Remington Ultimate Muzzleloader Performance Questions

Mako3382

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
17
I'm a muzzleloader newbie, having taken only 1 animal with a muzzleloader prior to drawing a unit 13 New mexico bull elk tag for this late season. I purchased a Remington ultimate muzzle loader and have been working on load development, but wanted to check with the more experienced muzzleloader guys. Some of the sabot manufacturers advertise 2400 fps with 200gr of 777 pellets and a 250 gr sabot. I've been averaging around 2100 fps with 200 gr pellets and 250 gr sabots, and 2302 fps with 180 gr pellets and 250 gr sabots. The gun definitely does not like the Shockwave sabots, but seems to like the Barnes. Any tricks to achieve greater velocity? Any recommendation on sabot preference for elk? Any reason to use a 300gr sabot in lieu of a 250?

I was also shocked by the amount of wind drift I'm seeing at 300 yards with only a 12-15 mph cross wind.

Thank you for any info!
 

D_Walt

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 15, 2020
Messages
269
I’ll actually be in unit 13 helping my niece on the late Muzzleloader hunt, she will be using my Remington Ultimate muzzleloader. No elk alive will notice the difference between 2300 FPS and 2400 FPS at the muzzle. Either way, you’ll be dialing or holding over 6-8 MOA at 300 yards, or 20”-28” (with a 100 yard zero).

I can get 2400 FPS out of mine with a “significant quantity” of BH209, but I have an upgraded breech plug and ignition system from Arrowhead rifles; the factory ignition system is prone to gas cutting with heavy loads of bh209. Recoil with that load is ferocious.

For my niece I’ll be loading a 300 grain bullets from Arrowhead with 85 grains by weight (approximately 120 by volume) of BH209, going to chrono tomorrow but I’m expecting 2000-2100 FPS out of that load. I would feel comfortable with that load out to 250 yards, it will still be carrying 1600 ft lbs of energy, dropping 20” and in a 10 MPH cross wind will drift about 10”.

Hopefully we get within 100 yards and just put it behind the shoulder and shoot.

Good luck on your hunt!
 

Bambistew

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 10, 2002
Messages
6,440
Location
Chugiak, AK
Loose powder usually gives a little more velocity, but unless you grow a longer barrel you won't gain much over what you're getting at 2300. Thats really fast for a muzz BTW. You can try some different sabot cups of varying diameter, polish the bore, ceramic treatment, etc. I'd be very surprised if you are even burning 200gr of powder. Shoot over a tarp and see how much is unburnt flying out the barrel. Once you get over about 140-50gr its not burning before it exits the barrel and you're just wasting powder for little to no gain in velocity. Not surprised you got higher velocity with a lower charge, one of those 50gr pellets probably just flew out the barrel before being burned.

Substantial wind drift with a light for caliber bullet is expected. Bigger heavier bullets drift way less (and have a higher BC).

Don't over think it. You really don't gain anything by shooting fast bullets. They kill by making big ass holes. Also when shooting fast bullets with low BC you really don't gain much at long range anyway if that's what you're hoping to improve. You give up a lot of energy for a slightly flatter trajectory, which you still have to adjust for. I shoot either 460 or 490gr full bore bullets with 100-110gr of powder in the 1400fps range and it kills stuff really dead. My buddy borrowed mine and killed a 350 class bull at 250 yards. The bull fell so hard he broke a front front brow tine off. I shot a caribou with mine a few years back, and he nose dived so hard he snapped his skull across the eye socket, I skull capped him with a knife. One of the craziests thing I've ever seen.
 

Mako3382

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
17
Loose powder usually gives a little more velocity, but unless you grow a longer barrel you won't gain much over what you're getting at 2300. Thats really fast for a muzz BTW. You can try some different sabot cups of varying diameter, polish the bore, ceramic treatment, etc. I'd be very surprised if you are even burning 200gr of powder. Shoot over a tarp and see how much is unburnt flying out the barrel. Once you get over about 140-50gr its not burning before it exits the barrel and you're just wasting powder for little to no gain in velocity. Not surprised you got higher velocity with a lower charge, one of those 50gr pellets probably just flew out the barrel before being burned.

Substantial wind drift with a light for caliber bullet is expected. Bigger heavier bullets drift way less (and have a higher BC).

Don't over think it. You really don't gain anything by shooting fast bullets. They kill by making big ass holes. Also when shooting fast bullets with low BC you really don't gain much at long range anyway if that's what you're hoping to improve. You give up a lot of energy for a slightly flatter trajectory, which you still have to adjust for. I shoot either 460 or 490gr full bore bullets with 100-110gr of powder in the 1400fps range and it kills stuff really dead. My buddy borrowed mine and killed a 350 class bull at 250 yards. The bull fell so hard he broke a front front brow tine off. I shot a caribou with mine a few years back, and he nose dived so hard he snapped his skull across the eye socket, I skull capped him with a knife. One of the craziests thing I've ever seen.
Thanks for the info
 

Mako3382

New member
Joined
Apr 22, 2021
Messages
17
I’ll actually be in unit 13 helping my niece on the late Muzzleloader hunt, she will be using my Remington Ultimate muzzleloader. No elk alive will notice the difference between 2300 FPS and 2400 FPS at the muzzle. Either way, you’ll be dialing or holding over 6-8 MOA at 300 yards, or 20”-28” (with a 100 yard zero).

I can get 2400 FPS out of mine with a “significant quantity” of BH209, but I have an upgraded breech plug and ignition system from Arrowhead rifles; the factory ignition system is prone to gas cutting with heavy loads of bh209. Recoil with that load is ferocious.

For my niece I’ll be loading a 300 grain bullets from Arrowhead with 85 grains by weight (approximately 120 by volume) of BH209, going to chrono tomorrow but I’m expecting 2000-2100 FPS out of that load. I would feel comfortable with that load out to 250 yards, it will still be carrying 1600 ft lbs of energy, dropping 20” and in a 10 MPH cross wind will drift about 10”.

Hopefully we get within 100 yards and just put it behind the shoulder and shoot.

Good luck on your hunt!
Thanks for the feedback. Good luck!
 

44hunter45

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 14, 2019
Messages
2,262
Location
North Idaho
Does NM require Black Powder or substitute? Now that we got the "primitive" thing out of the way, why not go smokeless?
 

Huntnut60

Member
Joined
May 26, 2020
Messages
85
I'm a muzzleloader newbie, having taken only 1 animal with a muzzleloader prior to drawing a unit 13 New mexico bull elk tag for this late season. I purchased a Remington ultimate muzzle loader and have been working on load development, but wanted to check with the more experienced muzzleloader guys. Some of the sabot manufacturers advertise 2400 fps with 200gr of 777 pellets and a 250 gr sabot. I've been averaging around 2100 fps with 200 gr pellets and 250 gr sabots, and 2302 fps with 180 gr pellets and 250 gr sabots. The gun definitely does not like the Shockwave sabots, but seems to like the Barnes. Any tricks to achieve greater velocity? Any recommendation on sabot preference for elk? Any reason to use a 300gr sabot in lieu of a 250?

I was also shocked by the amount of wind drift I'm seeing at 300 yards with only a 12-15 mph cross wind.

Thank you for any info!
Just because you can, doesn’t mean you should.
 

mdhunter

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
1,221
Location
Maryland
I was just in New Mexico for a muzzleloader elk hunt. We went to the range just to make sure everything was still on post flight. I watched a guy hit steel at 500 yards, three times in a row with a “muzzleloader“. Make no mistake…modern muzzleloader‘s have turned this season into a rifle hunt.
 

David658

Member
Joined
Oct 15, 2021
Messages
72
I was just in New Mexico for a muzzleloader elk hunt. We went to the range just to make sure everything was still on post flight. I watched a guy hit steel at 500 yards, three times in a row with a “muzzleloader“. Make no mistake…modern muzzleloader‘s have turned this season into a rifle hunt.
Well put. The intent of the season, originally, was to allow the use of traditional black powder firearms in a special season. Modern "muzzleloaders" violate the spirit of the ML season. But, it is legal, so more power to ya.
 

hank4elk

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 8, 2015
Messages
4,829
Location
SW NM
I'm pretty much with Cush on this one,but it is NM he was talking about.

It's also called a Muzzleloader Season,not primitive weapons.They are different.
13 has primitive weapon name but it's bow & MZ. Sabots,scopes and BH209 allowed.

I've hunted 13 with my TC Omega scoped w/BH and 250gr barnes sabots. 200 yards is what I hit & zeroed for but it is not the same as a rifle hunt to me. It's a get within 100 hunt to me. My MZ hunting.

I have heard the stories & tales of 400+ yard doings. I'll stay miles away from them.
 
Caribou Gear

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
97,441
Messages
1,484,726
Members
30,660
Latest member
CruiserBill
Top