Hornady 7 PRC a Lie?

[std7mag]

7mm .284 180 gr ELD® Match - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc

...

www.hornady.com

On their website. If that ruger is a 1 moa gun - itd not be hard to score hits that far.

Berger's stability calculator is pretty slick - by the way. With a 1 in 10" at sea level - "marginally stable" with a 175 and 10 twist.

Twist Rate Stability Calculator

Our newly updated Twist Rate Stability Calculator not only tells you what your SG is, but it also lets you know if you are reaching your optimized BC.

bergerbullets.com

Yeaaaaahhhhhh......

Notice I said "consistently".


Ultra long range shooters are finding that the "marginal" twist rates are doing better when the bullet goes subsonic.
Bryan Litz mentions this in one of his Applied Ballistics videos.

I thought I remembered a thread over where the shooters are accurate about reloading the 7PRC.
Speeds are all over the place.
With different powders and barrel lengths and makes.
Seems as far as Hornady factory ammo is concerned, people are noticing that the early ammo shoots faster than the newer ammo.
Possibly the shortage of RL26. That's the theory anyways.

People also noticing that the Proof Research barrels are shooting faster.

Personally, IF I were to do a 7PRC, it would be the 7PRCW.

 

[BAKPAKR]

Personally, IF I were to do a 7PRC, it would be the 7PRCW.

Is the “W” for “Wheeler” (to prevent clickers)?

 

[mtmuley]

Make ammo great again.

That's what is interesting. Trying to reinvent how to kill stuff. mtmuley

 

[std7mag]

That's what is interesting. Trying to reinvent how to kill stuff. mtmuley

And yet a pointy stick still works.

Is the “W” for “Wheeler” (to prevent clickers)?

That would be the AW2 reamer.

 

[BAKPAKR]

And yet a pointy stick still works.



That would be the AW2 reamer.

AW2 is what I am used to seeing after PRC. I just googled 7mm PRCW and it looks like that is the 6.5 PRC necked up to 7mm.

 

[GeorgeBlack]

Being an older guy I like the tried and true. 7mm REM for me!
All that glitters isn’t gold,today lots of it just glitters

 

[shannerdrake]

Nosler, as in the guys that ran adds saying the 33 nosler ran 25 fps faster than a 338 lapua mag..

This is all a big nothing burger. Hornady has factory ammo running below published speeds. Gasp, nobody has ever done that before!

What’s the federal ammo running at?

I was messing around with some of Hornady’s sabot slugs and remember getting a few hundred FPS under their advertised speeds. Which is a lot when you are under 2000fps.

I called the company a few times until I got someone to talk to me and I’ll never forget he said “well our test barrel is 32 inches so that might be some of it.” I asked him to point me in the direction of where I could buy a 32” fully rifled slug barrel because I’d love to have one.

 

[Carl]

AW2 is what I am used to seeing after PRC. I just googled 7mm PRCW and it looks like that is the 6.5 PRC necked up to 7mm.

That's correct. It's gained plenty of popularity in F Class. I can see the appeal. More case capacity isn't always a good thing.

 

[Doublecluck]

That's correct. It's gained plenty of popularity in F Class. I can see the appeal. More case capacity isn't always a good thing.

I’m curious what the advantages are if any over a 7 saum. In my mind without looking at exact case specs they have to be very very similar. Genuine question? I got another sa/ma build in the works. 20/22” tube suppressed. Leaning heavily toward 7 saum.

 

[Carl]

I’m curious what the advantages are if any over a 7 saum. In my mind without looking at exact case specs they have to be very very similar. Genuine question? I got another sa/ma build in the works. 20/22” tube suppressed. Leaning heavily toward 7 saum.

It isn't my wheelhouse, but I'd guess the availability of Lapua brass is easily enough for that crowd to choose the PRC case over the SAUM. The 284 Win and it's wildcats have been pretty popular at the top of that game, which has a very similar capacity to the 6.5 PRC case. I wonder if they're getting improved powder burn for lower SD's over the Win case, or if the larger diameter case head leads to longer primer pocket life when pushing the pressure.

 

[nhenry]

all depends i guess.

less powder, better spec chamber design, more speed. Thats better to me and apparently a lot of people buying rifles as a lot more seem to come with 7 prc.

Having the clicker problem doesn’t equate to good chamber design to me. That’s not a problem that most shooters experience since most do not reload, but having to get Wheeler’s reamer to remedy the clicker problem sits wrong with me.

I have not one Rem Mag or PRC, so like I said I have no dog in this fight.

The rem mag has never had a problem except for the the silly belt argument. It was a nonissue then and it’s a nonissue now.

 

[elevatorman]

Yall are making me love my 7 rem mag even more. If your going to handload the old magnums are great cartridges, they've been watered down over the years in factory ammo and handholding brings back their full potential. There's no excuse for modern cartridges to not meet advertised specs. The reason the old magnum are watered down is the possibility of old guns that ain't made as strong floating around. Current cartridges don't have that problem. They should be pushing bullets to the speeds they advertised.

If the 7 prc doesn't do it for you the 7 rem mag should. Or possibly a 28 nosler

 

[std7mag]

Alex Wheeler addressed the clicker issue with the AW2.
According to him, he increased the diameter of the case by 0.002" at the 0.2" datum.
So he increased the diameter from 0.533" to 0.535" at the 0.2" datum.
He also noted that the clicker issue had something to do with which manufacturer of brass you were shooting.

 

[GlockZ]

I have no dog in the fight, I've been quite happy with my 270 Win, & various 308's. Never had interest in anything 7mm either,( maybe I missed the boat on something ). Regardless, I've seen the videos and they are pretty interesting. I think the manufacturers are pushing the boundaries as far as building rifles go,( many rifles today far exceed the 1MOA accuracy, even the inexpensive ones), and now they have turned to inventing new cartridges and pushing those limits as well. Are they necessarily better? Maybe, but I think the differences are so minute at this point, it's just honestly good for making a great sales pitch, and starting discussions around the campfire. The manufacturers are in the business to sell a product, and to throw a new product into the mix with a good sales pitch, is what they do to us, to get to buy and continue to buy in the future. As someone else has posted, most hunters shoot 400yards and in. Myself, most shots at game have been under 200 yards, a few have been between 300-350 yards, so to me those minuscule differences are irrelevant, but to each their own.

 

[406bert]

I will say the .284 bullets on the market today have a great ballistic coefficient! I’ve been looking into the 7prc (thinking of rebarreling an old gun of mine) plenty of ammo on the shelves where I’m located. Haven’t seen much for brass for handholding.

 

[std7mag]

I will say the .284 bullets on the market today have a great ballistic coefficient! I’ve been looking into the 7prc (thinking of rebarreling an old gun of mine) plenty of ammo on the shelves where I’m located. Haven’t seen much for brass for handholding.

The biggest update for BC in bullets as of late has actually been the 25 caliber.
We lost the 131gr Blackjack Ace with the component shortage.
But Berger stepped up with a 133gr and a 135gr bullet.
Hornady also put their toes in the heavy, high BC 25 caliber bullet with their 134gr EDL.

Bad thing is that the twist rate on all my 25 caliber rifles is the standard 1:10. The new bullets require something more in the 1:7.5.
But getting barrels is cheaper than getting a new rifle.

Brass for handloading doesn't have to be super plentiful, like bullets, powder, and primers.
You can reload a piece of brass multiple times.

 

[nhenry]

Alex Wheeler addressed the clicker issue with the AW2.
According to him, he increased the diameter of the case by 0.002" at the 0.2" datum.
So he increased the diameter from 0.533" to 0.535" at the 0.2" datum.
He also noted that the clicker issue had something to do with which manufacturer of brass you were shooting.

I’ve seen it happen with all types of brass, except for Peterson because I’ve never seen Peterson’s. An uncle of mine bought Lapua trying to remedy it and the clickers started on reload 2.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

I’m curious what the advantages are if any over a 7 saum. In my mind without looking at exact case specs they have to be very very similar. Genuine question? I got another sa/ma build in the works. 20/22” tube suppressed. Leaning heavily toward 7 saum.

Like Carl said, plentiful lapua brass but I think the smaller case capacity is desirable for the f class application.

For hunting and a shorter barrel, SAUM would be more desirable to me for a 7mm.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

So 36 fps? Exceptional engineering… what a modern marvel they came up with. Best thing since they turned wheels from square to round. I’m gonna go buy 2.

I’m shooting those 195’s almost 300 fps faster in that Nosler case.

Going from a 7rm to a 28 Nosler is like putting a blower on your truck. Going from a 7rm to a 7prc is like putting a k&n air filter on it. The sticker on the back window makes it better.

I think a 7 RM - 7 PRC is a lateral move. A custom throated RM should outperform a PRC because the case is a little bigger IIRC.

It’s just a modernized 7 RM. No belt, Better throat design, less sloppy brass to chamber shoulder fit, shorter case is if one is mag length constrained, factory barrel twists and factory ammo designed around newer high bc bullets are all positives but that doesn’t mean anyone would be able to know which one they were shooting if doing it blind of the chambering.

 

[Forkyfinder]

Looks like a few supply chain issues caught up to them and its otherwise fine now. I am sure other companies making ammo have done/did this.

Yeaaaaahhhhhh......

Notice I said "consistently".


Ultra long range shooters are finding that the "marginal" twist rates are doing better when the bullet goes subsonic.
Bryan Litz mentions this in one of his Applied Ballistics videos.

I thought I remembered a thread over where the shooters are accurate about reloading the 7PRC.
Speeds are all over the place.
With different powders and barrel lengths and makes.
Seems as far as Hornady factory ammo is concerned, people are noticing that the early ammo shoots faster than the newer ammo.
Possibly the shortage of RL26. That's the theory anyways.

People also noticing that the Proof Research barrels are shooting faster.

Personally, IF I were to do a 7PRC, it would be the 7PRCW.

"However, shooters who are interested in maximizing performance at long range will need to select a twist rate that will fully stabilize the bullet, and produce an SG of 1.5 or higher." - bryan litz

Are you shooting your 7mm rem "ultra long range"? I guess that seems counter to what ive read from him.

The State of the Art in Rifle Bullet Stability

Overview The modern rifle is named for the spiral grooves cut in the barrel which impart a spin to the bullet. Spinning imparts gyroscopic stability, which is what keeps the bullet flying point forward. Longer bullets need to spin faster than shorter bullets to achieve stability. For many years...

bergerbullets.com