.

Tease out the data and you find far more complicated patters.

For instance:

What species are you talking about? Elk well on the one hand you have a ton of first timers who literally are trying to have their first animal be an archery elk... but then again archery hunters get to hunt the rut and call in elk, so the distance limitation is diminished because you can stalk to rifle range and then get the animal to come to you. If you look at success rates, and it varies, archery hunters have better rates than rifle hunters. See CO 3rd season versus archery season.

If we are being completely honest, you can't really compare success rates because there are very very few apples to apples hunts with lots of data points.

Archery seasons tend to occur in different conditions than rifle seasons, hunts with pick your weapon don't tend to track success by method, and hunts like sheep and goat tend to have really small sample size; the guy hunting a dall sheep with a bow might have killed 7 with a rifle and is not only bow hunting but also holding out for a special one and more than happy to go home empty handed, and with limited number of animals taken a hand full of those hunters and blow up stats.

Therefore.

"Why are archery success rates still so crappy" - I don't think you can factually support this claim in aggregate, maybe for specific hunts.
"Why do the majority of bow hunters still come home empty handed" - So do the majority of rifle hunters, so this question is irrelevant.

N * S = H

N= number of hunters
S= success rate
H= harvest

Bio's determine the desired harvest rate, let's say 1 goat from a mountain range.

If they allow gloves off hunting, say you can use helicopters, 365 day season, and rifle then success is 100% so;

1*1=1

If you put in lots of restrictions, weapon, season timing, difficulty of access (distance, land ownership, terrain) then rates may diminish so 10% perhaps.

10 * .1 = 1

So 10 people get to hunt instead of just 1.

The entire point of any method of take argument is if you improve the success rate then opportunity decreases. It's just math; think about whether you want a tag in your pocket or a bigger chance of going home empty handed and then write your emails to DNR departments accordingly.

 

[Cowboynjco]

I wish Colorado would catch up with the rest or the Country .

 

[AvidIndoorsman]

I wish Colorado would catch up with the rest or the Country .

I hope CO never allows crossbows, scopes on muzzys/firestick/etc.

Personally I like hunting and don't particularly care for watching others hunt on TV but it that's your kick, keep draining the well bro.

 

[np307]

I'll just add that I started keeping a mental record of deer that I was reasonably certain I could have killed with a crossbow instead of my compound bow a few years back. We get 6 tags, so an increase of kills from crossbows isn't threatening the herd or anything like that, I was just curious. Over the basically 2 months of archery season, I haven't had a year that there were fewer than 3 interactions that I could have killed a deer with a crossbow instead of a compound. Usually at least one where I get busted on the draw and then the others are fast paced deals where I dont even try to draw because I know I'll get busted. Keep in mind I hunt from the ground, so my draw motion is always at eye level for the deer. Draw whatever conclusions that you want to from that, but I think its interesting.

 

[Irrelevant]

"Why are archery success rates still so crappy" - I don't think you can factually support this claim in aggregate, maybe for specific hunts.

Another method is not stop looking for perfect comparisons and simply look at very board datasets. The larger the better.
From WA:



Very little difference between archery and rifle success rates.

 

[Shangobango]

I'll just add that I started keeping a mental record of deer that I was reasonably certain I could have killed with a crossbow instead of my compound bow a few years back. We get 6 tags, so an increase of kills from crossbows isn't threatening the herd or anything like that, I was just curious. Over the basically 2 months of archery season, I haven't had a year that there were fewer than 3 interactions that I could have killed a deer with a crossbow instead of a compound. Usually at least one where I get busted on the draw and then the others are fast paced deals where I dont even try to draw because I know I'll get busted. Keep in mind I hunt from the ground, so my draw motion is always at eye level for the deer. Draw whatever conclusions that you want to from that, but I think its interesting.

I did the same thing with crossbow vs. firearm for the 9 straight days I hunted with a crossbow last season.

I would have had 3 chip shots with my old Hawken smokepole during that 9 days. Never took the safety off on the crossbow.

 

[ARKANSASHUNTER]

I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents and keep in mind that this is my personal reasoning and not meant to reflect on anyone else. I'm a live and let live kind of guy. I hunt with an old Horton crossbow that my father inlaw gave me. I've killed 4 deer and a bear with it and they've all been at 15 yards or closer. I have a long bow that I target shoot with but don't hunt with it. I bought a compound a few years ago but gave it away. The only reason I archery hunt at all is because I need the extra opportunity to stock the freezer for the year. I would always prefer to have a gun in my hand because it's the most effective weapon. Causing undue suffering or losing an animal because I want to "challenge myself" is a nightmare to me. I'm not out to prove anything to myself or anyone else. I've done that in other areas of my life and I'm over it. I really enjoy hunting (but not great at it) and I don't want to buy meat at the store. It's really that simple for me and I want to keep it that way.

 

[Shangobango]

The point I was trying to make was that a crossbow has more in common and similarity to a gun than a bow simply because you don’t have to draw it. That simple movement has hosed a chit ton of archery hunters over the years that being said I can see others point about the unwieldy ness and weight of a crossbow.

Fair enough, but the ballistics of the projectile have much more in common with an arrow fired out of an upright bow.

 

[Pmacc60]

I guess I'll throw in my 2 cents and keep in mind that this is my personal reasoning and not meant to reflect on anyone else. I'm a live and let live kind of guy. I hunt with an old Horton crossbow that my father inlaw gave me. I've killed 4 deer and a bear with it and they've all been at 15 yards or closer. I have a long bow that I target shoot with but don't hunt with it. I bought a compound a few years ago but gave it away. The only reason I archery hunt at all is because I need the extra opportunity to stock the freezer for the year. I would always prefer to have a gun in my hand because it's the most effective weapon. Causing undue suffering or losing an animal because I want to "challenge myself" is a nightmare to me. I'm not out to prove anything to myself or anyone else. I've done that in other areas of my life and I'm over it. I really enjoy hunting (but not great at it) and I don't want to buy meat at the store. It's really that simple for me and I want to keep it that way.

I can find no fault in your logic , I feel as long as your state deems your method of taking game legal then you are beyond any negative feed back. We as hunters and gun owners must support every other legal and ethical hunter’s right to pursue their sport.
I see this more of a argument that needs to be handled by game commissions. Unfortunately money has a way of making decisions of the states DNR’s swayed towards the weight of the money! I wish you success in this coming season.

 

[dannyb278]

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