Colorado Bans Drones For Hunting

[spook12]

But those things are directly related to hunting.

Do you think the DOW has the right to tell a family from the Springs that they can't go out to the grandparents and fly their UAV over the Labor Day weekend because there's a season open.

 

[Ben Lamb]

While I don't know the specifics of the rule passed by the commission, it seems clear that you can use a UAV all you like outside of hunting season.


You've got to admit that this one will be interesting the first time it comes before a Judge.
I'm not sold on the idea that the DOW can make an otherwise legal,non-hunting activity Illegal just because a season is open.

Not really. Game agencies have to show intent in order to get a conviction. Same as they do with manned flights, etc. They can't just arrest someone for flying, there has to be a supposition of violation.

It'd be pretty easy to carry over the same regulations related to manned aircraft.

 

[jryoung]

But those things are directly related to hunting.

Do you think the DOW has the right to tell a family from the Springs that they can't go out to the grandparents and fly their UAV over the Labor Day weekend because there's a season open.

They can tell a recreational ATV'er that they can't drive the roads, how is this much different? I think there will also be some discretion available to a warder/officer given the circumstances.

 

[spook12]

Just to be clear I'm 100% opposed to the use of UAV's for hunting I'm just not real sure how to go about it.

I'm not comfortable infringing on the rights of others who just want to enjoy their hobby (which a state wide ban during seasons does IMO). If written into the code where it is an agreed upon condition to participate in a hunt (like every other rule we agree to when we purchase a tag) then great,I can get on board that.

 

[spook12]

They can tell a recreational ATV'er that they can't drive the roads, how is this much different? I think there will also be some discretion available to a warder/officer given the circumstances.

I'm not aware of any Game agency that has successfully banned ATV use State wide.
I'm not aware of an Game agency that has banned ANY use on Private ground.

 

[jryoung]

I'm not aware of any Game agency that has successfully banned ATV use State wide.
I'm not aware of an Game agency that has banned ANY use on Private ground.

Fair enough, then I'll revert back to my comment about warden/officer discretion and Ben's comment about showing intent. The law bans drones for hunting/scouting, I haven't seen the rules codified yet, but it seems to me it'd be reasonably clear if someone is out using a UAV for those purposes.

 

[spook12]

Fair enough, then I'll revert back to my comment about warden/officer discretion and Ben's comment about showing intent. The law bans drones for hunting/scouting, I haven't seen the rules codified yet, but it seems to me it'd be reasonably clear if someone is out using a UAV for those purposes.

I'm sure you're right. IMO the UAV codes should mirror the Manned aircraft codes, which are just slightly more useful than nothing as scouting is concerned.

Anyone have a link for the Colorado code? Is there any final language for what is proposed in Montana?

 

[Jorgy]

Anyone have a link for the Colorado code?

I've searched for what it actually going to say and can't find it anywhere. This is how it's worded on the agenda to vote on

Prohibiting the use of drones (unmanned aircraft) as an aid in scouting, hunting and taking of wildlife.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCol...mmission/2014/Jan/NoticeJAN-FINAL-revised.pdf

Big game regs aren't available for another month, so they have a little bit of time for wording I guess.

I tell you what, if it wasn't for this site, I wouldn't have a clue what is going on in my own state. Now atleast I know how to find the agendas for the Wildlife Commission.

 

[spook12]

I've searched for what it actually going to say and can't find it anywhere. This is how it's worded on the agenda to vote on

Prohibiting the use of drones (unmanned aircraft) as an aid in scouting, hunting and taking of wildlife.

http://wildlife.state.co.us/SiteCol...mmission/2014/Jan/NoticeJAN-FINAL-revised.pdf

Big game regs aren't available for another month, so they have a little bit of time for wording I guess.

I tell you what, if it wasn't for this site, I wouldn't have a clue what is going on in my own state. Now atleast I know how to find the agendas for the Wildlife Commission.

I read that on the agenda also.
I'd wager that when the dust settles on this one that the rules governing Manned and Unmanned aircraft are basically the same.

I know that we have some folks here that work for the Forest Service. Maybe one of them could give the rest of us a lesson on how this stuff works, because I've always been under the impression that land use restrictions are made by the managing agency. I'm not so sure that A States Game Dept can just decide that no one can fly a UAV on Federal land.

I've always thought that a Game Agency had to work with the Land managers to get things like seasonal road or snowmobile closures written into that Agencies management plan.
Can Game agencies just close a road on Fed land?
Has anyone heard if the Forest Service or BLM have studied this issue?

 

[Ben Lamb]

I read that on the agenda also.
I'd wager that when the dust settles on this one that the rules governing Manned and Unmanned aircraft are basically the same.

I suspect that's correct. It's easier to insert a phrase like "unmanned aerial vehicle" into existing regulations.

I know that we have some folks here that work for the Forest Service. Maybe one of them could give the rest of us a lesson on how this stuff works, because I've always been under the impression that land use restrictions are made by the managing agency. I'm not so sure that A States Game Dept can just decide that no one can fly a UAV on Federal land.

It's a little confusing, I agree. You are actually talking about two different things: Game management, with a few exceptions, is carried out by the state. They can then decide what the rules for hunting are when it comes to technology such as drones or aerial scouting since those technologies give unfair advantages over the take of the game. Those regulations are specific to the taking of game, so are set and enforced by state game agencies. This is not a land use restriction but a game management decision.

With this regulation, you could still fly an AUV on Federal Land provided you are not going to use it for hunting purposes. Similar to how you can carry a firearm during archery season.

This does not fall under land use planning since it is specific to hunting.

I've always thought that a Game Agency had to work with the Land managers to get things like seasonal road or snowmobile closures written into that Agencies management plan.
Can Game agencies just close a road on Fed land?
Has anyone heard if the Forest Service or BLM have studied this issue?

I think Buzz or Craig could answer this much better than I, but the Federal Agencies do work in conjunction with local wildlife managers in order to better manage the resource. However, each agency has it's own standards for wildlife that they follow. Most land management agencies that I've worked with manage based on the Code of Federal Regulations & other rules set forth both in statute and under Administrative rules.

 

[spook12]

With this regulation, you could still fly an AUV on Federal Land provided you are not going to use it for hunting purposes. Similar to how you can carry a firearm during archery season.

This does not fall under land use planning since it is specific to hunting.
.

My bad,Ben. I'm clear on Who sets Hunting regs VS. Who sets land use rules. I guess I was still fixated on jr's State wide ban during hunting season. I understand that the State has the right to say they can't be used for hunting. I'm not real sure how they hope to be able to enforce the ''Scouting'' part of the reg though. Is anyone flying a UAV over the Breaks in July Scouting? For that matter is everone flying the Breaks in Oct.scouting.

 

[Ben Lamb]

My bad,Ben. I'm clear on Who sets Hunting regs VS. Who sets land use rules. I guess I was still fixated on jr's State wide ban during hunting season. I understand that the State has the right to say they can't be used for hunting. I'm not real sure how they hope to be able to enforce the ''Scouting'' part of the reg though. Is anyone flying a UAV over the Breaks in July Scouting? For that matter is everone flying the Breaks in Oct.scouting.

The Breaks/MT rule is for 24 hours before hunting, IIRC. Same thing could be done here. I would wager though, that an elk herd in CO is in a much different spot than when the hordes of camo encrusted vagabonds enter into the state later in the year.

 

[Flynarrow]

Game laws apply to wildlife whether on pvt or public here in montana.

 

[BuzzH]

spook12,

I think you're right on regarding the enforcement. There are a bunch of laws that are a real bitch to enforce.

I think this is similar to MT's law regarding the use of 2-way communication for hunting. You cant use radios to guide hunters into game there, but how do you enforce it? I suppose, technically, a warden could use some sort of scanner.

I also believe Ben is right on regarding who sets land use rules VS. who sets game laws. There is a distinction, but I agree with you that lines get a bit blurry at times. Wyomings Wilderness Guide Law is a prime example. There really isnt a land use restriction per se, because you can use wilderness in Wyoming without a guide all day long. You just cant hunt game animals in one without a guide.

IMO, the drone regulation is the same. The Federal/State land management agencies arent saying you cant fly a drone over federal land. However, the State is saying that if you are doing so to scout, hunt, or utilize them in the taking of game in any way, you're in violation. Again, like you stated, enforcement is always going to be the real challenge.

I think about the only way it will be really enforceable is if its discovered in an under-cover operation, if violators are turned in, or if they're dumb enough to fess up to using them for scouting.

Thats one of the problems that wildlife face, IMO. There are lots of laws on the books, but not enough wardens/law enforcement to really enforce all the rules. I'm not saying that the laws arent important, they are.

Sportsmen need to have (basically) a ZERO tolerance policy when they witness wildife related crimes. Make the calls...its YOUR wildlife that will suffer if you dont.

 

[Jorgy]

So just got my regs in the mail today and opened up to see what it said about drones.

Use of Internet or other computer assisted remote control technology while hunting and fishing. This includes unmanned or remote control drones used to look for wildlife. Hunters and anglers must be physically present in the immediate vicinity while hunting and fishing.

Way to many loopholes here, and also the reason why I believed you don't fix a problem that doesn't exist.

How I read this, I could sit at my house, fly a drone around and find a herd of elk and call someone on a radio and tell them where they are. This is how I would think drones would be used anyway.

also think that first part Use of Internet makes me think you better not be posting hunting updates on a web forum while in Colorado. No more wasting time looking through facebook when I'm bored on stand