SERIOUS QUESTION

Michaelr

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How many of you ever participated in a poll concerning wolf reintroduction??

We hear about all these polls where even the people of Idaho, Wyoming and Montana are all for the wolf reintroduction.
I personally don't know anybody that ever participated in one of these polls.
Please post weather or not you ever participated.
The question isn't if you are for or against wolves.
It is weather or not you were ever polled?
and if you were, by whom?

I was never polled.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-10-2003 08:17: Message edited by: michaelr ]</font>
 
D

Deerslayer

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I have never been polled........but if they call you, tell them DS is PRO-wolf reintroduction
 

Michaelr

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<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Even in Idaho, the polls show that the majority of people want wolves reintroduced.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ithica,
I have asked this question on 4 different boards, and of everybody here at work and nobody has ever been polled, and nobody knows anybody who was?
I have searched the internet for a poll.
so please enlighten me on the poll you are talking about.
give me a link to see it.
I think your full of it, and you are only parroting the crap the USFWS has been telling us.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-10-2003 14:01: Message edited by: michaelr ]</font>
 

KC

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Never been polled.

Even if they did call me I would probably hang up before they got a chance to ask any questions because I would assume they were telemarketers.

KC
 

Ithaca 37

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mike, "please enlighten me on the poll you are talking about.
give me a link to see it.
I think your full of it"

It turns out you're the one who is "full of it". Here's results of one search. Do a few more and you'll probably get even more verification that you don't know what you're talking about.

Prepare to be enlightened!

Here's one of the polls:

Idaho Poll Indicates that Idahoans Want Wolves to Remain in Yellowstone

from The Spokesman-Review

"A recent poll taken in Idaho indicates that the majority of Idahoans support Yellowstone's wolves.

Of the 200 Idaho residents randomly selected to participate in the poll, 55% supported the Yellowstone and central Idaho wolf reintroduction program. Only one in three said that the wolves should be removed. 60% said they strongly believe that humans have a moral obligation to save wolves from extinction."

http://www.yellowstone.net/newspaper/news021198.htm

"Ferris acknowledges that a vocal minority among rural residents will always oppose wolf restoration. He is quick, however, to cite polls in Montana, Idaho, and Wyoming, all far more rural in nature than California, that show a majority of residents support wolf restoration efforts. And another recent poll taken in Oregon this past spring came to the same conclusion: most of the state's citizens, even in rural areas, support wolf restoration in their state. Indeed, the only group that consistently opposes wolf restoration is livestock producers."

http://www.calacademy.org/calwild/winter2000/html/wolf2.html

Even in WY more people said "Yes"

"The sample size was 816 persons. Forty-six per cent supported allowing wolves to roam outside Yellowstone, while 43 per cent did not. This is not a statistically significant difference. It would be pretty hard to devise a wolf management alternative that would please a state so divided. It is important to note that only 11 per cent were undecided or gave no opinion. This indicates to me that opinions are probably set."
http://www.forwolves.org/ralph/wywolfpoll.html

"In Montana, Wyoming, and Idaho, for example, cattle and sheep interests financed a major education effort. Yet, even here in the heart of cattle country, the public saw through the propaganda and chose the wolf."

http://www.defenders.org/wildlife/wolf/yeswolf.html

Notice the chart!!

Here's the search results:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=majority+idaho +want+wolves+poll&btnG=Google+Search

As usual, you make claims that you can't back up and I overwhelm you with verification of what I say.


When are ya gonna learn, mike?


Now you're gonna tell me you and your friends weren't polled?! Maybe you don't understand random sampling. Pollsters usually are pretty scientific about the way they conduct these polls because they don't want their credibility challenged. If that happens they don't get to stay in business.

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-10-2003 22:29: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>
 

Calif. Hunter

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I would support reintroduction if they were placed under the control of the state Fish and Game, and able to be regulated as a game animal. Unfortunately, I don't think that would happen. Look at the ban on lion hunting in California, and the bans on various forms of hunting for bear - no baiting and/or no dogs in various states. I know that the lions have had a disastrous effect on the deer population at the ranch we hunt.

The non-hunting population has this Disneyesque picture of wildlife, and if they have any say in it, it is to stop hunting. I guess they figure critters just lie down and die a peaceful death from old age in their sleep...
 

ELKCHSR

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They just can't cause problems, theres hardly a tshirt shop that isn't filled with the beutiful creatures...
 

Muledeer4me

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I have never been polled and I dont know anyone that has.
It is something I have asked other sportsmen ,local people in the small towns we visit while hunting and people at the 3-D archery shoots about ---None have been polled.
I think they only poll people comming out of down town areas ,maybe they get there list from the local starbuck's

I do know some people that were in support of the wolf,but now that they see what a pain the butt they are and how it has affected areas they hunt they have changed there mind.
After Steve and I saw a pack of wolves in the sawtooths ,I started asking around and trying to get the feel for who wanted them.
It wasnt the local people,hunter type's.
It was the campground/motel /tourest type.
I have to admit I got a kick out of seeing the pack for such a long time ,but was suprized at how little fear they showed towards us and another truck that stopped to see them.They hung around watching us .
From what I understand that whole pack was shot because of problems with them getting into trouble.
Its such a crock for the wolf and the people that have to deal with them.


Calif. Hunter ,good post.
 

Ithaca 37

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Here's a little information on random sampling.


"Perfectly Random Sampling with Markov Chains"

"In recent years there have been a large number of algorithms developed for sampling from the steady state distribution of suitably well-structured Markov chains, which require no a priori knowledge of how long the Markov chains take to get mixed. The algorithms determine on their own, during run time, how many steps to run the Markov chain. It is these algorithms that are the focus of this...."

http://dbwilson.com/exact/

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-11-2003 08:55: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>
 

Michaelr

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Ithica
Not one of those anwser my questions as to who where when. The best they do is say a state.
Even you are smart enough to know that those polls are suspect at best.
It has been shown that those polls can and are used to show exactly what you want them to show, it is all a matter of demographics.
My point is the majority of people in Idaho, Wyoming, and Montana didn't want wolves.
That is painfully obvious to those who live here, there are some people who don't care, and there are some who are pro wolf, the overwhelming majority didn't want them.
Nationaly the majority probably does.
 

Michaelr

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and in anwser to your above post.

HUH??????????? BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH
 

Ithaca 37

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Right. So every poll that shows something different than what you believe is "suspect".


Now, mike, I'm the one who's saying you're "full of it". Can you show us some links to articles that back up what you claim about the majority not wanting wolves? I'm betting you can't.

Do you suppose the people in WY are that much different than the ones in Idaho?

"The sample size was 816 persons. Forty-six per cent supported allowing wolves to roam outside Yellowstone, while 43 per cent did not. This is not a statistically significant difference. It would be pretty hard to devise a wolf management alternative that would please a state so divided. It is important to note that only 11 per cent were undecided or gave no opinion. This indicates to me that opinions are probably set."
http://www.forwolves.org/ralph/wywolfpoll.html

<FONT COLOR="#800080" SIZE="1">[ 01-11-2003 15:55: Message edited by: Ithaca 37 ]</font>
 

ELKCHSR

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The big question really is, did some polster sit in the middle of one of the cities and open a phone book and call any one that would be local from there..Did they go into the part of town that is full of college kids, who don't know any thing yet anyway. Or did they poll the people in the outlying areas that would be the ones personally impacted by all of this. I'm guessing on the first two for my guess...
The list sure wouldn't have had sportsmen or any one that actually is outside on the to call schedual..That would probably slant their polls in the wrong way from the people that are paing for it want...
 

Michaelr

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Exactly.......right on elky

Ithica,
I work in the public school system, (liberal as heck) and even among the teachers the majority would be either against it outright or they say that it was a bad idea.
One lady in particular who was heavily involved in the whole reintroduction from the start has now stated that she thinks it has turned out to be a mistake, to many wolves are being killed in control actions. and to many are "abused when they are darted and studied, have collars put on ect, ect.
 
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