Nameless Range
Well-known member
I am currently riding in a car across central MT and so I am doing this all on my phone, but figured a fresh thread to discuss the proposals FWP is gonna try and push on Montanans could be good.
Attached are the files Ben Shared as jpgs, as opposed to pdfs, in case someone can't open pdfs.
I have gut reactions in red, but admit they aren't thought through really.I hope folks can speak to the proposals specifically, so intelligent and cogent opposition where needed, can be consolidated for all to see and think about.
Attached are the files Ben Shared as jpgs, as opposed to pdfs, in case someone can't open pdfs.
I have gut reactions in red, but admit they aren't thought through really.I hope folks can speak to the proposals specifically, so intelligent and cogent opposition where needed, can be consolidated for all to see and think about.
I'm sure there's a good reason why everyone's choosing to bite their tongue at this point, but I'm too dumb to know what that reason is, so here's what I know-
-Each regional biologist was sent a list from Director Worsech of what changes need to be proposed for this winter's biannual season setting process. If they do not make these changes, they need to defend to him why they can't make that change.
I am opposed to top-down approaches to wildlife management. I want management based on the expertise of local biologists. Montana is a varied landscape, and we should expect a variance in management across the state, if it is good.
-Individual hunting districts will be lumped into much larger regional districts, that will be uniform across species.
We have needed for a long time, more acute management across the state. Within an HD there are elk/deer that we are focusing pressure on, that have nothing to do with competition for grass on once side of the HD 50 miles away. We need geography based, scientific management.
-These regional districts will need simplified, blanket regulations.
I am not a priori opposed to a simplification of regulations, but this is obviously a top down approach having little to do with actual management.
-If there are limited entry districts within these regions that are largely general units, those areas that are now limited entry will go general (I.E. 324 and 300 mule deer will now be part of much larger general mule deer units). CWD travels faster in trophy districts so those will be leaned away from.
Poz said, "Believe in the people". This is a drum I will beat repeatedly. To our fellow hunters who hunt public land I will always ask, "Has mule deer hunting on public land gotten better or worse over the last few years? Do you think this will improve that? When you hunt elk on public land do you think to yourself, there are just too many elk out here?" Do you think this will improve public land elk hunting? Do you think the state needs to reduce its elk herd by a third?
I would wager the answer to all those questions will be no. This is where people can help.
-All unlimited permits will be removed.
I have mixed feelings on unlimited permits. The HD I grew up hunting was unlimited, and in the last 3 years since they have removed the unlimited permits, less mule deer have been killed by less hunter days. I think this may not be universal though, and as urban areas in MT grow, it could go the other way. I don't have enough info.
-All sub-units will be removed.
Don't have a strong opinion.
-All permits with less than 50 tags are to be removed.
Seems wholly arbitrary.
-There will be no more "attached" opportunities like the B/C WMA tags, antelope doe tags that are offered to buck tag holders, etc.
If the same amount of tags are allocated, but to more people, it could potentially make things a chitshow, vastly increasing the amount of hunters on the landscape (think 360 pronghorn). That said, I don't have enough info to feel strongly.
-All permits/B tags will be district/region wide, so no public land only, private land only restrictions. If it's a shoulder season HD, then you can hunt anywhere within that HD with a shoulder season tag.
This is a terrible idea, and will exacerbate the harboring of elk on private lands. FWP needs to focus on the distribution of elk, and not raw populations. This will make public land hunting worse and worse and simply drive elk to private ground where hunting doesn't exist or is limited.
-The permit only areas that are kept will be lumped into much larger permit only areas. Think Sapphire range mule deer permit rather than 270, 261, etc, or Missouri river breaks elk permit rather than 621, 622, 631, 632 etc.
Again, we need more acute management that takes into consideration the distribution of critters. Why are you breaking something that works?
I've also heard rumors that there's a push to go general bull elk hunting in all of these new HD's that are over objective, but I'm not that positive on that one.
The Elkhorns, the Breaks, etc. The most sought after elk tags in Montana would be no more. That will piss some folks off.
Attachments
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192-21-FWP All-MEMO-Changes to Season Settings & Regs_page-0001.jpg611.1 KB · Views: 109
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2021 season setting timeline_page-0001.jpg658.6 KB · Views: 107
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209-21-MEMO-Regulation Changes Further Guidance_page-0001.jpg859.5 KB · Views: 91
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209-21-MEMO-Regulation Changes Further Guidance_page-0002.jpg177.8 KB · Views: 83
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Boundary Guidance1024_1.jpg104.3 KB · Views: 81
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HTRRWG recommendation and supporting info for elk permits and licenses 09232019_page-0001.jpg698.2 KB · Views: 79
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HTRRWG recommendation and supporting info for elk permits and licenses 09232019_page-0003.jpg797.9 KB · Views: 74
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Hunting District Simiplification Recommendation_Waltee_page-0005.jpg58.2 KB · Views: 83
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Hunting District Simiplification Recommendation_Waltee_page-0001.jpg533.2 KB · Views: 80
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LPT simplification ideas_page-0001.jpg904.4 KB · Views: 85
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LPT simplification ideas_page-0003.jpg120.6 KB · Views: 84
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SeasonSettingGuidance1.jpg588.8 KB · Views: 71
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SeasonSettingGuidance2.jpg641.2 KB · Views: 70
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SeasonSettingGuidance3.jpg244.9 KB · Views: 104